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[Beerking]

That is how you see it.

Maybe let me explain how I see it.

Farmer
1) A farmer leave his TH outside
2) He hope someone will come and snipe his TH and go
3) If its successful; Gain: 12 hours shield Loss: 1000 gold/elixir and some trophy (insignificance)

Champ
1) A champ leave his clan
2) He hope his clan mates or friends find him to give him cheap shield
3) If its successful; Gain : some trophies Loss: some resources in the process (insignificance)


Both did something with an intention of achieving something that will benefits oneself. Both had done something that is not what the game intended them to do (of course, the farmers will say otherwise...Lol)

That is how I see what both is doing. I am not condemning the champs nor the farmers. Both exploit the game mechanics to the fullest to advance the game to their most desired position(Trophys for champs and resources for farmers).

But what I don't get is why one side can relentlessly blame the other side when they are doing something similar in nature (Of course the farmers will again say its not similar)

Going by my definition, its similar but going by yours, it might not.

Not trying to prove anything here but just trying to show that there are other ways of looking at things and insisting/proving on your way is right may not be always right...

I appreciate what you're doing, it's Always important with both sides.
I would however want to know where my comparison is unfair? and if it's not, would farmers be considered chéáters for sharing their Resources? You know what I Think.

To compare the two things you have to consider the win/win cause it wouldn't happen if it wasn't like that. A win/win for a Trophy hunter is leaving Resources outside and a farmer spotting him, that's all fair and Square.

Besides, SC has tried to stop cheap shielding with the "no revenge" thing. If SC wanted to stop farming with TH outside they would simply make you lose 100K of each for losing the TH, apparently they don't Think it's chéáting since they havn't done anything to stop it.

[lim81]

Sorry i should have been more clear when I said intentional and obvious.Cheap shielding is intentionally exploiting the game for you to win when I said TH outside is opposite i meant that its not to keep you on top,but rather to drop.they are both intentional except one is bad sportsmanship and the other is an accepted and fair way to play.You cant deny that its unfair to use cheap shielding techniques.why should you be on top of the leaderboards because you know people to do it for you?And if i dont know anyone then i cant get the same so i cant progress as far as you?Comparing using an outside TH to cheap shielding is just being pedantic and ♥♥♥♥.Yes maybe technically they are both exploits but to compare the 2 is just outright stupid as they do opposite things at totally different levels of play.How is win/win ♥♥?You dont have to take the TH and not go for resources,its an option to you so it is in fact win/win.Where as cheap shielding takes you out completely and nobody can take your trophies because you have exploited and taken away the fairness.At least for an outside TH you still have the option of doing either resources or trophies or even both.

Sorry for being ♥♥♥♥...Lol

Farmers with TH outside have a better rate of getting taken out by TH snipes. And they do take the base out for 12 hours. That is a fact.

Champs leaving the clans with the hope that their clan mates finding them have a lower rates. And they do also take out the base for 12 hours. That is also a fact.

Farmers with TH outside have an chance that the raider might go for their base instead of the free TH. The chance of that happening to me is 10% (1 out of 10)

Champs leaving the clan also have a chance that others might find them and destroy them before their clan mates managed to find them. The chance of that is unknown to me though but it should not be better than the farmer chance of success...

So what is the difference? Both exploit the games mechanics to achieve their desired outcome. Why is one more wrong than the other? Please note I am not defending the champs but merely pointing out some farmers are doing action of similar nature...


P.S. While one go up the table(which is the champ desired outcome), the other goes down. But the farmer do not care about the going down. What they desired is the protection of the resources which is also achieved by their action of leaving their TH out... So in the end, both achieved what they desired through their well-intended actions...

[Swaggermonkey]

Still wondering where is my other taco.....is it with that potato?

[lim81]

I appreciate what you're doing, it's Always important with both sides.
I would however want to know where my comparison is unfair? and if it's not, would farmers be considered chéáters for sharing their Resources? You know what I Think.

To compare the two things you have to consider the win/win cause it wouldn't happen if it wasn't like that. A win/win for a Trophy hunter is leaving Resources outside and a farmer spotting him, that's all fair and Square.

