Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 11 to 20 of 20

  Click here to go to the first staff post in this thread.   Thread: Clan War Matchmaking Suggestions

  1. #11
    Pro Member Minley's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2019
    Location
    Always Everywhere
    Posts
    736
    Well, we can't go around just skipping saying this idea is great, just make this tweak this way and it is absolutely great, While ignoring the nuances of the idea, it's affect on Clash.

    Oftentimes things look really simple on surface is any dev, but turns to be not that easy, or tricky indeed.
    You really want some bread? Then go ahead create a set of goals
and cross em off your list as you pursue em

Usnavi

  2.   Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread.   #12
    Quote Originally Posted by frzmzr View Post
    What does that mean?





    If I upgrade it happens once. Right now I have a maxed TH9 except for King levels. And as it seems until I upgrade to TH10 I have to face similar issues while MODs here think that just because new buildings are built once per town hall, then it is not important.
    The issue EXISTS! I believe instead of acting like it doesn't matter just because it doesn't happen frequently to us, we should try to be a little bit more constructive and come up with ideas instead of destructive behavior on other people's ideas.
    The issue of new major defences being placed during prep day is infrequent enough that IMO, it is not worth the development time to do anything about it.

    Even if a reasonable way of doing something about it could actually be found, unless the development was trivial.



    I have had this issue as a TH8 (with x-bows), TH9 (with inferno towers) and TH10 (with eagle artillery) at multiple times...
    So I think at least in my case it has been frequent enough to complain about.
    Are you sure that those buildings were placed during prep day that frequently? If so, it seems likley there is something rather odd about your war roster, because it is NOT something that happens often to most players.

    A maxed TH9 "facing" Th10s with infernos will be quite common, but not because they are placed during prep day. More just because the match weight of a maxed TH9 and a newish TH10 isn't all that different.

    General advice here is that from the matchmaking point of view, it is not generally a good idea for your top bases to0 be maxed at their TH level unless that is the max possible (i.e TH13 unto this update), because they will always tend to draw Town Halls of the level above them.


    Are you saying that the SC support is kind of obsolete?
    Cause in the forums in 90% of the time, every member (including me/including the mods) is always trying to find fault in other suggestions instead of finding solutions. And you say the in-game support is also useless...
    So kudos to SC.
    It is not a part of Support's role to evaluate fresh ideas.

    They are there for people with problems in the game - by which I mean things that are not working correctly not design features that people find problematic.

    They are not remotely obsolete, but they are not the right place to go with suggestions for change, and never have been.

  3. #13
    Pro Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2021
    Location
    Climbing Mt. Ebott
    Posts
    567
    Quote Originally Posted by frzmzr View Post
    What does that mean?
    I'll help you out: the phrase is "the pot calling the kettle black."

  4. #14
    After reading the problem and solution, I really must say I disagree.

    My assessment of the problem: someone upgrading to the next th and placing 2 level 1 defenses even if they are the signature defenses will usually not make the base overpowering. Multiple times I've seen a th 8 beat a th 9, a th 9 beat a th 10 and etc. And by beat I mean 3*. This is particularly true when the th is rushed or brand new to the level with only lvl 1 new defenses. This only becomes an issue if the enemy clan is paying for all of these defenses to be caught up or upgraded which is much more rare than the single slight advantage of placing lvl 1 buildings.

    Solution 1) as already pointed out, this gives pay to play players a larger advantage in wars. At least currently its possible a free to play player can do the same and cancel the advantage out if they are lucky.

    Solution 2) while this one is better, its very limiting. To say we can't change bases and the 3 we start with are the 3 we get is a lot more punishing to all players than you realize. First off: how are the 3 choices selected when someone has 6 slots? If its random then this is terrible as the base you want to use may not be available to choose. If its not random then I assume the first 3 only and you unfairly make the gem-bought bases useless. Next, i like making and changing war bases. Im not cheating by doing this but if I don't do this between wars, then I can't use my base at all. Why is this fair or why should this be punished? When creating solutions, you should always be thinking about the effect your idea has on everyone. Even if they aren't the ones you're trying to impact.

    Solution 3) I'm in a war as a th 12, th 13, th 14 whatever. We cleared and used all of our attacks but my last 1 and we need 1 star to win. A th 11 is left 2*ed. Why should I not be allowed to use my maxed troops on this base? The base was already attempted by a th 11? Why should 3+ years of work be equalized to the th i spent so long building away from? This again feels like you were only thinking of the problem but not what the solution means. The solution should not punish people who are not committing the problem you are trying to solve.

