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  Click here to go to the first staff post in this thread.   Thread: Increase the 10 star reward for winning a Clan War round

  1. #21
    Forum All-Star joshsgrandad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaledonian View Post
    Just to add, there's no way to be certain any given league would pan it the same way if wins were the primary criterion.

    You can't look back and say we should've won because some clans would change their focus if wins were the be all & end all.
    Agree.. as Tosti says, there are 3 ways it could have been done..
    Even with this thread, if those wins had been determinate, then one of the 2 clans that finished above them could call foul due to having gained more stars, and perhaps more destruction too.

    Also agree that strategy would change if it were wins, as the focus would be on what the days opposition was doing, rather than the league in general.
    Another problem with using wins is that start/end time could be pivotal in determining ones chances of success.



    Quote Originally Posted by Munitor View Post
    Apparently this question has to be asked almost every CWL with the exact same answers every time.

    Perhaps next time the OP should go look in and post in last months thread on the topic.
    i agree, he could have..
    But what is old news to us is new to him.. And important.
    The last thread will have gathered dust by now, so is no biggie to start from scratch again.
    Same could be said of most threads nowadays, and we wouldnt have a lot to talk about, as it would already have been said.

  2. #22
    Super Member Rizzob's Avatar
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    As others have said, this type of issue stems from having a good defense but poor (or, seemingly in this case, not enough) attacking.

    The change you are proposing would increase the importance of good defense, which would by nature de-emphasize the importance of attacking skills.

    Here's the problem with that: defense in clash of clans is passive. It's possible to take some dead max TH13 accounts, add them to your lineup, and have a great defensive lineup. But it's not great for the game to have wars without people participating. This would encourage people to keep inactive (but strong) bases in war.

    Here's another example, take a lineup of max TH13s, half of which are dead, and drop it into low crystal or gold league. Under the current rules, such a lineup might win every war due to strong defense, but finish in the middle of the pack because not enough people attack. It would be a hard sell to convince me that such a lineup deserves to win the league and get promoted.

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  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Rizzob View Post
    As others have said, this type of issue stems from having a good defense but poor (or, seemingly in this case, not enough) attacking.

    The change you are proposing would increase the importance of good defense, which would by nature de-emphasize the importance of attacking skills.

    Here's the problem with that: defense in clash of clans is passive. It's possible to take some dead max TH13 accounts, add them to your lineup, and have a great defensive lineup. But it's not great for the game to have wars without people participating. This would encourage people to keep inactive (but strong) bases in war.

    Here's another example, take a lineup of max TH13s, half of which are dead, and drop it into low crystal or gold league. Under the current rules, such a lineup might win every war due to strong defense, but finish in the middle of the pack because not enough people attack. It would be a hard sell to convince me that such a lineup deserves to win the league and get promoted.
    Thanks this makes sense and provides the most reasoned answer for why it may not be a good idea.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rizzob View Post
    As others have said, this type of issue stems from having a good defense but poor (or, seemingly in this case, not enough) attacking.
    Slightly off topic, but as you're also indirectly pointing out, there's an added dimension to defense in CWL. If we for a moment keep offense constant and look at two extreme situations, it's probably more apparent:

    If all bases have no defense, the average stars go up and the spread goes down.

    If all bases have max defense, the average stars go down and the spread goes up.

    In the latter case other effects like overall strategy and individual attack skill start to outweigh all other effects. So, unlike CW, you can't just show up to CWL and expect to outdefend your way to rank 1. Your defense level doesnt just influence the outcome of the ca 7 wars you're in, it also influences the star spread between ranks for that particular CWL.

    I think, in the lack of understanding the added dimension, lies the motivation for suggestions/discussions such as this one.
    Last edited by Munitor; 4 Weeks Ago at 06:19 PM.

  5. #25
    Forum Elder PapaTroll's Avatar
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    Let's remember the original scoring system for CWL.

    Originally you only earned stars and medals for the wars you won. This created a system that rewarded sandbagging. You could earn more medals going 5-2 in Crystal II than going 3-4 in Crystal I. It became a race to the bottom.

    The revamp emphasized getting 8 stars each, in the highest possible league.

    OP mentioned 30v30, which tells me you are farming medals for the greatest number of clanmates. This does double the impact of individual star vs wars won. But If you were trying to be competitive and move up to Champs the way to do it is 15v15.

    Take your medals and grow your clan. Promotion will come when you are ready.
    Last edited by PapaTroll; 4 Weeks Ago at 12:48 AM.

