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  Click here to go to the first staff post in this thread.   Thread: trying to figure out war weight calculation done by server

  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by joshsgrandad View Post
    Doesnt start for a couple of hours.. fell asleep after work and havent even loaded cc yet..
    The war will happen.. I prefer the matching to the actual war anyway..
    Usually find if I dont perfect, then theres a good chance I will lose.. My accounts run light to try out the MMA.. bows will start once my bottom end closes up.. then we can see how things work.

    Havent looked at your matches.. But your lack of parable matching at the top goes against the theory I been building up whilst doing this project..
    It seems to be happening regular now, so may likely be a pattern forming.. Just gotta put the finger on that pattern, then it is easy to change and fix..
    BTW.. I dont work the roster looking for advantage (I used to at old clan), I just like looking at how it plays..
    The wars themselves, I could care less about, as I said.. Although I like setting the task of trying to perfect.. Dont care if the oppo does likewise tho..

    Life is about learning.. even in a game (what a boring old sod)

    Update on that.. i actually missed the start of the war.. cant remember if I ever did a war before without loading the cc.. They will perfect due to that mistake.. I may struggle on their top 2 bases.. looking like grey or red.
    Falling asleep and not filling the CCs *looks aghast* ... sacrilege

    You know, to be honest, I think what is happening to us at the moment is mostly down to the introduction of the new TH We’ve not drastically changed in overall terms (more TH10s than we used to have I guess is the biggest one), the real variable is TH13. It would be interesting to know if similar issues were highlighted with the introduction of TH12. It won’t affect those clans who run only high level THs or those clans who only have lower level halls. There will be fixes that could resolve this but it’s whether a few clans (if we are truly a rarity these days ) having an uncomfortable time for a while as it evens itself out warrants the development/testing time/cost lol I suspect it doesn’t
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  2. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Belinio View Post
    Falling asleep and not filling the CCs *looks aghast* ... sacrilege

    You know, to be honest, I think what is happening to us at the moment is mostly down to the introduction of the new TH We’ve not drastically changed in overall terms (more TH10s than we used to have I guess is the biggest one), the real variable is TH13. It would be interesting to know if similar issues were highlighted with the introduction of TH12. It won’t affect those clans who run only high level THs or those clans who only have lower level halls. There will be fixes that could resolve this but it’s whether a few clans (if we are truly a rarity these days ) having an uncomfortable time for a while as it evens itself out warrants the development/testing time/cost lol I suspect it doesn’t
    yeah, they perfected easily as expected *shrugs*.. I do like the war log, but time is an issue, so my interest is more about looking and talking than actually playing atm..

    The more I read what you write, the more puzzled I get.. because your views and actions are mostly the same as myself, except lately I keep the top halls (9s) well away from max state, and bench them once bows go down (they either jump to 10 for cwl, or will sit till another day).. Hence why I got so many accounts lol.

    I do think too many at max state will cause issues.. There is also the possibility that the new hall has muddied the water..
    But two variables at once is bad..
    Once those jumps are done, then the 13 effect will be revealed, if it is indeed an issue (and your new halls may create a new problem lol)..

    Not sure the hall itself will do much with the jump from 12, as there is no weight increase till th13 upgrades begin (th13 L1 GI weighs same as th12 L5 GT)..
    What is likely tho, is it will have created a major ripple thru the game, as everyone suddenly leaped back into action with those new toys hitting the shops..
    It is also very possible that since you have a few members at the same stage of development, they simply hit a point whereby coincidentally the MMA starts to shift focus ..

    My rule is Anything can happen once, Twice is coincidence, Three times is a pattern.. You are on coincidence atm..
    Next spin may mean something has changed your spin.. And if others havent noticed anything, it isnt the MMA itself..
    As you said, your guys are always on the move, so likely it will self fix anyway at some point..
    Is just a shame the fun goes out of it during the transition for you.

  3. #103
    Forum Superstar joshsgrandad's Avatar
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    Hmm.. Funny spin this time..
    My now usual 7 bowless 9s.. Only 1x th5 on the bottom now.. tightening up the bottom end..

    They have a 10, complete with 3 bows at the top, and 8x 9s, all carrying bows.. they even finish with a 6..
    their war record is 5-0.

    But i have good hero advantage.. I am on a x.5 build, in that I upgrade existing defence before new (and no bows)..
    They are rushed.. but once again proof that the top hall matching may not be a major priority to the MMA, and other factors have far bigger influence over the draw..