    Just to comment on your replies: when you begin referring people to support or suggest we let the devs decide, you sound like you dont want to discuss your idea. If you no longer want to discuss the idea, then this thread has likely run its course as the op has no interest in their idea anymore. Its completely acceptable for people's opinions to differ and for people to discuss why those opinions differ. Some of the best idea were either changed or debate from discussions on the forums. Idea that get tossed aside with no discussion are the ones that probably aren't worth adding.

  5. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by chased123456 View Post
    After reading the problem and solution, I really must say I disagree.

    My assessment of the problem: someone upgrading to the next th and placing 2 level 1 defenses even if they are the signature defenses will usually not make the base overpowering. Multiple times I've seen a th 8 beat a th 9, a th 9 beat a th 10 and etc. And by beat I mean 3*. This is particularly true when the th is rushed or brand new to the level with only lvl 1 new defenses. This only becomes an issue if the enemy clan is paying for all of these defenses to be caught up or upgraded which is much more rare than the single slight advantage of placing lvl 1 buildings.

    Solution 1) as already pointed out, this gives pay to play players a larger advantage in wars. At least currently its possible a free to play player can do the same and cancel the advantage out if they are lucky.

    Solution 2) while this one is better, its very limiting. To say we can't change bases and the 3 we start with are the 3 we get is a lot more punishing to all players than you realize. First off: how are the 3 choices selected when someone has 6 slots? If its random then this is terrible as the base you want to use may not be available to choose. If its not random then I assume the first 3 only and you unfairly make the gem-bought bases useless. Next, i like making and changing war bases. Im not cheating by doing this but if I don't do this between wars, then I can't use my base at all. Why is this fair or why should this be punished? When creating solutions, you should always be thinking about the effect your idea has on everyone. Even if they aren't the ones you're trying to impact.

    Solution 3) I'm in a war as a th 12, th 13, th 14 whatever. We cleared and used all of our attacks but my last 1 and we need 1 star to win. A th 11 is left 2*ed. Why should I not be allowed to use my maxed troops on this base? The base was already attempted by a th 11? Why should 3+ years of work be equalized to the th i spent so long building away from? This again feels like you were only thinking of the problem but not what the solution means. The solution should not punish people who are not committing the problem you are trying to solve.

    Just to comment on your replies: when you begin referring people to support or suggest we let the devs decide, you sound like you dont want to discuss your idea. If you no longer want to discuss the idea, then this thread has likely run its course as the op has no interest in their idea anymore. Its completely acceptable for people's opinions to differ and for people to discuss why those opinions differ. Some of the best idea were either changed or debate from discussions on the forums. Idea that get tossed aside with no discussion are the ones that probably aren't worth adding.
    Level 1 inferno towers which are on single target mode actually DO impact the attack strategies you want to use at TH9... So I think I disagree with you on the fact that you say it doesn't affect.

    Solution 1) I already discussed in previous comments why I agreed that it isn't the best idea.

    Solution 2) It is limiting... You made some different points throughout your analysis some of which aren't actually relevant. For example, the person who has 6 slots still benefits from having 6 slots while the person who has 3 stars doesn't have those benefits. I actually made it clear that there should not be a cool down period, so any base you had available before matchmaking you will have it available during the preparation day and attack day.
    I also mentioned in the discussions that we had in the previous posts that it doesn't have to be a restriction of all kinds! You can just restrict players from adding new buildings to their war base during the preparation day... This way you can still create your war base during the preparation day without affecting the war weight by adding a new signature defense...
    So it isn't as limiting as you say it is... It's actually just keeping the balance that existed before matchmaking.
    We even have these types of limitations as of today! For example, if your clan castle upgrade finishes during the preparation period, your teammates can't donate the extra capacity in war clan castle to you! So I think it is possible.

    Solution 3) You can still use the extra troop capacity that you have! I believe a fair attack is one in which you don't bully another base! I mean what is the point of competition if we are to just overpower the lower town halls to win as higher town hall levels?
    For the same exact reason why clan castle troop donation level was limited, the overpowering and higher level troops must be stopped.
    Yes, a TH13 or TH12 can really benefit from this over powering... But you are hurting the lower town halls and destroying the competition within those tiers with these kinds of decisions!
    So... I guess you cannot just simply put it as "years of work being thrown away!"
    Your years of work allow you to work with seige machines, pets, more heroes, more strategies... Limiting such things does not take away your progress' outcome!

