War Weight Changes for Clash on TH11 update - December 2015 changes...

[blombardo]

Do you know the post-bowler update weight of just the Eagle Artillery?
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The best place to seek this info would be in MiniMax Savage. That clan was most hurt by the recent update... I imagine they have all these numbers.

IF we could still CANCEL new construction it would be easy to figure out the weights... without that trick - I personally refuse to risk ruining my accounts with any more tests like this...

I imagine supercell was more interested in preventing us from knowing weights -- than wanting to stop us from 'renting' defenses in clan wars...


Defenseless bases that add a Queen -- will not get a 1k weight increase... they will get a SEVEN thousand weight increase... 6x punishment in weight...

If we use that as a guide -- a defenseless th11 adding a (normally) 6k eagle -- could raise you up as high as 36k points... (bringing you from a th3 mirror to a th7 mirror with just one new defense)

This is just a guess... but I imagine supercell wants to punish people... so it will be a sliding scale based on your current weight -- adjusted by what the game thinks your ACTUAL weight SHOULD be -- with some random punishment to try and bring you closer to that 'proper' weight.

[littledoctor]

FYI, I found a possible answer. Using http://cocrating.briztimqwo.com/calcdef.php I put in the values for max TH10, plus a single level 1 eagle, and it reported a defense weight of 104k and offense weight of 92k. I am not sure how this calculator relates defense/offense weight to the weight reported by gold storages, but that gives the eagle a possible range of 8k to 14k, by subtracting the max TH10 weight of 90k.

This is plausible, but holy cow, does this make me not want to ever get one of those.

[blombardo]

I have no clue what that link is that you posted; nothing there but a chat log with people complaining about the site being broken/ calculator down... whichever the case may be-- theres not rhyme or reason to even consider attempting to calculate a separate offense /vs / defense weight -- if such a separation exists in game its impossible to see with human eyes--- and - I've proven -that some offensive things actually appear as gold in the base on war day... So -- offense and defense appear there... as far as any human can tell by looking in game...


-All of our clan accounts - almost 30 out of 50 are hybrids -- every war our attack /offense power goes higher and higher... and our weight stays pretty much the same; minor increases... Every war our matches get easier and easier -- our enemies all stay about the same weight / as they have always been...

So - in essence -- offense upgrades do not bring harder matches... they just let you win easier.

[littledoctor]

I believe they used a statistical analysis of many different bases across multiple clans. Hardcore.

Supercell says that they take offense into account. Before the March update, it made up 50% of the war weight calculation. Now it is less than 50%. The fact that it did (and does) not make up 50% of the gold offered during battle day is strong evidence that the gold offered during battle day is only an approximation of the actual weight used in war matchmaking. But, clans that do arranged wars use gold offered as their measure, and they do succeed in matching each other, so it is clearly a close approximation (especially now that offense matters less).

[blombardo]

Before the March update, it made up 50% of the war weight calculation. Now it is less than 50%. The fact that it did (and does) not make up 50% of the gold offered during battle day is strong evidence that the gold offered during battle day is only an approximation of the actual weight used in war matchmaking.

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I've never seen any proof that supercell ever stated in the exact wording those #'s that you quoted. I've seen many players guess; and calculate and hypothesize...

It's true that I dont know - in fact - nobody but staff could know - aside from the one time that the game code was decrypted and players used that info for a temporary weight list (that was also hotly debated)


Supercell simply said that it takes offense into account -- they have never hinted to any number or percentage on any thing; the most specific they have ever been is in the most recent patch where they said they would increase weights on 'high level defense and offensive units' (aka punish a low weight engineered base with really high weights for the xbow/inferno/eagle/and queen /warden)

Generally they - must - ignore 95% of all offensive upgrades... Why else would a level 1 queen have the same weight as a level 12? (I keep looking for weight increases but... none have happened on my queen test account)

-We have 30 accounts out of 50- many are reaching th9 - max level research on many of the offensive troops... those low weight th9's still bring th6 to 8 mirrors -- just as they did when they were weaker on research... Adding offensive power - is NOT increasing their weight in gold -- or bringing any harder enemies on the other side... Every war just gets easier and easier for us to get a perfect on....

The war matches have been relatively even - as our enemies in recent wars have at least had the ability to get a perfect back on us - however - in most cases - the enemy top 2 to 4 are the only ones with strong research - we have almost 30 with strong (max loons/ level 6 archers / high spells/ high dark troops) So i tend to believe that Offense - is about 5 to 10% of weight in match making... If you count HEROES as offense (they are also defense) maybe 15% of weight... certainly not much higher... 85% of the matching system is defense- by my guess.