    The hero difference and more robust build of my accounts is glaring.. and judging by their raids so far, they are used to drawing different opposition altogether previously.

  4. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by joshsgrandad View Post
    Hmm.. Funny spin this time..
    My now usual 7 bowless 9s.. Only 1x th5 on the bottom now.. tightening up the bottom end..

    They have a 10, complete with 3 bows at the top, and 8x 9s, all carrying bows.. they even finish with a 6..
    their war record is 5-0.

    But i have good hero advantage.. I am on a x.5 build, in that I upgrade existing defence before new (and no bows)..
    They are rushed.. but once again proof that the top hall matching may not be a major priority to the MMA, and other factors have far bigger influence over the draw..

    The hero difference and more robust build of my accounts is glaring.. and judging by their raids so far, they are used to drawing different opposition altogether previously.
    7 TH9s vs 1 TH10+8 TH9s still considered close, but I also see a bit loser top TH parity after TH13 update.

    MM still try to match top TH, about 40% of our wars after TH13 update has similar top th, I grouped TH12&13 as the same, as th13 at current state still early developed mostly, but I see more then 50% has 20-30% difference in top TH number, and it is quite significant, since before th13 update it is more strict, but it is also not just weight only like mid 2017-2018 period of MM algorithm.

    My take for current MM is they have similar algorithm to before TH13 update but top TH parity maybe becoming second or third check box with slightly higher tolerance
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  5. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by joshsgrandad View Post
    My rule is Anything can happen once, Twice is coincidence, Three times is a pattern.. You are on coincidence atm..
    Next spin may mean something has changed your spin.. And if others havent noticed anything, it isnt the MMA itself..
    As you said, your guys are always on the move, so likely it will self fix anyway at some point..
    Is just a shame the fun goes out of it during the transition for you.
    Third war:

    Us: TH13, TH12, 4 TH11s, 7 TH10s, 5 TH9s, 2 TH8s
    Them: TH13, 3 TH12s, 3 TH11s, 6 TH10s, 4 TH9s, 2 TH8s, TH7

    TH13s are fairly even, reasonably new with a few defences/troops upgraded, reasonably even heroes ... our TH13 3* their #1 in the first attack of war lol Their #1 tried to follow suit, spammed edragons, ended up with two stars, then did exactly the same on our #2 base and ended up with two stars again. So we’ve destroyed their dreams of glory pretty much at the outset
    #2 is a fairly even match, the base design favours our TH12’s favourite attack, so think we have a good chance on that one too.
    #3 our TH11 probably won’t get as it has TH12 xbows, Infernos and eagle ... but you never know our top two TH11s are capable of hitting up for three if the base is right Our TH12 will beat it though or if he has a hiccup our TH13 definitely will.
    Their fourth TH12 is basically a TH11 with an upgraded TH and eagle so one of our top TH11s will be able to nab that one
    Other TH11s fairly even as well
    Their TH10s are awful and their TH9s aren’t great either, low troops and heroes and fairly straightforward bases with mixed level defences and rushed walls
    There’s a rushed TH10 sitting below the TH9s that I three’d with my baby TH9
    Their top TH8 is reasonable, although the war base is pants, but the second one and the TH7 are rubbish I’m pretty sure that these have been stuck in there to hopefully bring the weight of their matches down but it hasn’t worked for them pulling us What’s ironic is that their clan description says that rushed bases won’t be in war, yet they have a bunch of them in there

    Their TH10s have been using GOWIPE on our bases, one used a combi of pekkas and dragons, so they are not doing great They will have six TH12 attacks though, so be able to clean up after their lowers and if they’re smart they’ll drop their 11s to our top 10s and their 12s to our 11s but we’ll have to wait and see how it pans out

    I think we may win this one (we may, just may, even get a perfect war, we will see). I won’t say “will win” as lessons in hubris can turn up at any moment in time But on the basis of “overall matching” I think they’re the ones who are probably entitled to feel slightly hard done by this time. The match favours us; we’re just ripping our way through their bases, so it’s not really much of a challenge.

