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Thread: Sandbagging in cwl

  1. #21
    Millennial Club gregenstein's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yachi View Post
    I did some calculations based on my own clan's experience in another thread, just to share below:

    This is based on a comparison between staying at #2 spot in M3 for two seasons, versus getting promoted to M2 and getting trashed.



    This was just on bonus rewards. There are other factors to be considered, like the ability to score a min of 8 stars to gain max rewards (considering lower bases having to hit upwards), the lack of options to rotate rosters since fielding the strongest roster is needed to even stand a chance at winning, team morale (I don't think anyone enjoys losing due to roster strength).

    Having said this, my team is set on getting promoted after this season to M2. As mentioned in another thread, we are not deliberately tanking, just doing our usual best, and we should be winning all 7 matches this season with a strong lead in number of stars. We only have 10 TH12s, and reading somewhere that M2 is seeing 13 - 15 TH12s in their roster, we expect to drop the following season. At the end of the day, it all depends on the enjoyment of the game, and how each clan organises their team to achieve that, so if a team decides to sand bag to enjoy the maximum benefits, I can completely understand them.
    While you may not be wrong, real life I think comes into play. Can you actually accomplish your goal of finishing 2nd in the lower league each time, or do you sometimes finish 2nd, sometimes 3rd, sometimes 4th, etc? My clan was in Crystal 1 in June, and we're in M2 this CWL and about to finish 4th or 5th.

    Sandbagging makes the assumption that you will automatically get demoted again the following season and get your guts stomped out in the higher league. In reality, I think if you are good enough to get your clan into position to finish 2nd *every* CWL in a certain league, that means you probably are good enough to finish maybe 5th or 6th or even higher in that higher league, and should just take your shot and find out. The medals in the end will roughly wash out if you do get demoted, but you will have risked little for a potential bigger gain. And we lost a war or two because we had a lot of guys have 1 star attacks, but that's ok. Still hacked it in the higher league and we'll be back in it next CWL, even though we realize it's a tougher league.
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  2. #22
    Forum Veteran Thegreatpuma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yachi View Post
    I did some calculations based on my own clan's experience in another thread, just to share below:

    This is based on a comparison between staying at #2 spot in M3 for two seasons, versus getting promoted to M2 and getting trashed.



    This was just on bonus rewards. There are other factors to be considered, like the ability to score a min of 8 stars to gain max rewards (considering lower bases having to hit upwards), the lack of options to rotate rosters since fielding the strongest roster is needed to even stand a chance at winning, team morale (I don't think anyone enjoys losing due to roster strength).

    Having said this, my team is set on getting promoted after this season to M2. As mentioned in another thread, we are not deliberately tanking, just doing our usual best, and we should be winning all 7 matches this season with a strong lead in number of stars. We only have 10 TH12s, and reading somewhere that M2 is seeing 13 - 15 TH12s in their roster, we expect to drop the following season. At the end of the day, it all depends on the enjoyment of the game, and how each clan organises their team to achieve that, so if a team decides to sand bag to enjoy the maximum benefits, I can completely understand them.


    I have done these calculations before. The problem with your scenario is that it is highly unlikely that you're going to be good enough to win at will in one tier and then be unable to win ANY in the next tier. So, it's more likely you will get 2+ wins the next tier up. I guess it's possible that you get an unlucky group and get hammered, but that would be rare.
    Last edited by Thegreatpuma; October 9th, 2019 at 02:03 PM.
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  3. #23
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    I Agree with the guys.. Its only cwl, so suck it and see.

    As for morale.. Once again it is cwl, an unweighted system where anything can happen.. No adverse thoughts should be anywhere near the system, unless you are in the top tiers, and pushing for glory..

    Just go for it.. The worst that can happen is a few bonuses less may be given out next season.. Nobody that is scouting the clan is gonna think wow, they do well in cwl, because nobody knows what rosters were used.. They simply look at regular war.. The weighted system.

    Nothing ventured, nothing gained

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by samratulangi View Post
    which clan?
    Sent a PM about clan mate.. Not sure how open the guys are. Am sure they would welcome an old friend tho.

  5. #25
    Forum Veteran Yachi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gregenstein View Post
    While you may not be wrong, real life I think comes into play. Can you actually accomplish your goal of finishing 2nd in the lower league each time, or do you sometimes finish 2nd, sometimes 3rd, sometimes 4th, etc? My clan was in Crystal 1 in June, and we're in M2 this CWL and about to finish 4th or 5th.

    Sandbagging makes the assumption that you will automatically get demoted again the following season and get your guts stomped out in the higher league. In reality, I think if you are good enough to get your clan into position to finish 2nd *every* CWL in a certain league, that means you probably are good enough to finish maybe 5th or 6th or even higher in that higher league, and should just take your shot and find out. The medals in the end will roughly wash out if you do get demoted, but you will have risked little for a potential bigger gain. And we lost a war or two because we had a lot of guys have 1 star attacks, but that's ok. Still hacked it in the higher league and we'll be back in it next CWL, even though we realize it's a tougher league.
    Quote Originally Posted by Thegreatpuma View Post
    I have done these calculations before. The problem with your scenario is that it is highly unlikely that you're going to be good enough to win at will in one tier and then be unable to win ANY in the next tier. So, it's more likely you will get 2+ wins the next tier up. I guess it's possible that you get an unlucky group and get hammered, but that would be rare.
    Just to share a little, although I mentioned I can understand why people choose to sandbag for the reasons stated earlier, my clan was trying their best all the time except 1 season, which we ended up in 4th place. In the last 4 seasons, we ended up in 2nd place. This season is the first time we took first place and is set for promotion in November. I wouldn't consider it done at will... we just had that one clan (I did not run any checks, but I suspect they could have been previously demoted from M2) that outdid everyone else to get promoted.

    We have been in M2 before. It was a massacre... that is why it left a very bad taste in the mouth from that experience. But that was a year ago, and probably in the early stages of sorting out clans to their respective leagues. Perhaps it is better now, we will get to find out in November. The calculations were done taking into account the worst case scenario. It may not be as bad as we think.


  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yachi View Post
    Just to share a little, although I mentioned I can understand why people choose to sandbag for the reasons stated earlier, my clan was trying their best all the time except 1 season, which we ended up in 4th place. In the last 4 seasons, we ended up in 2nd place. This season is the first time we took first place and is set for promotion in November. I wouldn't consider it done at will... we just had that one clan (I did not run any checks, but I suspect they could have been previously demoted from M2) that outdid everyone else to get promoted.

    We have been in M2 before. It was a massacre... that is why it left a very bad taste in the mouth from that experience. But that was a year ago, and probably in the early stages of sorting out clans to their respective leagues. Perhaps it is better now, we will get to find out in November. The calculations were done taking into account the worst case scenario. It may not be as bad as we think.
    It may or may not cost you in medals Yachi.. Only time will tell..
    But at least you and the guys have achieved on a personal level, which is far more important.
    Congrats, and good luck next season

  7. #27
    Forum Veteran Yachi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by joshsgrandad View Post
    It may or may not cost you in medals Yachi.. Only time will tell..
    But at least you and the guys have achieved on a personal level, which is far more important.
    Congrats, and good luck next season
    Thank you... I'll post an update on the situation next month.


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