Besides, SC has tried to stop cheap shielding with the "no revenge" thing. If SC wanted to stop farming with TH outside they would simply make you lose 100K of each for losing the TH, apparently they don't Think it's chéáting since they havn't done anything to stop it.

Champ leaving their clans is hoping to achieve their desired outcome. Trophy

Farmer leaving their TH outside is hoping to achieve their desired outcome. Protection of resources.

We should compared both with what they desired to achieve. Champs leaving their resources outside do not really achieve their desired outcome. Their choice of method in achieving this is through leaving of their clans and hoping they will be found.

As such, a fair comparison will be their specific actions and their desired end results.

That is why I feel your comparison is not fair by my definition. Of course you might see it differently.

SC did not stop this revenge thing until recently. By this reasoning, this cheap shield by revenge loop is considered as che@ting. I totally understand your point here.

If SC do introduce penalty on TH outside in the future, can we also claimed that free TH is also che@ting and all the people who came up with reasons to justify this free TH are all wrong and che@ting all this time?

[CunningLinguists]

Sorry for being ♥♥♥♥...Lol

Farmers with TH outside have a better rate of getting taken out by TH snipes. And they do take the base out for 12 hours. That is a fact.

Champs leaving the clans with the hope that their clan mates finding them have a lower rates. And they do also take out the base for 12 hours. That is also a fact.

Farmers with TH outside have an chance that the raider might go for their base instead of the free TH. The chance of that happening to me is 10% (1 out of 10)

Champs leaving the clan also have a chance that others might find them and destroy them before their clan mates managed to find them. The chance of that is unknown to me though but it should not be better than the farmer chance of success...

So what is the difference? Both exploit the games mechanics to achieve their desired outcome. Why is one more wrong than the other? Please note I am not defending the champs but merely pointing out some farmers are doing action of similar nature...


P.S. While one go up the table(which is the champ desired outcome), the other goes down. But the farmer do not care about the going down. What they desired is the protection of the resources which is also achieved by their action of leaving their TH out... So in the end, both achieved what they desired through their well-intended actions...

I guess it comes down to fairness and sportsmanship,While technically they are both exploits i would argue the cheap shield has a larger impact on our game at the higher levels and therefore makes it less likely that you will ever be better than them.Now yes i agree they are both exploits but at lower levels there isnt as much riding on that exploit.If you have spent a lot of money building up your base and a lot of time to get there then you are at a major disadvantage if you dont cheap shield,You basically waste a lot of money because you keep trying to get higher but you cant because people are using exploits to stay ahead of you.Where as outside TH there is way less at stake

[VincentVegas]

Maybe Im looking at this far too simpley but isnt getting the most cups the competition part of the game whereas faming is just readying your base for competition.

I can see how it can be called cheese making when cup hunting but I fail to see how you can cheese make when farming?

Ones a competition and the other isnt. It like comparing a 100m sprint with a stroll down the road.

[lim81]

I guess it comes down to fairness and sportsmanship,While technically they are both exploits i would argue the cheap shield has a larger impact on our game at the higher levels and therefore makes it less likely that you will ever be better than them.Now yes i agree they are both exploits but at lower levels there isnt as much riding on that exploit.If you have spent a lot of money building up your base and a lot of time to get there then you are at a major disadvantage if you dont cheap shield,You basically waste a lot of money because you keep trying to get higher but you cant because people are using exploits to stay ahead of you.Where as outside TH there is way less at stake

Trying to downplay ones effect do not really change the action...

Maybe my original intention of my post are already lost among so many replies... My intentions of posting is just hoping that before the others start jumping and calling out the actions of others, please also do reflect on their own actions. It irks me to see how one can call out on others misdeed yet justified for their own actions of similar nature.

Hopefully my message do get through to some. It's late at my side and its time for me to rest. Have a wonderful day.

[Beerking]

Champ leaving their clans is hoping to achieve their desired outcome. Trophy

Farmer leaving their TH outside is hoping to achieve their desired outcome. Protection of resources.

We should compared both with what they desired to achieve. Champs leaving their resources outside do not really achieve their desired outcome. Their choice of method in achieving this is through leaving of their clans and hoping they will be found.

As such, a fair comparison will be their specific actions and their desired end results.

That is why I feel your comparison is not fair by my definition. Of course you might see it differently.

