I dont want to hear about lvl 9 TH loot penalty...

[Dave643]

♥♥♥♥♥ that is what majority of TH 9ers do because even with TH 9 troops it is difficult to attack another th 9 without having a negative effect on resource. What I'm suggesting is an alternative! And you keep insisting people to rush to TH 9 when you know people did not start this game at the same damn time, you said yourself it takes a long time and a lot of effort. This bonus I'm talking about attacking a TH 9 would be great and would also apply for a TH9er attacking another TH9er unless all you want to do is attack and farm lower level a Town Hallers, which you probably do along with other TH9ers. Even with added bonus for attacking a TH 9 a lot of people will still skip a town hall 9 with a decent setup because of the great defenses a TH 9 has. The league is great but it will only be great for town hall 9ers because the fact that a TH 9 has the ability of being able to keep a higher trophy than other town halls, as it should be.

I am a TH 8 my meat is TH8 and 9 the amount of loot is ok because I keep a relatively high trophies count to avoid raiding lower players it slows my game but that is my choice supercell is trying to please a broad player base from casual to hard core farmers, you just need to let supercell balance things.

if they came in heavy on the league bonuses and had to reduce them their would be a big out cry.
They have set the leagues up now they need them to work, you TH9 player need 1 billion gold just for the top 2 levels of wall I think the league bonuses should make that easier if they are set right.

gold and elix production in collectors then get a league buff you start making more gold elix from raids as collectors can be the most lucrative source.
its not the loot bonuses that are at fault it is the lack of loot if I had loads of loot at TH8 like you all say I should have 6 million in my stores even at a 80% loot penalty you TH 9 could get 200k easy plus my collectors

the games a pyramid you TH 9 are at the top if Th 8 don't feed you don't feed if TH 7 don't feed TH 8 don't feed it goes down the game to TH 5 ish
TH 8 is TH 9 pray you need Fat TH 8's to get fat TH 9's
you also need 4 times as many fat TH8's than TH9's as you need billions of gold at TH9. A lot of them billions have to pass through TH 8 hands to get to you.
the problem is their are to many TH 9 players chasing the gold. You bleed us casual Th8 dry we pack up even less gold going up the food chains

So don't complain to hard about loot penalties as if we pack up all you are left with is our collectors to feed on which at best give you 400k a day no Th8 players farming TH 7's no new gold for Th 9 players.
And we need a few 100 million gold for our upgrades as well.
the collectors maxed at TH 7, they should buff they in the leagues for TH 8's and 9's and force players not to upgrade to TH 9 until a set trophies count to stop more hungry mouths at the top where their is biggest demand for gold but the least available.

[dahimi]

I am a TH 8 my meat is TH8 and 9 the amount of loot is ok because I keep a relatively high trophies count to avoid raiding lower players it slows my game but that is my choice supercell is trying to please a broad player base from casual to hard core farmers, you just need to let supercell balance things.

if they came in heavy on the league bonuses and had to reduce them their would be a big out cry.
They have set the leagues up now they need them to work, you TH9 player need 1 billion gold just for the top 2 levels of wall I think the league bonuses should make that easier if they are set right.

gold and elix production in collectors then get a league buff you start making more gold elix from raids as collectors can be the most lucrative source.
its not the loot bonuses that are at fault it is the lack of loot if I had loads of loot at TH8 like you all say I should have 6 million in my stores even at a 80% loot penalty you TH 9 could get 200k easy plus my collectors

the games a pyramid you TH 9 are at the top if Th 8 don't feed you don't feed if TH 7 don't feed TH 8 don't feed it goes down the game to TH 5 ish
TH 8 is TH 9 pray you need Fat TH 8's to get fat TH 9's
you also need 4 times as many fat TH8's than TH9's as you need billions of gold at TH9. A lot of them billions have to pass through TH 8 hands to get to you.
the problem is their are to many TH 9 players chasing the gold. You bleed us casual Th8 dry we pack up even less gold going up the food chains

So don't complain to hard about loot penalties as if we pack up all you are left with is our collectors to feed on which at best give you 400k a day no Th8 players farming TH 7's no new gold for Th 9 players.
And we need a few 100 million gold for our upgrades as well.
the collectors maxed at TH 7, they should buff they in the leagues for TH 8's and 9's and force players not to upgrade to TH 9 until a set trophies count to stop more hungry mouths at the top where their is biggest demand for gold but the least available.

