I think this is interesting and would love to read your "math" write up. Also, please include your thoughts on all of your altsOriginally Posted by Sservis
I think this is interesting and would love to read your "math" write up. Also, please include your thoughts on all of your alts
Once the proper numbers, part of the math and real evidence was presented, all the maxers suddenly died. Haha sservis is a champion !!!
I am also a fellow rusher and I cant tell you how many times Ive tried to make people see the light... If you know what your doing rushing will always be more efficient than maxing. It does make me glad that there is more and more of an acceptance of smart rushing throughout the forums, back when I went to th9 about 8 months ago at lvl 60 rushing was for the most part looked down upon but thankfully many fine clashers such as those above are helping to change that.
Just one last point to make clear: rushing is more efficient, no debate there. But just because this is true doesn't make maxing a waste of time if the player enjoys the act of maxing for reasons stated in my post on page 4. I find the biggest argument for rushing over maxing is one of time/efficiency. If you take time out of the equation, then maxing is a very viable way to enjoy the journey of this game.Here are my initial thoughts on why these are not a big deal to me. My alt account approach isn't for everyone and I do agree that there is a lot of interesting gameplay at TH6, TH8, TH9, and TH10 (mass dragons at TH7 is too easy/boring)
You're comparing unequal playing time. In 3 months, I have an attack at TH9. The Maxer takes about 7 months to get their first attack to where I am (their [go]holo is very strong TH9 + day 15 with Loon 6/queen/4th spell/220,30 space/etc). However, unless it takes me more than 4 months to level a different attack, I'm still ahead. By the time I reach 7 months played, I'll have multiple armies maxed and be more resilient to gameplay changes. [you're absolutely right, I am purposely comparing unequal playing time, which in itself is an argument to max out a base.......the "what's the rush?" argument. I am in no way trying to say maxing in more efficient, it will NEVER be more efficient than smart/calculated rushing. If any maxer is trying to win an efficiency race, they will lose. My point is that many maxers want to enjoy every aspect of every TH, and are not concerned with getting everything the fastest. So long as builders are always working, time is technically not wasted, as you'll need to do those upgrade eventually anyways if the end goal of a rusher and maxer is the same....... maxed TH10 base (until TH11 comes)]
It's impossible for the rusher to lose this comparison [again, I'm not debating time vs. time, anyone wanting a high level raid faster should definitely rush, but you can't "rush" the enjoyment of sitting back, looking at your maxed base and smiling at its beauty lol. Well, unless you gem the ♥♥♥♥ out of it. But even then you're still maxing technically.] (total lab time is same for both players, and the specialized approach is likely to get to the good stuff sooner than the generalist) unless some of the rusher TH9 upgrades are invalidated and turned into wasted time. To the extent that they don't need every troop upgraded, the rusher may still come out ahead.
ie I may have wasted 10 days on Lava Hound 2 if it's nerfed, while the maxer postpones that upgrade until the end of TH9 and gains ground early in TH9. However, if the new attack doesn't need dragons, I still have saved 17 there, still ahead by 7 net, etc)
I look forward to the day GobHeDraVaPe is a thing (the troops I've skipped and plan to keep skipped)
AQ25 at TH9 is 122.5 days to play off your 50+ heros. That is a minimum of 122.5 days after the maxer reaches TH9 (6-7 months). So they'll have the AQ at the required level no sooner than 10-11 months into playing the game. One of the reasons I rushed was specifically to qualify for top tier guilds sooner without lots and lots of gem usage. It is easier to hit any combined hero mark if you start on it sooner, rather than effectively capping the levels at BK10/AQ0 in TH8 and below. [that's fair, I have spent under $20 on gems in over 2 years of playing. But the point about top tier guilds was that some want maxed TH7s, 8s, 9s, even 10s before joining, which a rusher will never ever achieve except TH10 one day if they stick it out that long. prior to being maxed, they may have you join one of their sister clans to develop, then join back into the main clan once you are maxed or very close to maxed. Then once you upgrade your TH, back down to a sister clan you go. This is just an example. The majority of clan families don't work this way.]
Alt Accounts. Who says there can be only one? [you're absolutely right about alt accounts. But please keep in mind not everyone has time for alt accounts (particularly adults with families/full-time work). One dedicated account already takes up a lot of time and a lot of clashers have real-life obligations that don't allow for multiple accounts to be made/played. If you are only going to have one account, there's a bit more incentive to maxing to enjoy all aspects of the game rather than rushing and missing out on less popular offensive attack styles and defensive game play.]
I do agree that each TH has it's own flavor and missing out is a shame.