    About your comment on my replies:
    There are two types of comments. Destructive and constructive... People either help find a better/new solution or just keep nagging about other people's ideas and opinions.
    I DO NOT approve of nagging about other opinions! But I believe rational explanation and brainstorming about finding a new/better solution is always useful. And I do not comment harshly about people that criticize! I try to cope with people that try to create a burden on developing a plain/simple idea among ourselves as users by just nagging.
    So please don't take my comments personally and try to look at it a bit more in a constructive/professional manner.
    Also, thanks for your opinion.

  6.   Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread.   #16
    Bakunin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2015
    Location
    Nothing Ever Lasts Forever
    Posts
    4,053
    Quote Originally Posted by frzmzr View Post
    Please suggest other options to tackle the existing unfairness in Clan Wars instead of trying to belittle other opinions and suggestions. Thanks.
    All is fair in love and war.


  7. #17
    Forum Legend Piper139's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Posts
    9,621
    Not going to quote the walls of text but the simplest, in my opinion, fix is freeze bases just like legends league when matchmaking is started. You can still upgrade heroes for attack or troops but the base remains the same. That eliminates matching without the weight of the signature defenses and then dropping them. Op may be seeing it more because of the lower level players in their clan. People go through levels 9 down so quickly there is more opportunity to use this trick. I did it in our last war on my mini that went to 13. Pretty sure I forgot to place my scattershots though. But its going to be a long time before I get to try it again. Since we have just a few 11s, rest 12s and up, its just not a big deal. Down in the little leagues it may. Anyway, freeze the base. Solves the problem and a precedent is already there with legends so, in theory, that existing process could be leveraged.

    As far as ops ideas to limit troop levels in dip attacks, not in favor. Those troop levels were acounted for in the matchmaking. They should be able to be used regardless of the target.
    Last edited by Piper139; 3 Weeks Ago at 07:26 PM.
    sig by dharmaraj in sig shop
    Clan: MN ICE #8UCRP8CL
    IGN: Piper139 #2PQQR9Q22

  8. #18
    Senior Member kylorayker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2020
    Posts
    346
    Quote Originally Posted by frzmzr View Post
    Level 1 inferno towers which are on single target mode actually DO impact the attack strategies you want to use at TH9... So I think I disagree with you on the fact that you say it doesn't affect.

    Solution 1) I already discussed in previous comments why I agreed that it isn't the best idea.

    Solution 2) It is limiting... You made some different points throughout your analysis some of which aren't actually relevant. For example, the person who has 6 slots still benefits from having 6 slots while the person who has 3 stars doesn't have those benefits. I actually made it clear that there should not be a cool down period, so any base you had available before matchmaking you will have it available during the preparation day and attack day.
    I also mentioned in the discussions that we had in the previous posts that it doesn't have to be a restriction of all kinds! You can just restrict players from adding new buildings to their war base during the preparation day... This way you can still create your war base during the preparation day without affecting the war weight by adding a new signature defense...
    So it isn't as limiting as you say it is... It's actually just keeping the balance that existed before matchmaking.
    We even have these types of limitations as of today! For example, if your clan castle upgrade finishes during the preparation period, your teammates can't donate the extra capacity in war clan castle to you! So I think it is possible.

    Solution 3) You can still use the extra troop capacity that you have! I believe a fair attack is one in which you don't bully another base! I mean what is the point of competition if we are to just overpower the lower town halls to win as higher town hall levels?
    For the same exact reason why clan castle troop donation level was limited, the overpowering and higher level troops must be stopped.
    Yes, a TH13 or TH12 can really benefit from this over powering... But you are hurting the lower town halls and destroying the competition within those tiers with these kinds of decisions!
    So... I guess you cannot just simply put it as "years of work being thrown away!"
    Your years of work allow you to work with seige machines, pets, more heroes, more strategies... Limiting such things does not take away your progress' outcome!