How do we bleed you dry? It's not difficult to construct a TH8 base that will be largely ignored by TH9. Furthermore, you can easily recover from a total loss by raiding one TH7.

The penalty ensures that we can't effectively raid TH7, which make up a lot of TH8's prey. Perhaps not yours, but I think it is naive to assume you are the typical case. TH7 represents easy pickings for TH8, and they sit at 1200 trophies raiding TH7 all day long.

Furthermore starting with TH7 you have access to collectors which will completely mitigate losses. You simply need to build them.

Your 4x figure is off too. Ever consider why as buildings become more expensive, their build times increase? It's not just a revenue mechanism. It gives you additional time to raid resources at a constant rate in order to feed the rising costs.

In fact TH9s raid fewer resources per day because our armies are larger, more time consuming to build, and raids often require full army assaults. Typical rates at TH9 are 500k - 1m an hour. TH8 and TH7 can raid far more.

There's also a lot fewer of us relative to lower TH levels.

[solitude]

Lol butthurt? Be sure to read the whole thread again before jumping in and flaming me on one post, I was saying I was TH 6 hypothetically. You obviously have a selective flame response to one post that has offended you in a way and no comprehension to what we are arguing/reasoning about. Try again...

And don't you understand my sentence saying all it takes are skills, planning, time and dedication? Increasing the loot penalty to the already miserable loot penalty of th9 is simply an easy way out. Why not ask SC to make it such that th9 can only attack single player maps UNTIL everyone in COC is maxed at th8? Doesn't that makes Game much easier like what you are asking SC to do? Come on up to th9 and tell me if you change your opinion. No you won't come up to th9 because you "haven't" max all your defense and most importantly, th9 are penalized too much.

[Dave643]

How do we bleed you dry? It's not difficult to construct a TH8 base that will be largely ignored by TH9 I don't ever get ignored, I have full level 7 walls I even get raided with only 200 k in my stores. Furthermore, you can easily recover from a total loss by raiding one TH7. You assume the pickings now are as good as when you were a TH 8 if I break shield I just lose another 200 k to TH9 players.

The penalty ensures that we can't effectively raid TH7, which make up a lot of TH8's prey. Perhaps not yours, but I think it is naive to assume you are the typical case. TH7 represents easy pickings for TH8, and they sit at 1200 trophies raiding TH7 all day long. You assume I have time to be constantly on with no breaks wrong mr average has a job

Furthermore starting with TH7 you have access to collectors which will completely mitigate losses no if we get raided once or twice we may as well have none we get no income to spend from them. You simply need to build them. I have! I get little to no income from them it gets stolen in raids I get raided at least 2x a day losing 200k each time.

Your 4x figure is off too. Ever consider why as buildings become more expensive, their build times increase? It's not just a revenue mechanism. It gives you additional time to raid resources at a constant rate in order to feed the rising costs. You imply you can keep multiple builder busy? And it just basic maths if I steal a million spend 75 % that leaves you only 250k so you need 4 players to attack to get your million see basic maths. But you need a billion so you needs millions a day say you do 10 raids a day 1 hr apart you need 200k a time to make 2 million a day, and not be raided 10 times in a day, because that what would happen to me if I attacked 10 times I get raided 10 times pointless.

In fact TH9s raid fewer resources per day because our armies are larger, more time consuming to build, and raids often require full army assaults. Typical rates at TH9 are 500k - 1m an hour you said you only raid around once or. Twice (in another post) an hr because of troop build times. I think I want to be were you are getting 250k-500k raids. TH8 and TH7 can raid far more. but do you get raided when you are unshielded we do with out fail within a few seconds it seems if I raided once a hour I would be raided once a hour, any time I am not active i get raided without fail. You TH 9 may be able to sit most of the day without a shield as by your own admission most attack lower TH players Because it to hard to raid your peers at TH9

There's also a lot fewer of us relative to lower TH levels yes but you are only feeding on fat TH 7 and mostly 8 and week 9 that is not a big player base not if you all want to raid 500k - 1000k an hour.