I started a bunch of Sservis - # (minus num) accounts shortly after I started. They were targetted to be terminal at different TH level. They're mostly rusher - 2, not quite as extreme as my main, rusher - 3.
I'm going to round a few of them into TH8's, some into TH9's, and a few TH10's or TH11's (it's coming) or maybe they'll all be max at THMAX (Sservis - 8 is about to hit TH7 and didn't stop at TH2) I'm going to keep the lights on and the lab working at least. [that's a lot of accounts!
I am maxing. I'm aiming my main account to the max at the maximum level of play and my alts to interesting stopping points along the way. I get a little bit of the interesting places as my main shoots past, and more once my alts get there.
kimchi, of whozonbeer | TH11 | Lvl147
You don't need to convince anyone why rushing is the way to go and you don't need anyone's acceptance. If you enjoy it, just do it. And you can 3-star their maxed th7 bases with your th9 laloonion army, just to prove a pointI am also a fellow rusher and I cant tell you how many times Ive tried to make people see the light... If you know what your doing rushing will always be more efficient than maxing. It does make me glad that there is more and more of an acceptance of smart rushing throughout the forums, back when I went to th9 about 8 months ago at lvl 60 rushing was for the most part looked down upon but thankfully many fine clashers such as those above are helping to change that.
kimchi, of whozonbeer | TH11 | Lvl147
To be clear, we are in agreement, pretty much completely. If I had one only account and could advise myself with what I know now, I would rush to TH8, stay there until I had fully mastered the attacks, likely dragons (easier to level) followed by hogs and variants. Then I would level to TH9, learn attacks while leveling heros, eventually apply to a hardcore clan and hang out at TH9 max for a good while. Probably somewhere in this journey I would create a second account to replace the first at TH9 max and move the first account up to TH10.
Multiple accounts can work nicely with hardcore guilds as you can play leapfrog. Level one while warring on another. Never having to pause or do both at the same time on any one account. It also makes it possible to mostly skip gemming of heros in TH9 since they level outside the spotlight.
Sservis; Start Date: 09 Jan 2015What is Rushing?
I have the two accounts and barely enough time for both lol. amazing that you can handle so many!
I don't know how much handling I manage.
1 rushed TH9, want to wall farm hard, will cut into other playing time (walls here versus alts)
The alts are mostly low level, early TH7 and below, they're being slow played with only 3 builders rather than the 4 you'd normally have by early in TH7 (some gems may have gone to boosting at times)
Sservis; Start Date: 09 Jan 2015What is Rushing?
Nicely thought out. Actually, I remember last year thinking about making a post when my base (as a TH9) had the same amount of builder time in it as a max TH8. It was clear that my base was a strong (though still months from maxed) TH9. There were no obvious weaknesses to the base and I was reasonably far into upgrading my queen (along with other offensive perks of being a TH9). While I did not max TH9, I came fairly close - had I stayed longer I would have started to have idle builders while heroes upgraded and I continued upgrading troops.
As a solo player, I completely subscribe to rush -1 or -2. That was the basis for my guide (to growing fast). As someone managing an "open recruiting" war clan, I have a little more nuanced view and I do see how others can get into the max only mentality. Generally, I have had more bad luck with rushed base players in war and as I got more aggressive in screening them out, the better things went. Is this an issue with rushing? I don't think so. Instead I believe it is an issue of correlation.
If you will forgive the tangent, it reminds an observation about what is more important for determining if a production car will be in rollover accident - two doors or differences in physics (center of gravity, etc). It turns out two doors has a stronger correlation, i.e. the behavior one sees with drivers of two-door cars that leads to more rollovers than the physics of the car.
Similarly, my observation is that really excellent rushers are an asset, but among the population of people with bases that are rushed (never mind preemie), I find more of them are not skilled attackers as well. It is a shame too.
So, in the end, I do believe in thoughtful rushing and I think that done really well rushed bases can be an asset in war, but as I manage a group of people I don't know in real life and have modest means by which to communicate with them, I find that keeping rushing to the "minus 1" level helps keep people screwing up the clan. It seems that the amount of time it takes to properly rush to TH9 is still not long enough to teach most people to fight well. :-)
Last time I thought to edit it: Lvl 141, GG: 1.1B, EE: 1.2B, HH: 6.0M.
Join me at the war clan Burning Soul (#2vjrr802). See our homepage for rules and expectations of the clan.
OP: what they do is their choice. Besides, the more rushers there are, the more easy loot for us
02/01/15: TH9 | Level 109 | GG: 910m | HH: 2.5m | BK: 16->17 AQ: 21->22 | 142/250 lava
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