[littledoctor]

I've never seen any proof that supercell ever stated in the exact wording those #'s that you quoted.

It was in the From the Dev's Desk prior to the recent matchmaking update:

http://forum.supercell.net/showthrea...rs-Matchmaking

Defensive progress will be playing a much bigger role in Clan Wars matchmaking after the update. Previously, the system placed equal weight between offensive (army) and defensive (village) progress, allowing for confusing war matchups between players with relatively over-strong or over-weak defenses. Now, war matchmaking will factor defensive progress much more heavily into every calculation to help to keep War Bases better balanced "in lane."

At one time I thought that we could estimate offensive war weight by looking at recommended target at the very beginning of battle day, but that is just a guess, and there has been other evidence since then that this is not a very reliable way to even approximate it. And I do completely believe your observations that some offensive changes do affect gold offered.

I only have two accounts where I am attempting to game offensive war weight, and the method is basically the same for both: I'm not unlocking or upgrading troops I don't intend to use. I don't expect this to make much of a difference, but you never know.

[blombardo]

I'm not unlocking or upgrading troops I don't intend to use. I don't expect this to make much of a difference, but you never know.

if you avoid unlocking dragons -- that saves 1k weight. (max dragons would be 5k total)

pekkas add zero weight --


Be0\yond that - minions add no weight - hogs add 2k -sometimes - valks add 1k -sometimes - and the rest of the dark troops all add no weight at all.
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I like how supercell is attempting to stop 'hyper optimized bases' from getting an advantage in war... All my bases are still hyper optimized and doing better every war...


"Additionally, Clan Wars matchmaking has been fitted with new routines aimed at better balancing entire teams, rather than just individual lanes. It will place greater emphasis on matching the top of the war map, and less emphasis on matching the bottom."

-In other words -- all those town hall 10 defenseless bases hovering on the bottom.. with 240 camps 35 castle and all max troops... -- will not count much in yur war match; ♥♥♥♥ .. awesome... for me (and anyone else using that trick)

I hesitate to even talk about this anymore in the forums; if too many people do this then supercell will surely continue to try and break our awesome system of winning...




-Minor update; adding an inferno tower to a lower than should be account (38k weight th10= matching to a th7 in war) -will add 13k weight - bringing it up to mid th8 mirrors instead of th7.

[Micker99]

I just faced a base that was a TH11. It had all pink walls, level 10 archer towers, level 11 cannons(one level 10),level 6 wizard towers(one level 5), level 2 xbows, level 1 and 2 infernos, level 7 mortars, level 6 ADs, Level 9AQ and level 6 KING!! and level 6 teslas, but he had a Level 1 Eagle. His base weight was 101k!!!!!!

My TH11 base has level 12/13 ATs/cannons, level 7/8 mortars, level 7/8 wizard towers, level 3/4 infernos, Max ADs/teslas, Level 3 xbows, max heroes/GW, Lego/lava walls, but I didn't build the EA, extra Xbow, cannon or wizard tower. My base weight is 89k lol!!

I mean his base was a joke 3 star, took me 1:20sec and he weighs 12k more than me, because he has the EA and extra Xbow/cannon/WT basically. He got 38% on my base. I figured his base would be around mid 80's at the most. Man that EA is HEAVY!! I think it got off one round of shots before I took it out lol.

[blombardo]

Minor notes --

Friendly challenge show your weight... so it was convenient to start an upgrade and see your new war weight instantly...

Stupidcell devs CHANGED IT... now weight will not show up until the thing is FINISHED...

They really want you to be screwed after the fact so you can't find the weights and cancel things to engineer your accounts just right...


Follow the #'s on my guide - they are all pretty close still.


Baby Drags -= No weight

Miners - unsure

Skeleton spell - unsure

WARDEN added to a defenseless account - 5k (slightly higher weight as punishment for skipping defenses)

Still havent figured out walls perfectly... town hall 3's first set of walls - at level 10 lava - are still 1k weight... I belive if I add the th4 walls it will add 1k more... Its 6k total for all 275 walls - only took them to level 10 so far... The point I'm making -- is if you are defenseless - build enough walls to surround your cannon - and keep upgrading them... it will NOT add any new weight - and you will NOT waste all that gold...

[sarbsandhu]

At TH8 I stopped last canon upgrade to hide war weight , my war weight was 54k
upgraded to th9 bought tesla and AD my ww gone up by 2k , and now with 100skull and 150lvl9 walls , all lvl2 Spring traps my war weight is 58k , don't know that my AQ added the weight or hogs lvl5 or giant lvl6 added that or traps /walls , right now Heroea at 12-12 golem 4 and still 58k
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