It has all to do with what you think is normal.
i haven't time to play much.

You wrongly assume a average player is like you he may not be like me but, supercell has to balance the game for all player types I am your meat a player with max collectors and at TH8 my base is pretty good most TH9 players with level 6 troops struggle to get 50% it depends on the player and if they get my TH building, hence my high trophy count , I actually move my TH nearer the edge of my base to increase shield triggers to protect from having multiple attacks from TH9 which I can then lose 600k in a few hours. You always assume that we only get attacked once if we have getting on for 2 million in storage's every time we break shield we lose 200 k more if we defence win, if I as am a casual player Breaking my shield to attack more i just get raided more you idea of the game only works for players that can spend time in 2-4 hr blocks.
but a game that alienates casual player will die and loot will further dry up for you, as you rely on us lower players moving loot up to your TH 9's reaches.( may all ready be happening hence supercell trying to fix helping lower TH players giving you extra from leagues to higher levels)
have you ever thought that the shortage of loot is because the TH 7-8 casual player base is dropping because TH9 players are killing TH7-8 casual players games, which is happening.
the same can happen at any TH level if the amount of players at any TH level gets out of balance to the food chain below. Again the pyramid nature of the loot tree.
The game it fluid, their is loot for active farmers out their but not for casual gamers it depends on the balance of each at each TH level. To few active farmer players at TH 7 the TH 8 starves. If all TH 7 players go casual just spend on walls their is no loot for TH8 its just game mechanics. Same for TH 9 if all TH8 player were like me your gold would dry up over night. I can keep my gold below 500k at all times if I want to. And force you to spend big on army's to get it!
that most likely what's happening now any way.

[Noxy]

but that is sort of my point... there should be NO complaints from level 9 TH about any sort of loot penalty because of the huge disparity between level 8 & 9 TH's. Level 8 TH should be rewarded for attacking a level 9 TH with more maximum loot and level 9 TH should have a reduction in the amount of loot they get from attacking lower level TH's

No argument from me about defenses available to TH9's and I don't believe I have read any complaints on the subject. But when you upgrade to TH9 you'll realise how much more expensive (in resources) the game becomes to play. Bare in mind I'm not complaining and have taken the loot penalty in my stride and accepted that things will just take a bit longer to accomplish.

[Dave643]

I would like to add I love this game and have to intention to stopping playing

the maths tree of the game

say you get 200k per raid to raid 500-1000k and hour you have to win around 5 players to get that.
so for every player raiding he needs to feed on 5 lower players. them 5 on 5 lower still and so on.
4 to 1 is a min for each TH level to feed fully.
so you raid 6 hours a day and 4 times an hour 24 battles a day.
so for 50,000 TH 9 players you need to attack 600,000 TH8 players you have to raid each 2x when their stores have 1 million plus gold to raid your total 400k , it increases to 7.2 million TH7 players needed to feed TH 8 players and so on,
TH7 need 86.4 million lower TH to pray on
this is why gold is tight at the top not loot penalties.

if the game gets top heavy which i think it is, it gets out of balance because their are to many TH9 players. It doesn't matter if they are upgraded or not they feed from the same players base.

you just have to hope supercell fix the leagues loot system
if their are 100,000 TH 9 players its 1.2million TH8,14.4million TH 7, 172.8million lower TH than 7 needed in the game you can see how it can get to top heavy fast.
Even if you allow for each player getting raided twice a day for 200k .
Supercell needs to manage players TH levels to keep the balances in place,
or change the loot system all together which I think they are trying to do with leagues. Also casual players like me don't count as food as I can spend all my gold on walls and never have over 500k in my stores.
so you need 600k of active TH 8 players. With over 1 million gold to make your targets.
good luck and clash on

[DeathKnell]