    About your comment on my replies:
    There are two types of comments. Destructive and constructive... People either help find a better/new solution or just keep nagging about other people's ideas and opinions.
    I DO NOT approve of nagging about other opinions! But I believe rational explanation and brainstorming about finding a new/better solution is always useful. And I do not comment harshly about people that criticize! I try to cope with people that try to create a burden on developing a plain/simple idea among ourselves as users by just nagging.
    So please don't take my comments personally and try to look at it a bit more in a constructive/professional manner.
    Also, thanks for your opinion.
    Thoughts on your third solution comments:

    As I understand it, the reasoning behind the CC troop donation nerf was so that town halls of the same level as you would not have an unfair advantage. Bases with a higher level than you have earned every single one of the advantages the have over you, which includes their troop levels. It isn't supposed to be balanced between the levels; getting a better, stronger base and troops is literally the entire point of progressing.

    At the same time, it doesn't hurt the competition at the lower town hall levels in any way. It's detrimental to the overall war effort if a higher level town hall has to dip and get the three stars on a lower base. It takes attacks away from the high bases and makes the upper stars more of a premium. The last war our clan was in (just this last weekend), a couple of our bases in the middle of the roster had some excellent defenses against their mirror bases. It made the other team dip down with their top bases, and then they couldn't get the job done against our top spots and had no back up attacks to try again. We ended up winning the war by a pretty decent margin, and a big part of that was them only getting a total of 5 stars out of our top 4 bases. This becomes even more prevalent in war league, when everyone only has one attack to contribute. Having the different levels of bases means you have to take them all into account and plan your clan strategy accordingly. It actually increases the competition level in the game.

    Thoughts about your second solution:

    I think this is the best of any of the ideas you have proposed. I actually do understand what your core thoughts regarding the problem are, and admit it can be frustrating when it happens. We haven't seen it since the early days of clan wars way back years ago, but that's mostly because a few people in our clan have been pretty consistently max level since about the th10 era. I do, however, think it would be incredibly tricky to implement for the devs in a fair way. I'm not a programmer, but it just sounds kinda convoluted with a large number of variables involved. Honestly, how often do you see something like this happen in war matchups? We maybe saw it once or twice a year back in the day, and we were warring pretty much constantly. While I'm not trying to say it isn't a concern, is it really prevalent enough to justify sweeping changes?
    Check out My Village

  9.   This is the last staff post in this thread.   #19
    Kaptain Kat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    adieu farewell auf wiedersehen goodbye
    Posts
    12,715
    Quote Originally Posted by frzmzr View Post
    I will address different things that you said.

    1- You said sometimes it works in my favor and sometimes it doesn't so it's fine. Is it really? I mean whenever it is in my favor then it's unfair to someone else and vice versa. Isn't the whole idea to create more of a fair play? So why should we think it's fine?
    Also you say that war is a team effort... And that is exactly what I believe, but someone gemming and using their books in the preparation day for an easier war doesn't exactly result in a TEAM EFFORT... It becomes more of an UNFAIR ADVANTAGE.

    2- I accept your POV about unfinished buildings and how they may not help solve the solution. So we are on the same page on this one.

    3- Actually I think you didn't read the thread thoroughly. They can still fix those holes and stuff and use the base in war... They just have to fix it before the matchmaking has begun!
    I did not say there should be a cool down period for changed bases to be selected in Clan Wars... I said the changes must be applied before the matchmaking so that you can't add new signature defenses and stuff during the preparation period and make the war obsolete!
    But let's be honest... Even I forget to change my base before wars! You said it! The point of preparation day is to prepare...
    But the editing limitation doesn't necessarily have to be strictly what I say as a user!!! You made a very good point about fixing holes and stuff... So maybe they can just forbid new buildings to be added to bases during the preparation day...
    I think it's worth it that the development team would take it into account and fix something in a way that it would help fair play and not result in disadvantages.

    4- I agree with you upon the fact that they should be able to beat the lower town hall levels easier because at the end of the day it is the point of progression to be able to hit those lower level town halls easier. That's why I emphasized that I am not a big fan of my third suggestion as well.
    But at the end of day we need to take a good look at the other side of the coin as well!
    A rushed TH12 player with maxed Lightning Spell and Dragon can just easily beat a TH11 or TH10 without a second of hesitation! So it does kind of make wars obsolete for those lower TH levels as new town hall is introduced.
    I think that a staff member who is a little bit more familiar with the game mechanics can give a much more thorough opinion compared to me or you.