SC did not stop this revenge thing until recently. By this reasoning, this cheap shield by revenge loop is considered as che@ting. I totally understand your point here.

If SC do introduce penalty on TH outside in the future, can we also claimed that free TH is also che@ting and all the people who came up with reasons to justify this free TH are all wrong and che@ting all this time?

A champ leaving his Resources outside want trophies, and they are leaving Resources outside to get it. I really don't see your Point here, is it really because it doesn't happen as often that's the reason? How does the % of success justify anything?


I can't remember exactly when it was implemented but I wouldn't call it recent considering when the issue was raised (remember that they need time to make a solution aswell).
How is getting a free shield by revenge any different than getting a free shield by an attack? The end result is still the same. Just as with Yohan Blake.

The farming "issue" if you want to call it that has been known for a very long time and the fix is simple and ready if SC would want to implement it. They obviously don't so no, I wouldn't call myself wrong if they changed it, they would simply be going in a different desicion, the difference here is that SC has approved of farming with a TH outside but they have never approved of cheap shielding (The non clan member attack from the start and the "fix" after the issue was raised.


I want to get Money and I do so by working, you also want to get Money but you do it by stealing.
We both has the same goal, Money (shield). I do it by working (TH outside) while you do it by stealing (cheap shield). Disregarding the win/win and win/lose part really gets you into trouble while arguing.

I win, since I get paid, my employer win since his Company succeeds. You win since you get Money but your victim loses since he loses Money.
My Point is that you can't base your arguments by disregarding relevant facts. I really hope that you can see that your entire argumentation is flawed.

[CunningLinguists]

Trying to downplay ones effect do not really change the action...

Maybe my original intention of my post are already lost among so many replies... My intentions of posting is just hoping that before the others start jumping and calling out the actions of others, please also do reflect on their own actions. It irks me to see how one can call out on others misdeed yet justified for their own actions of similar nature.

Hopefully my message do get through to some. It's late at my side and its time for me to rest. Have a wonderful day.

Im not disputing the action,ive openly said they are both exploits but i still stand when i say that cheap shielding has a bigger impact on the game at higher levels.You arent even adding to the discussion instead you arguing semantics and technical complexities.Of course they are both exploits but theyre at different ends of the spectrum,Using your logic Murder and Jay-Walking are both the same and as bad as each other because they are both crimes.While it may be true that they are both crimes it doesn't change the fact that one has a much larger impact than the other.Now obviously this isnt the best analogy but its close as now its just pedantic technicalities.Answer one question,Do you think that cheap shielding is fair to other players?

[lim81]

A champ leaving his Resources outside want trophies, and they are leaving Resources outside to get it. I really don't see your Point here, is it really because it doesn't happen as often that's the reason? How does the % of success justify anything?


I can't remember exactly when it was implemented but I wouldn't call it recent considering when the issue was raised (remember that they need time to make a solution aswell).
How is getting a free shield by revenge any different than getting a free shield by an attack? The end result is still the same. Just as with Yohan Blake.

The farming "issue" if you want to call it that has been known for a very long time and the fix is simple and ready if SC would want to implement it. They obviously don't so no, I wouldn't call myself wrong if they changed it, they would simply be going in a different desicion, the difference here is that SC has approved of farming with a TH outside but they have never approved of cheap shielding (The non clan member attack from the start and the "fix" after the issue was raised.

This will be my last post... I got to get up in 5 hours time to get ready for my flight so I really do need some rest...Lol

For me, an accurate comparison will be what is the specific action and their desired outcome that they hope to achieve. We are talking about champs leaving their clans and farmers leaving their TH outside. That is why when you bring the resources outside as to compare with TH outside, I feel that is not an accurate comparison. We should stick to what specific action they are taking to achieved their desired results. I'm not sure if you get me on this or not...Lol

As for the TH outside issue, if you want to explain it your way and feel you are not wrong, its fine by me. Different people see things differently and I have totally no intention of forcing you to see things in my perspective. I also have no intention of calling those farmers' action wrong. Just hope some people can also try to understand how others(champs?) might look at things. I'm just tired of seeing people in the forum calling out on others so negatively while not reflecting on their own actions...

Have a nice day, sir