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  Click here to go to the first staff post in this thread.   Thread: Tie breaker for Perfect wars

  1. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ajax View Post
    It was mainly the "It is not hard for non pro clans to perfect these days " part I was responding to. The last part (about being able to do nothing to stop it) is only relevant if that was true, which it isn't.

    BTW, we are only on page 3 (for me)
    I was hoping we can all agree that the current 2 hit clan war is broken for a certain portion of coc players. When you know the result of the war on prep day and perfect with 14 hits to spare, I think it is broken.

    As to whether me and my clan belong to the top 1%, 0.01% or 0.0001%, I think it is pointless to discuss as there will never be a conclusion.

    I just hope SC know of this problem and know that the 2 hit clan war is broken for players who are their most skilled and "passionate?" players.

  2. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaledonian View Post
    TH13 is nothing like BB.

    OP hasn't, IMO, convinced of the overwhelming need for a tiebreaker at all. You, if I'm reading this correctly, are talking about a 3rd level tiebreaker; in the name of all that's sacred, why? There does not absolutely have to be a winner every time, using multiple layers of tiebreakers, each of which requires coding!

    If your clan, or any clan, cannot prevent being perfected, then you do not deserve to win. In other words, defend better or own the draw.
    TH13 is nothing like BB, true.

    Agreed there is no need for a classic wars tiebreaker, let alone “overwhelming”, but it might be nice when rarely it matters.

    I disagree with your bold part. In my wanderings, in two unrelated clans, I have found a mid level player, TH10, trying to bootstrap their own great clan, then level 1-3. They collect 5-10 other players, most barely active, TH5-11, and try to do continuous war to get clan level points. They do 5v5 and 10v10. These are weird wars, the opposition is weird, but they very commonly result in 100%-100%. On each side is a skilled player (for their level) in #1, and the spare attacks and a little strategy means that if they can 3 star the opposing #1, they will three star every opposition base.

    I don’t care for these kind of wars, or these kind of clans (typically 0-3 people chatting over a week, 1 being the saddest), but it is an allowed way to play, and they’d have a better game if there was a challenge to get a win instead of yet another draw.

    I have never seen a CWL war day draw. I think once I had a 50v50 war tie. I have never seen a war tie 15v15 to 40v40.
    Last edited by George1971; January 27th, 2021 at 10:25 AM.

  3.   Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread.   #113
    Quote Originally Posted by Alextzh View Post
    I was hoping we can all agree that the current 2 hit clan war is broken for a certain portion of coc players. When you know the result of the war on prep day and perfect with 14 hits to spare, I think it is broken.
    It is, but that is such a tiny proportion of players it is unlikely SC will find it worthwhile doing anything about it.

    As to whether me and my clan belong to the top 1%, 0.01% or 0.0001%, I think it is pointless to discuss as there will never be a conclusion.
    Well it is relevant to how many it affects, and therefore whether they will feel it worthwhile doing anything.

    Top 1%, they might. Top 0.01%, probably not.

    I just hope SC know of this problem and know that the 2 hit clan war is broken for players who are their most skilled and "passionate?" players.
    I'm sure they know of it.

  4.   Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread.   #114
    Quote Originally Posted by George1971 View Post
    I have never seen a CWL war day draw. I think once I had a 50v50 war tie. I have never seen a war tie 15v15 to 40v40.
    We actually had a (non-perfect) draw in a regular clan war at 15v15 a few months ago. It is the only one I have seen since the damage tiebreaker was introduced.

  5. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alextzh View Post
    I was typing my reply to the guy who says there is something I can do to prevent getting perfected in a 2hit clan war when faced with a good clan (like the hunter clan).

    Is that your reality in this game too???

    Do you believe that there is something I can do with my base designs or upgrading that could prevent the enemy from getting perfect in a 2 hit war?

    If there is, I won't start this thread at all. I mean you have seen my screen capture, we perfected the other guy with 14 hits to spare.
    Do you think we have crappy bases? Or they have crappy bases? sigh...

    After 10 pages I am annoyed that there are still people who think one can avoid getting perfected when matched with a strong clan.
    So defence is now irrelevant? You cannot possibly, ever, copy or find or develop a better base, just one, that doesn't get tripled? So yes, there is something that you can do, however difficult, to prevent being perfected.

    However that wasn't the thrust of my point, which was if you cannot prevent that, you don't deserve to win. But you chose to ignore that & focused instead on the slight ambiguity in my final paragraph, which read:

    "...If your clan, or any clan, cannot prevent being perfected, then you do not deserve to win. In other words, defend better or own the draw."

    I'll concede that "If your clan, or any clan, cannot prevent being perfected, then you do not deserve to win. In other words, defend better or, if you can't, own the draw" would've been better.

    That's just my opinion & no matter how often you punctuate your posts with "duh" or "sigh" or whatever form of condescension you opt for, you won't convince me of this need to implement a tiebreaker in classic war.

    Anyway, I'm done. I don't have the inclination to counter your points when you stretch the meaning of mine.
    Last edited by Kaledonian; January 27th, 2021 at 04:21 PM.

  6. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaledonian View Post
    So defence is now irrelevant? You cannot possibly, ever, copy or find or develop a better base, just one, that doesn't get tripled? So yes, there is something that you can do, however difficult, to prevent being perfected.

    However that wasn't the thrust of my point, which was if you cannot prevent that, you don't deserve to win. But you chose to ignore that & focused instead on the slight ambiguity in my final paragraph, which read:

    "...If your clan, or any clan, cannot prevent being perfected, then you do not deserve to win. In other words, defend better or own the draw."