  6. #26
    Forum All-Star joshsgrandad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PapaTroll View Post
    Let's remember the original scoring system for CWL.

    Originally you only earned stars and medals for the wars you won. This created a system that rewarded sandbagging. You could earn more medals going 5-2 in Crystal II than going 3-4 in Crystal I. It became a race to the bottom.

    The revamp emphasized getting 8 stars each, in the highest possible league.

    OP mentioned 30v30, which tells me you are farming medals for the greatest number of clanmates. This does double the impact of individual star vs wars won. But If you were trying to be competitive and move up to Champs the way to do it is 15v15.

    Take your medals and grow your clan. Promotion will come when you are ready.
    Read the thread Papa..
    He has missed out 2 seasons, even tho they won every war..
    So they arent simply farming, since they expect to promote after a clean sweep.
    fair assumption I would think.

    BTW.. He is Crystal 2, so 30v war size should be a viable option to still move up.
    There are 4 tiers above him in which they can still go with 30v.

  7. #27
    Forum Elder PapaTroll's Avatar
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    Sorry if my point was a bit fuzzy.

    Adding more points per win encourages sandbagging.

    In any round of 15v15 there are 45 possible stars for individual achievement, plus 10 for the win.
    Realistically probable score is about 30 +10, win stars are 25% of total.
    At 30v it becomes 90 for individual achievement, but still only 10 for the win.
    Realistically probable score is about 60+10, so win stars are only 14% of the total.

    30v30 doubles the impact of stars earned by the individual players.

    If you need a system where winning the individual wars is a greater percentage of your total score, 15v is the best choice.

    If you want to benefit the greatest number of players and earn the most medals for the most people, you should do 30v.

    But you are correct that in either size war two will be promoted regardless.
    Most requested QoL feature is a regional filter in the recruiting tool. If it is so hard to track players by region, why does the top player ranking show both a global and (in my case) a local U.S. tab?

  8. #28
    Forum All-Star joshsgrandad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PapaTroll View Post
    Sorry if my point was a bit fuzzy.

    Adding more points per win encourages sandbagging.

    In any round of 15v15 there are 45 possible stars for individual achievement, plus 10 for the win.
    Realistically probable score is about 30 +10, win stars are 25% of total.
    At 30v it becomes 90 for individual achievement, but still only 10 for the win.
    Realistically probable score is about 60+10, so win stars are only 14% of the total.

    30v30 doubles the impact of stars earned by the individual players.

    If you need a system where winning the individual wars is a greater percentage of your total score, 15v is the best choice.

    If you want to benefit the greatest number of players and earn the most medals for the most people, you should do 30v.

    But you are correct that in either size war two will be promoted regardless.
    My mistake mate.. Apologies.

    Yeah, as things stand, the 30v option is dependant on the stars scored in the war.. Win bonus is pretty insignificant.
    It makes his request more valid.. But following on from your post, they need a change of tactic if they win 7 and still finish 3rd..

  9. #29
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    I think itís perfectly fair as it is. It encourages everybody within the Clan to participate as every Attack is Valuable to the Final Weekly Total

  10. #30
    Forum All-Star joshsgrandad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PabloB View Post
    I think it’s perfectly fair as it is. It encourages everybody within the Clan to participate as every Attack is Valuable to the Final Weekly Total
    This is true Pablo..
    But his clans experience over 2 seasons shows that at 30v war size those 10 bonus stars for the win are no more than a token payment, due to 90 stars per day being on the board, rather than the 45 that were available when the system was introduced.

    At 15v those 10 stars make a difference, so winning is as crucial as scoring stars, if promotion is the target.
    But Papa Troll summed it up nicely..
    If you want to push, then 15v is the safest option, due to the bonus effect.

    Rizzob and Munitor touched on a good explanation why they didnt increase the bonus award when 30v was introduced.
    CWL promotes growth..
    And with the system being unweighted and based on total stars, rushed offence is the way to go for those that wish to fast track, with key defences and heroes being worked in the short and mid term..
    maxing the base/defences can be back filled later.

    it is what leads to the multiple mismatch threads for those mixed hall maxer and perma max clans, but is a sure fire way of kick starting progression for those that want to be somewhat competitive.

    The same choice is there now as it always was..
    Pick your preferred war type, and forgo the other..
    Random war and cwl are opposite ends of the scale, so far as account build is concerned.

    Either OP needs to push the accounts a little more towards the cwl standard, by upping the offensive power..
    Or just be proud the guys are at their absolute top limit for now

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