    4- You talked about crying a river over a match which was quite fair...
    Bro, I mean... Seriously? Come on now! Give me at least some credit! You don't know who I am or what my skills are... Let's not be judgemental.


    I'm looking forward to your opinion towards the third point I made.
    I did read properly and fully understood, everyone can change the war base at all other times as long as youíre not searching or on prep day. Nevertheless I still think itís too much that if they spot a small issue on prep day that they canít fix it.

    We have experienced it regularly over the years we told someone to fix a hole or wall or something small like that. Not everyone always keeps 3 good war bases around. Some might be outdated with unplaced buildings or simply not as good as their ďfirstĒ or preferred base. So I think that this ďsolutionĒ is too harsh for something that I still donít see as a huge issue.

    I also know you never mentioned a cool down. I used the cool down (which happens in friendly challenges when the smallest change is made) as an example. When people make a tiny insignificant change on a base the base goes into cool down for friendly challenges. Now this phenomenon regularly leads to complaints. So parallel to that if you canít fix small things on a war base like a hole etc that this would also lead to a lot of complaints that people canít use their warbase for war.

    A side effect from not being able to place new buildings on prep day would be that in CWL one couldnít add a new building for the entire season.. as itís always prep day for the next war. So they could potentially make it different for CWL compared with regular wars but then it would get needlessly complex I think.

    You are also comparing a rushed TH12 with a TH10 or 11. A well developed TH11 can certainly give a rushed TH12 a hard time. A TH10 should probably be easier for said 12. But still itís a clan war. A rushed 12 and a 10 or 11 arenít matched with each other as a whole war. Maybe you have a strong 12 in the line up which can make minced meat out of that 12. You win some you lose some. Some wars are more difficult and others are easier.

    War bases for lower town hall levels are never obsolete. I always looked at it this way. A lower town halls job is to hold up against an equal TH level, make a higher TH level use an attack on you so they have less change to improve the result up higher. They can also use bases which are prone to time outs and otherwise give attackers a run for their money.
    If for example a TH9 fights off a few TH9 attacks and is only destroyed when a solid TH10 attacks then he did a good job. You might think this is insignificant because eventually he gets 3 starred anyway. But burning attacks on the opponent side is and can be very important. They might run out of attacks and leave a 1 Star up higher because people need to dip to clean up.

    For the record and speaking about reading... I never said that YOU were crying about any possible unfair match...
    I said that I have experienced examples of this in game, it happens. And as such I merely wrote this for awareness that some people do this. Again not saying you do but possibly you have clan mates who do and look out for those. Iím sure you know the types.

    PS... by the way, Iím not a bro

    Thank you! ClashOfHolmes for an awesome sig!

    Just call me K, my name is too difficult to spell.
    Hay Day | Level: 120 | # VL8GVUL | Main Hay Day Topics | Forum Rules | HD Wiki
    Clash of Clans | Level: lost count at 200 | #Y0VJUJG

  10. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by frzmzr View Post
    Level 1 inferno towers which are on single target mode actually DO impact the attack strategies you want to use at TH9... So I think I disagree with you on the fact that you say it doesn't affect.
    most attack strategies at th 9 involve some degree of swarm especially the popular and strong witch slap. this means the lvl 1 will be overwhelmed and ineffective. lvl 1 single is probably the least threatening power up i could imagine. lvl 1 multi is also pretty bad as you can use a tanking army now which makes it ineffective. if you max th 9 and only know 1 attack, that's the bigger issue. Th 9 has plenty of attacks to learn.

    Solution 2) It is limiting... You made some different points throughout your analysis some of which aren't actually relevant. For example, the person who has 6 slots still benefits from having 6 slots while the person who has 3 stars doesn't have those benefits. I actually made it clear that there should not be a cool down period, so any base you had available before matchmaking you will have it available during the preparation day and attack day.
    This is the problem I have with your idea. repeating the part I disagree with won't make me agree with you. If i want to swap my bases During Prep day, i can't. I could have Valid reasons to want to swap my bases around including I found its too weak and just need a new one. You are punishing people for this and forcing them to stick with bases they don't want. for back-to-back war clans, you are forcing players to sit out for 2 days just so they can swap bases if they want to. repeating the idea doesn't solve this nor make it go away. So if you want to actually address this please do but stop repeating the idea and thinking you solved the problem.