    I put our second highest TH12 in (defences maxed, walls, heroes and some troop research left) rather than the biggest one and I had to include the two TH8s as a few of my TH11s put their heroes down (how very dare they while I’m experimenting). So hopefully my next spin will be the smaller range of TH11-TH9. Having the TH13 in makes a huge difference obviously, so looks like I just need to be wary for a while when one of them is not available. I want to do a TH11-TH9 to see if we still pull a TH13 and/or multiple TH12s or whether the smaller range brings a more even top (ie TH11s vs TH11s)
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  6. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by Belinio View Post
    Third war:

    Us: TH13, TH12, 4 TH11s, 7 TH10s, 5 TH9s, 2 TH8s
    Them: TH13, 3 TH12s, 3 TH11s, 6 TH10s, 4 TH9s, 2 TH8s, TH7

    TH13s are fairly even, reasonably new with a few defences/troops upgraded, reasonably even heroes ... our TH13 3* their #1 in the first attack of war lol Their #1 tried to follow suit, spammed edragons, ended up with two stars, then did exactly the same on our #2 base and ended up with two stars again. So we’ve destroyed their dreams of glory pretty much at the outset
    #2 is a fairly even match, the base design favours our TH12’s favourite attack, so think we have a good chance on that one too.
    #3 our TH11 probably won’t get as it has TH12 xbows, Infernos and eagle ... but you never know our top two TH11s are capable of hitting up for three if the base is right Our TH12 will beat it though or if he has a hiccup our TH13 definitely will.
    Their fourth TH12 is basically a TH11 with an upgraded TH and eagle so one of our top TH11s will be able to nab that one
    Other TH11s fairly even as well
    Their TH10s are awful and their TH9s aren’t great either, low troops and heroes and fairly straightforward bases with mixed level defences and rushed walls
    There’s a rushed TH10 sitting below the TH9s that I three’d with my baby TH9
    Their top TH8 is reasonable, although the war base is pants, but the second one and the TH7 are rubbish I’m pretty sure that these have been stuck in there to hopefully bring the weight of their matches down but it hasn’t worked for them pulling us What’s ironic is that their clan description says that rushed bases won’t be in war, yet they have a bunch of them in there

    Their TH10s have been using GOWIPE on our bases, one used a combi of pekkas and dragons, so they are not doing great They will have six TH12 attacks though, so be able to clean up after their lowers and if they’re smart they’ll drop their 11s to our top 10s and their 12s to our 11s but we’ll have to wait and see how it pans out

    I think we may win this one (we may, just may, even get a perfect war, we will see). I won’t say “will win” as lessons in hubris can turn up at any moment in time But on the basis of “overall matching” I think they’re the ones who are probably entitled to feel slightly hard done by this time. The match favours us; we’re just ripping our way through their bases, so it’s not really much of a challenge.

    I put our second highest TH12 in (defences maxed, walls, heroes and some troop research left) rather than the biggest one and I had to include the two TH8s as a few of my TH11s put their heroes down (how very dare they while I’m experimenting). So hopefully my next spin will be the smaller range of TH11-TH9. Having the TH13 in makes a huge difference obviously, so looks like I just need to be wary for a while when one of them is not available. I want to do a TH11-TH9 to see if we still pull a TH13 and/or multiple TH12s or whether the smaller range brings a more even top (ie TH11s vs TH11s)
    Sounds like a good crew you got there Belinio.
    post above yours from Sam struck a chord, since I also consider 12 and 13 as same atm (and he is a great guy to take notice of)..

    It does look a little better than previous.. Even tho your playing skill seems to be more tested than theirs.. But if their top end arent quite so advanced, then it simply becomes a colour change (plus they get a couple of extra giga on you)..

    lol on them ruining your experiments.. But it seems you are climbing the other side of that spin dip now..
    Congrats for that, and good luck.

  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by joshsgrandad View Post
    Sounds like a good crew you got there Belinio.
    post above yours from Sam struck a chord, since I also consider 12 and 13 as same atm (and he is a great guy to take notice of)..

    It does look a little better than previous.. Even tho your playing skill seems to be more tested than theirs.. But if their top end arent quite so advanced, then it simply becomes a colour change (plus they get a couple of extra giga on you)..

    lol on them ruining your experiments.. But it seems you are climbing the other side of that spin dip now..
    Congrats for that, and good luck.
    Yes, they are great ... read that note from Sam too and agree re parity and TH priority

    The TH11-9 spin brought us back towards the wonkiness, I didn’t use all the heavyweight TH11s either, used a smaller number of THs in war and a smaller range, 3 levels of TH ... as was suggested may help:

    Us: 4 TH11, 8 TH10, 3 TH9
    Them: 1 TH12, 5 TH11, 7 TH10, 2 TH9

    Their TH12 looks relatively new on first glance, but upgraded enough to have max 5* TH, max xbows, 2 max infernos, max eagle and several TH12 archer towers We’ll just have to be as economic as we can with our hits to clear the rest, so the TH11s have as many whacks at it as possible BUT at least not a TH13 and maybe we’ll get lucky lol

    Their #2 is a fairly high TH11, the rest seem midway-low, similar range with their TH10s, and their TH9s are low. Heroes a mixture throughout too. Match up was very quick, about ten mins. They have the advantage up top again but maybe our middle will be strong enough ... who knows But as majority of wars with decent clans/attackers at our level are usually decided at the top, we’ll have to wait and see ... it’s unusual to find the level of ineptitude we had in that clan that outgunned us up top that we mullered a couple of wars ago

    Next one I’m bunging the engineer in to see how that does ... will brace myself for a lot of pink walls and wonky bases lol

    Think we’re just going to have to face the fact that until our TH12/13s are a little more established that we’re going to have a few black eyes up top
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  8. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by Belinio View Post
    Yes, they are great ... read that note from Sam too and agree re parity and TH priority

    The TH11-9 spin brought us back towards the wonkiness, I didn’t use all the heavyweight TH11s either, used a smaller number of THs in war and a smaller range, 3 levels of TH ... as was suggested may help:

    Us: 4 TH11, 8 TH10, 3 TH9
    Them: 1 TH12, 5 TH11, 7 TH10, 2 TH9

    Their TH12 looks relatively new on first glance, but upgraded enough to have max 5* TH, max xbows, 2 max infernos, max eagle and several TH12 archer towers We’ll just have to be as economic as we can with our hits to clear the rest, so the TH11s have as many whacks at it as possible BUT at least not a TH13 and maybe we’ll get lucky lol

    Their #2 is a fairly high TH11, the rest seem midway-low, similar range with their TH10s, and their TH9s are low. Heroes a mixture throughout too. Match up was very quick, about ten mins. They have the advantage up top again but maybe our middle will be strong enough ... who knows But as majority of wars with decent clans/attackers at our level are usually decided at the top, we’ll have to wait and see ... it’s unusual to find the level of ineptitude we had in that clan that outgunned us up top that we mullered a couple of wars ago

    Next one I’m bunging the engineer in to see how that does ... will brace myself for a lot of pink walls and wonky bases lol

    Think we’re just going to have to face the fact that until our TH12/13s are a little more established that we’re going to have a few black eyes up top
    looks like you cant win, so far as the draw goes lol..
    You picked the most common war size, break down doesnt look too bad (maybe change a 10 or two for 9s), matched quickly..
    And still up against it..

    We are starting to run out of variables..
    If your lop sider switched the draw to rushers, you are in business..
    Not sure that one account would do a lot amongst that weight tho..

    On a plus side, you get to play with the roster whilst the others are busy growing fat again..
    Maybe balance a high for level with a fairly new (or your engi), and a couple of mid build.. In theory that could draw 4 mid builds, with your anchor being the heavy guy in the war..
    Or low load.. Aim to dilute the roster weight with the addition of lighter bases (in your case 9s or 8s)..
    The two attack rule will pay dividends, once you hit the sweet spot.. Just a pity finding that sweet spot for you is proving very elusive.

    As an aside (slightly).. i like to look at the break down I draw against.. more so if it goes against me..Can sometimes see how advantage is gained by the roster build (Sam and Major Johnson are deffo your guys there)

  9. #109
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    So in TMBG we've lost two in a row for the first time ever. the first loss was just us not able to execute at the top, was a good matchup. the second though was another one of these th13s aligned opposite our 12s. here's the lineup with heroes:

    https://ibb.co/YZkTmMM

    Their top base had maxed EA, two level 1 Scatters, and a few other maxed d, and level 4 GI. Their 2 had one scatter, maxed EA, level 1GI, and mostly th12 point D. both had rushed walls.

    They won 43-42, but would have won even if we'd managed 43 as they had good% on the bases they didn't 3. They basically dipped all over the place, the top 4 easily getting all but 2*and only leaving 15% on the table in our top 7. Which allowed the rest of their garbage tens to easily get our new tens and lower bases.

    here's the hit rate:
    https://ibb.co/KL7dR39
    Last edited by Thegreatpuma; 3 Weeks Ago at 12:45 PM.

  10. #110
    We just lost our streak of 15 and the very next match we had a big advantage and perfected them (only 10v10) easily with attacks to spare. Cooincidence? Maybe.

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