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  Click here to go to the first staff post in this thread.   Thread: Yetis need to be fixed now

  1. #11
    Forum Veteran LordSk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bazinga1996 View Post
    This should be changed, if it's the case that the AI do not count walls in the rule of three.
    It is quite typical, wanting the game to change because of something not going as you planned. Not going to happen.

    While I do agree that troop movements do not always make sense, the only way to get good at this game is to know how AI works, and plan your attack accordingly.

    This does not just apply to a game like CoC, it is how life works: When things do not go as you want, do not expect the world to adapt to you, but rather adapt to the world.

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bazinga1996 View Post
    This should be changed, if it's the case that the AI do not count walls in the rule of three.
    It's rage worthy, but what's happening is.

    Time to destroy wall + target on the other side, is less than to take out the Xbow, they are the tankiest defense in the game. So it's actually worked out what's best. However it doesnt take into account the bigger threat or any form of self preservation, which is to take out the xbow. No game on a phone is going to be that smart.

  3. #13
    I play as an th13 fully maxed, I know how the AI works, but I think in that case and some other cases, they bad programmed. It's frustrating if you try to attack good but the AI wreck your attack, because they go through the wall instead of attacking the buildings that are right next of them.

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bazinga1996 View Post
    I play as an th13 fully maxed, I know how the AI works
    Based on your posts, it sounds as if you don't. If you did, you would have understood that the rule of 3 would eliminate the x-bow as a potential target for the yetis.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bazinga1996 View Post
    but I think in that case and some other cases, they bad programmed.
    Looks like the troops are doing exactly what they are supposed to do. Granted, it is not what you want them to do in that situation, and that happens a lot, to all of us. There are instances where the pathing is a bit buggy (e.g. the wall wrecker veering off-line, the beta minion in the builder base), but these are usually addressed. This does not appear to be one of those cases.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bazinga1996 View Post
    It's frustrating if you try to attack good but the AI wreck your attack, because they go through the wall instead of attacking the buildings that are right next of them.
    Yes, it can be frustrating sometimes, but "trying to attack good" doesn't always result in success. It just wasn't good enough this time, and it's not the AI's fault. In fact, it's not really even AI in the sense that there is no machine learning or neural networks involved in the pathing. It's designed to be repeatable: Find the three closest buildings, move towards the one it can get to most easily. This is why replays exist, every time you deploy the same troops in the same spot at the same time, you are guaranteed to get the same result.

    Besides, can you imagine if troops acted in self-preservation and went after defenses firing at them? Your queen walk might make a beeline to a ground x-bow targeting her, walking her into a scattershot ambush rather than taking out trash around the outside to help your pathing.

    Troops will never read your mind. You can only try to understand better how they're doing, and adjust your attacks.

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  5. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Rizzob View Post
    Based on your posts, it sounds as if you don't. If you did, you would have understood that the rule of 3 would eliminate the x-bow as a potential target for the yetis.



    Looks like the troops are doing exactly what they are supposed to do. Granted, it is not what you want them to do in that situation, and that happens a lot, to all of us. There are instances where the pathing is a bit buggy (e.g. the wall wrecker veering off-line, the beta minion in the builder base), but these are usually addressed. This does not appear to be one of those cases.



    Yes, it can be frustrating sometimes, but "trying to attack good" doesn't always result in success. It just wasn't good enough this time, and it's not the AI's fault. In fact, it's not really even AI in the sense that there is no machine learning or neural networks involved in the pathing. It's designed to be repeatable: Find the three closest buildings, move towards the one it can get to most easily. This is why replays exist, every time you deploy the same troops in the same spot at the same time, you are guaranteed to get the same result.

    Besides, can you imagine if troops acted in self-preservation and went after defenses firing at them? Your queen walk might make a beeline to a ground x-bow targeting her, walking her into a scattershot ambush rather than taking out trash around the outside to help your pathing.

    Troops will never read your mind. You can only try to understand better how they're doing, and adjust your attacks.
    I try to adjust my attacks but sometimes it's impossible, because AI has his own mind. If I think like the troops with the rule of three, the only logical target would be the x bows, because everything else are out of range/behind wall. If the rule of three based on countung tiles without counting the walls, like: the cannon are 2 tiles away behind the wall, the xbows 5-6 tiles so they attack the wall to reach the cannon, if it's really that way the AI works, it's not effective and result in fails. IDK if I'm right with my conclusion about that, but in my opinion, it's not effective like it should be.
    Last edited by Bazinga1996; November 25th, 2020 at 03:15 PM.