As Dahimi mentioned earlier in the thread SC are heading in the right direction with the trophy leagues. I don't think they're offering enough of a bonus to stop the farmers attacking lower levels completely but it is a good start. Someone also mentioned boosting collectors more the higher the trophy range is and I think that would be a great addition.
Seriously, farmers are entitled to their form of FarmVille gameplay (I guess), but Romeox, just because there is a vocal hardcore farming group on these forums that have ruined the game for the likes of yourself you shouldn't class all of us TH9'ers as being the same. A lot of us like the competitive aspect of the game and don't like to bash on weak lower level targets that have no chance of winning a revenge (or even gaining the stolen resources back maybe).
I can't understand why SC has let this go on for so long, I mean it's not like farmers are the cash cow or anything. I think loot penalties v lower TH's was a great idea it should even increase to further discourage farmers. But, and this is a big BUT no penalty should be applied to revenges. If a TH7/8 wants to hit a TH9 that hasn't managed to get on for a couple of days and raid their collectors/resources they should fully expect payback via revenge. It's kind of like Switzerland attacking Russia then expecting no major comebacks, it's just not feasible.

I've seen both sides of this argument as I tried farming for a little while after prematurely rushing my TH9 when it was released, I just didn't like the idea of beating up the little guys, some people can live like that but it wasn't for me.

There are some good valid arguments from both sides here and I think SC would do well to have a read through, putting all biases aside. The main reasonable points that I have seen here are:

Increase loot penalties against lower TH's, but remove penalties from revenge.

Loot bonuses I am undecided on personally as I've never had them but I see no problem with lower TH's having them against higher TH's so long as they understand that the higher TH has no loot penalty when revenging.

Apply higher bonuses to resource collectors as trophy count gets higher to encourage people to progress. Gemmers are still going to gem whether or not.

TH9 2289 trophies and only targeting TH9's since last year. My town could have been better otherwise, but my sense of gameplay wouldn't have =]

[Thomos]

Your argument is that TH9 gets so much great stuff that they shouldn't have a problem with the loot penalty. If that stuff is so great and the loot penalty is such a non factor because of it, why aren't you rushing to TH9 to start building some of that great stuff?

Clearly that stuff would only make you stronger and less likely to be crushed right?

Why won't you get equally crushed now by other TH8s and TH9s? How does a wider pool of upgrades being available to you make you more likely to be crushed? Why not upgrade to TH9 and continue the same TH8 upgrades with maybe a little of the TH9 stuff like an xbow thrown into the mix?

Your argument makes no sense whatsoever.

You obviously don't have a town hall lv 9, I got mine from lv 7, ie, I saved/stole the 3 mil almost before my TH lv 8 was built. I am just building my first Xbow now.....6months later, why ? Upgrade your TH to lv 9 and find out. I'm all for remove ing penalty on revenge attackes but would prefer to be able to raid more in the first place!

[TimTheEnchanter]

You obviously don't have a town hall lv 9, I got mine from lv 7, ie, I saved/stole the 3 mil almost before my TH lv 8 was built. I am just building my first Xbow now.....6months later, why ? Upgrade your TH to lv 9 and find out. I'm all for remove ing penalty on revenge attackes but would prefer to be able to raid more in the first place!

I can confirm that you are correct, dahimi actually has a town hall 5!!!

[Nitto1320i]

With all the tangible additions in this update geared towards level 9 TH, they pretty much made it a no brainer to rush to get to there. As if 2 X-bows, archer queen, DE drill, gold & elixir storage and a tesla werent enough, now they get another wizard tower. TH level 9 wont have to be worried about being raided by lower levels due to the sheer amount of defenses available. Level 5 troops stand no chance against a level 9 TH that has all of these defenses and one shot kills with maxxed defenses. No wait... there is the golem to even everything out!! :/ Level 9 TH's have no reason to complain about any loot penalty with all the stuff they have at their disposal vs. other TH's. If anything, they should have increased the loot penalty for attacking lower levels made more loot available for lower TH's attacking higher ones

I do like some of the other time decreases on the mines and pumps and the troops. I havent had a chance to try leagues yet.

its called the "Next button". lol no offense but i think th9 should be superior to th8. evidently my th8 can still go heads on with th9(max defense).