    I'll concede that "If your clan, or any clan, cannot prevent being perfected, then you do not deserve to win. In other words, defend better or, if you can't, own the draw" would've been better.

    That's just my opinion & no matter how often you punctuate your posts with "duh" or "sigh" or whatever form of condescension you opt for, you won't convince me of this need to implement a tiebreaker in classic war.

    Anyway, I'm done. I don't have the inclination to counter your points when you stretch the meaning of mine.
    I did not stretch the meaning of yours.

    So let me repeat what I am saying, "You cannot possibly, ever, copy or find or develop a better base, just one, that doesn't get tripled." There is nothing that you can do, however difficult, to prevent being perfected.

    I copied your statements so there is no room for misunderstanding.

    At the current th13 meta assuming good attackers, the defence cannot stop a perfect and prevent triples in a 2 hit war. There is nothing ANYONE, not even COC gods, can do to prevent a perfect war.

    There is only that much layouts can do... it is not like you can add another scatter shot or something... Good layouts maybe can bring the hit rate down some percentage points but when your opponents hit rate is like 70% or something, it is not going to bring it below 50% to prevent the perfect.
    Last edited by Alextzh; January 27th, 2021 at 11:03 PM.

  7. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ajax View Post
    It is, but that is such a tiny proportion of players it is unlikely SC will find it worthwhile doing anything about it.

    Well it is relevant to how many it affects, and therefore whether they will feel it worthwhile doing anything.

    Top 1%, they might. Top 0.01%, probably not.

    I'm sure they know of it.
    I hope SC will think that the 2hit war being broken for the top players is something bad and needed to be fixed.

    What is the incentive for players to practise, FC, learn new strats and then get clobbered by a broken game in which skill become meaningless (once you go above a certain level) and wars end in a draw at the end?
    Last edited by Alextzh; January 27th, 2021 at 11:00 PM.

  8. #118
    Quote Originally Posted by Alextzh View Post
    I did not stretch the meaning of yours.

    So let me repeat what I am saying, "You cannot possibly, ever, copy or find or develop a better base, just one, that doesn't get tripled." There is nothing that you can do, however difficult, to prevent being perfected.

    I copied your statements so there is no room for misunderstanding.

    At the current th13 meta assuming good attackers, the defence cannot stop a perfect and prevent triples in a 2 hit war. There is nothing ANYONE, not even COC gods, can do to prevent a perfect war.

    There is only that much layouts can do... it is not like you can add another scatter shot or something... Good layouts maybe can bring the hit rate down some percentage points but when your opponents hit rate is like 70% or something, it is not going to bring it below 50% to prevent the perfect.
    So, your clan managed to not match clans with good attackers for what, 50 wars in a row?

    Contact SC here. Click here for how trophies are calculated. Click here to see how war map placement of max halls is determined. An idea to improve legends here. I wish max players had a separate loot bank as described here. Caution, I often discuss for the sake of discussion and enjoy having my opinion challenged (or approved of) even when I care little about the actual issue. My balance wish: get rid of tornado trap, make it a decoration.

  9.   This is the last staff post in this thread.   #119
    Quote Originally Posted by Alextzh View Post
    I hope SC will think that the 2hit war being broken for the top players is something bad and needed to be fixed.

    What is the incentive for players to practise, FC, learn new strats and then get clobbered by a broken game in which skill become meaningless (once you go above a certain level) and wars end in a draw at the end?
    I don't think SC actually have a concept of "for the top players" (or more properly clans) in classic wars. They have stated themselves that they don't regard win streaks as significant, and there really isn't any realistic way to determine which are the top clans by automated means. You and I can look at results and clan make up and results know that you aren't doing it by engineering or any other form of manipulation, but that is very difficult to code.

    They regard CWL as FAR more significant. And that doesn't appear to be broken in that way.

    I can understand your frustration, but I really don't think SC will think it worth doing anything about.

    I'm not even against a tiebreaker in principle if it is only applied to perfect wars, since it will never affect me (or 99.99% of players). But I don't think it is really necessary even for that level, and I certainly don't think it is worth SC putting any significant effort into (But I don't know how much it would need, of course).

  10. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ajax View Post
    I don't think SC actually have a concept of "for the top players" (or more properly clans) in classic wars. They have stated themselves that they don't regard win streaks as significant, and there really isn't any realistic way to determine which are the top clans by automated means. You and I can look at results and clan make up and results know that you aren't doing it by engineering or any other form of manipulation, but that is very difficult to code.

    They regard CWL as FAR more significant. And that doesn't appear to be broken in that way.

    I can understand your frustration, but I really don't think SC will think it worth doing anything about.

    I'm not even against a tiebreaker in principle if it is only applied to perfect wars, since it will never affect me (or 99.99% of players). But I don't think it is really necessary even for that level, and I certainly don't think it is worth SC putting any significant effort into (But I don't know how much it would need, of course).
    I agree with all that.

    > They regard CWL as FAR more significant.
    except I think it is important to tail that with "for serious players".

    I think SuperCell is as attentive as they should be, which is quite, to beginner players. CWL doesn't work well for beginner players, but classic war does work really well for beginner players. Except for non-genuine beginner players having access to max troop donations. Yes, Req'n Leave, but genuine beginners in a clan don't use Req'n Leave. Apart from CC troops, there's nothing to fix with classic wars for beginners, and so it doesn't feature much conversation.

    I wonder whether SuperCell have a ten year plan, or if they are just riding the wave in amazement at how well it just keeps going.

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