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bazinga1996 View Post
    I try to adjust my attacks but sometimes it's impossible, because AI has his own mind. If I think like the troops with the rule of three, the only logical target would be the x bows, because everything else are out of range/behind wall. If the rule of three based on countung tiles without counting the walls, like: the cannon are 2 tiles away behind the wall, the xbows 5-6 tiles so they attack the wall to reach the cannon, if it's really that way the AI works, it's not effective and result in fails. IDK if I'm right with my conclusion about that, but in my opinion, it's not effective like it should be.
    Yes, that is how it works (bolded). The fact that you don't seem to think that's how it works indicates to me that you really don't know as much as you claim. Further, changing this would make things crazy. Troops would walk way around a base to get to stuff NOT behind walls. If you don't understand how badly this would break the game I don't think anyone can help you.
    Last edited by Thegreatpuma; November 25th, 2020 at 03:37 PM.
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  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bazinga1996 View Post
    I try to adjust my attacks but sometimes it's impossible, because AI has his own mind. If I think like the troops with the rule of three, the only logical target would be the x bows, because everything else are out of range/behind wall. If the rule of three based on countung tiles without counting the walls, like: the cannon are 2 tiles away behind the wall, the xbows 5-6 tiles so they attack the wall to reach the cannon, if it's really that way the AI works, it's not effective and result in fails. IDK if I'm right with my conclusion about that, but in my opinion, it's not effective like it should be.
    Imagine the troops preferred to go to buildings where they didn't have to go through walls (which they do, if that building is found in the rule of 3 calculation), and just looked for the closest building they could get to without having to go through a wall. What then happens is everyone builds maze bases, where all your ground troops walk through a labyrinth of flanked x-bows, scattershots, infernos, etc. to go after tanky trash buildings, like storages, clan castle, and such. Your options are to attack by stuff that ignores walls (air, hogs, miners), or bring 20 super wallbreakers with you. This would end ground attacks.

    The logic that dictates the pathing, is the way it is for a reason.

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  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rizzob View Post
    Imagine the troops preferred to go to buildings where they didn't have to go through walls (which they do, if that building is found in the rule of 3 calculation), and just looked for the closest building they could get to without having to go through a wall. What then happens is everyone builds maze bases, where all your ground troops walk through a labyrinth of flanked x-bows, scattershots, infernos, etc. to go after tanky trash buildings, like storages, clan castle, and such. Your options are to attack by stuff that ignores walls (air, hogs, miners), or bring 20 super wallbreakers with you. This would end ground attacks.

    The logic that dictates the pathing, is the way it is for a reason.
    Exactly right. The AI of troops are well known and documented and the best course of action for the OP is to learn it. See what doesn't go as you expect in a battle, and learn from it.

    Suggesting the AI changes has so many unintended consequences that the OP has not considered. You've raised excellent ones. The primary counter argument to me, is that changing AI means new strategies that will optimize base designs for said new AI. You'll just find yourself back here complaining that the new AI is "dumb" because base designs outsmarted you again.

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bazinga1996 View Post
    I try to adjust my attacks but sometimes it's impossible, because AI has his own mind. If I think like the troops with the rule of three, the only logical target would be the x bows, because everything else are out of range/behind wall. If the rule of three based on countung tiles without counting the walls, like: the cannon are 2 tiles away behind the wall, the xbows 5-6 tiles so they attack the wall to reach the cannon, if it's really that way the AI works, it's not effective and result in fails. IDK if I'm right with my conclusion about that, but in my opinion, it's not effective like it should be.
    In my view, they dont attack the xbow because they never see them..
    Even from the blimp exploding, there appears to be always 3 other structures that are closer to the yeti than that bow, even tho they are behind walls..
    They did try rule of 5, but quickly moved back to 3, as the more options the AI has, the more unpredictable the actions are.

    Sure, we would attack the xbow, but our intelligence isnt artificial.. We can reason and risk assess, they cant.
    Last edited by joshsgrandad; November 25th, 2020 at 04:48 PM.

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bazinga1996 View Post
    I try to adjust my attacks but sometimes it's impossible, because AI has his own mind. If I think like the troops with the rule of three, the only logical target would be the x bows, because everything else are out of range/behind wall. If the rule of three based on countung tiles without counting the walls, like: the cannon are 2 tiles away behind the wall, the xbows 5-6 tiles so they attack the wall to reach the cannon, if it's really that way the AI works, it's not effective and result in fails. IDK if I'm right with my conclusion about that, but in my opinion, it's not effective like it should be.
    Hmmm, imagine how it would sound if a general in a real war (they still exist) said, "I try to attack good, but sometimes it's impossible because the enemy general has his own mind and is not effective like he should be!"
    I'm sure you would agree that it shows the general is not really very good and will soon lose. And the AI is much more predictable than people in real life.

    To win you need to understand your enemy, and how he works, and use that to your advantage. Sometimes that works, sometimes it doesn't. Just be glad that the AI is fairly predictable, even if it doesn't always do quite what you expect.

    I have always thought that I would like to control troops after dropping them, but I am not sure that would work as well as I hope, because then I would have to keep track of hundreds of troops and control each one!

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