    I also mentioned in the discussions that we had in the previous posts that it doesn't have to be a restriction of all kinds! You can just restrict players from adding new buildings to their war base during the preparation day... This way you can still create your war base during the preparation day without affecting the war weight by adding a new signature defense...
    So it isn't as limiting as you say it is... It's actually just keeping the balance that existed before matchmaking.
    We even have these types of limitations as of today! For example, if your clan castle upgrade finishes during the preparation period, your teammates can't donate the extra capacity in war clan castle to you! So I think it is possible.
    This was a much batter point than repeating the issue over and over. Yes I saw this before and hadn't decided my thoughts on it in my previous post so i left any statements on it out. Now I have concerns. What happens when you update all of your war bases with new defenses? I am no longer able to change my previous war base if I felt it needed to be changed. Now I go from 3-6 choices down to 1. I would have to pay attention to the fact I need to make adjustments before I place something new which I might forget. While this problem would only happen to someone up to 13 times for now, that's still quite a bit and the number would grow in the future. While an issue that i still don't think is and issue would be solved, you would create another QOL problem.


    Solution 3) You can still use the extra troop capacity that you have! I believe a fair attack is one in which you don't bully another base! I mean what is the point of competition if we are to just overpower the lower town halls to win as higher town hall levels?
    For the same exact reason why clan castle troop donation level was limited, the overpowering and higher level troops must be stopped.
    Yes, a TH13 or TH12 can really benefit from this over powering... But you are hurting the lower town halls and destroying the competition within those tiers with these kinds of decisions!
    This is truly comparing apples to oranges. CC limits made it so Equal ths will have a relatively similar maximum strength to balance attacking and defending against each other. No longer are the outcomes of the lowest ths greatly decided by the strength of the CC.

    You're suggesting Lower ths have the same ability to defend against higher ths. This is very counterintuitive to upgrading. When you upgrade, you expect to grow stronger than the previous th. being forced to always hit the th with the same power regardless of the camp space is a bit redundant. Seeing my troops downgraded would be very annoying. you also Haven't suggested how this works on heroes. Does my lvl 25 royal champ go to lvl 1 or lvl 0 when i hit a th 12? do i get my warden against a th 10? what about sieges, what level are those? Besides if I'm in war as a near maxed or maxed th 13 or 14 or whatever, the opponent likely has the same and has the same opportunity to attack down if needed. Your only viewing individual attacks as fair or unfair when each attack in the war matters.
    Heres a real example: last war in my clan was a 5v5 2 th 12, 2 th 11 1 th 10. the opponents were the same. their first 4 attacks were their th 12 hitting our first 4 bases. they still had both 11s and 10s. we hit from the bottom up so our 10 went first and we got 3*s using our lowest attacks first and had 2 attacks left on 1 of our th 11s. That th 11 actually got more percent and equal stars on their th 12s than their 12s did on our 12s and we still had 4 th 12 attacks remaining. were our 11s still bullied even though we won without using a single th 12 attack? not all dips are bullying. it can be just poor strategy when viewed in the war as a whole.


    About your comment on my replies:
    There are two types of comments. Destructive and constructive... People either help find a better/new solution or just keep nagging about other people's ideas and opinions.
    I DO NOT approve of nagging about other opinions! But I believe rational explanation and brainstorming about finding a new/better solution is always useful. And I do not comment harshly about people that criticize! I try to cope with people that try to create a burden on developing a plain/simple idea among ourselves as users by just nagging.
    So please don't take my comments personally and try to look at it a bit more in a constructive/professional manner.
    Also, thanks for your opinion.
    Your comments were not taken personally at all nor was it a criticism toward you. I merely warned that deferring people to the opinion of the developers to resolve a debate is not what the forums are for. It is for discussion and if you don't want to discuss others will take notice and stop replying too. that is all I meant there is no deeper meaning nor backhanded comments.

    Also out of fear you'll twist this to be destructive. sharing an opinion about something not being necessary doesn't subtract from the work you put into it. It merely gives you an insight to other's views on the matter. Knowing what your audience and the opposing view are thinking allows you to come up with a new idea or adjust the old ones so you can gain more support. Hearing opposing views is only destructive if there is no rational reason to the criticism or you give up because of it. I hope this helps you step out of your black and white world of 2 choices.

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •