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  Click here to go to the first staff post in this thread.   Thread: Cwl medal distribution and mismatching.

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by HonoraryGoblin View Post
    ajax and tosti: i'm with you. my point is off the op's suggestion that champs would be for all th12s. so any clan rostering all th12's no matter how scraggly/scrappy would get automatically thrown into champs

    and if they lose, so what? they get more medals in 8th place champs than 1st place gold. next season they won't get bumped down in the op's system because they are all 12s and automatically thrown in champs again. all reward no drawback

    i was using it to show how absurd(?) the op's suggestion would become as people game the system
    "Automatically thrown into champs". When did I say that a clan with all th 12s will automatically be in champs. Let's say there is clan of 50 th 12s and happen to be scrappy attackers then they will go down in masters and recruit some th 11s and drop some th 12s. (pls refer to the replies to Luicetarro).

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by spark09 View Post
    OK.
    I said th 11 need not necessarily stay at 11. Now continue.
    ????

    What I originally quoted (from you) was your statement to me that you contended that tiers are in fact separate leagues. In my response I clearly established that question is what I was responding to within the first paragraph, then used as an example how players not teams, shift leagues.

    So is it that you still have the (erroneous) belief that "tiers" are actually "leagues" and that when a clan is promoted or demoted, that the entire team as a whole shifts from one "league" to another?
    Last edited by rowman; June 6th, 2019 at 11:02 AM.

  3.   Click here to go to the next staff post in this thread.   #23
    Quote Originally Posted by HonoraryGoblin View Post
    ajax and tosti: i'm with you. my point is off the op's suggestion that champs would be for all th12s. so any clan rostering all th12's no matter how scraggly/scrappy would get automatically thrown into champs

    and if they lose, so what? they get more medals in 8th place champs than 1st place gold. next season they won't get bumped down in the op's system because they are all 12s and automatically thrown in champs again. all reward no drawback

    i was using it to show how absurd(?) the op's suggestion would become as people game the system
    Fair enough. I missed that you were referring back to that suggestion. And completely agree it would be absurd.
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  4. #24
    Senior Member VicThorious's Avatar
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    I see the OP's point.
    CWL is a broken model: works well for champs 1/2 cos all bases are max 12s, all the rest is a complete mismatch and those who suffer the most are the most skilled players who think they should get more medals if they face higher th bases
    My mini clan is in gold 3 and it's a complete joke, we face on average bases that are 2 levels higher (a th10 mirrors a th12). Some of these bases are rushed, some are poorly designed but even a poor attacker manages to clear a low th which may feel it's unfair
    Last edited by VicThorious; June 7th, 2019 at 08:33 AM.

  5. #25
    Senior Member VicThorious's Avatar
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    P.S. two leagues ago, an all th12 layout decided to compete in crystal3. You may say those guys are useless but I think they didn't care and actually enjoyed crushing the other 7 clans. For the other 7 clans, it was a real pain to make an effort.
    I know it adds complexity to the award algorithm, but there should be bonus and penalties if you attack higher or lower base to bring more justice

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by spark09 View Post
    "Automatically thrown into champs". When did I say that a clan with all th 12s will automatically be in champs. Let's say there is clan of 50 th 12s and happen to be scrappy attackers then they will go down in masters and recruit some th 11s and drop some th 12s. (pls refer to the replies to Luicetarro).
    What if they canít recruit some th11. Or what if they donít want to kick out loyal members. Would they not be able to play? You talk as if recruiting high level players is as easy as posting a message in global.

    You said it yourself, no system is perfect. The current system has itís flaws, but your system would create numerous problems without really fixing anything other than different hall colors. A matchmaking based CWL has been suggested in many shapes and forms and most agree that it would create more problems than it solves. CWL is ladder play, if you are facing clans with heavier rosters, congrats, you have higher than average skill.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kevinwhit View Post
    What if they canít recruit some th11. Or what if they donít want to kick out loyal members. Would they not be able to play? You talk as if recruiting high level players is as easy as posting a message in global.

    You said it yourself, no system is perfect. The current system has itís flaws, but your system would create numerous problems without really fixing anything other than different hall colors. A matchmaking based CWL has been suggested in many shapes and forms and most agree that it would create more problems than it solves. CWL is ladder play, if you are facing clans with heavier rosters, congrats, you have higher than average skill.
    You may not realise it but you are giving an argument against yourself. Let me try to explain.

    We have a clan where we mainly have th 10s and we reach the lvl where we r facing th 11s and 12s. Now if we want to proceed higher we will have to kick some th 10s(loyal members) and recruit some 11s and 12s. You are right, it's not easy to recruit higher th but I am sure that recruiting a 11 will be easier than recruiting a 12. So if u r worried that an all th 12 clan will have difficulty recruiting a th11 then you should also be worried about an all th 10 clan trying to recruit th 12. Also note that with current system th 12s are way more in demand compared to th 11 whereas in New system every th will be in demand. Some clan will be needing th 11s, some will be needing 10s while some will be needing 12s.

    Another option that my clan has is to deliberately lose battles in one or two cwl sessions in a hope to get matched with th 10s and 11s. Yes we have above average skills and current system is discouraging us to show them. It is forcing us to lose willingly because there is no fun in attacking a th 12 from th 10. All joy of planning for 3 star is gone. And I think that games which are more fun becomes more popular. Don't give people an idea to look toward other strategy base games.
    You may see it as different color Hall system while some other may see it as an opportunity to have the joy of 3 staring an equal opponent.

    Now I have shown that the flaw you are trying to point out in new system is the flaw that already exists in the game with current system. In addition to this, current system has a major flaw of snatching away the fun from majority of players and repelling people away from game.

  8. #28
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    the flaw of this whole thread and the gazillion others like it is that you want to force equality of outcomes using the "governing agency" so everyone has to be like you ("dulling sameness") with the underlying reason being if you can hold others down you carve out an advantage to get more goodies for yourself by doing nothing to improve yourself

    welcome to millennial socialism

    competition breeds success and failure. winners and losers

    winners improve themselves through hardship. they improvise, adapt, and overcome

    losers whine about fairness on message boards

    not being rude. stating facts

    [edit: not judging any person only the merits of the idea as posted. which shoe you perceive yourself wearing is your perception not mine. i merely provided the shoes so you could see which one fits you for yourself]
    Last edited by HonoraryGoblin; June 7th, 2019 at 05:05 PM.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by HonoraryGoblin View Post
    the flaw of this whole thread and the gazillion others like it is that you want to force equality of outcomes using the "governing agency" so everyone has to be like you ("dulling sameness") with the underlying reason being if you can hold others down you carve out an advantage to get more goodies for yourself by doing nothing to improve yourself

    welcome to millennial socialism

    competition breeds success and failure. winners and losers

    winners improve themselves through hardship. they improvise, adapt, and overcome

    losers whine about fairness on message boards

    not being rude. stating facts

    [edit: not judging any person only the merits of the idea as posted. which shoe you perceive yourself wearing is your perception not mine. i merely provided the shoes so you could see which one fits you for yourself]
    Competition!!!... Winners!!!!... Losers!!!!...

    Take any competition, Football, basketball, cricket, any. There is categorisation. Under 14, under 17, under 19. Let's take judo, Taekwondo, there is even further categories, 40-45 weight, 45-50, 50-55 and so on. Players compete in these constraints and then winner or loser in decided.

    Let's say there is no categorisation like this. Some bunch of 19 year old guys crushed a team of 14 year old kids in a football match and we call them winners. When kids went to governing body with their complaint they were told that it was all fair. Just because other team players were born before you and they have spent more time, energy and money to reach the age of 19, its completely fine for them to crush you and take away the price money. They were also told to stop whining and were asked to improvise, adapt and overcome. Similarly when a 45 kg player will lose to a 80 kg player during a judo match, he will be told to put more effort in eating and increase his weight by 35 kg and grow a nice big belly like a panda.

    An under 14 competition have all players under 14 and if this sameness looks dull to you then it's ur problem. Rest of the world is enjoying the "dulling sameness".

    Just stating facts.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by spark09 View Post
    Competition!!!... Winners!!!!... Losers!!!!...
    .......
    An under 14 competition have all players under 14 and if this sameness looks dull to you then it's ur problem. Rest of the world is enjoying the "dulling sameness".

    Just stating facts.
    Great, so you do understand! In all those cases you stated there are separate and distinct leagues for every age, or weight class. So you are asking for n Leagues, with no movement based upon by performance.

    Your words .... "For example : if a clan is in, let's say, crystal 2 league then there can be a rule that u cannot have more than 4 th 12s in your line up, 5 th 11s and so on( for 15v15 battle)." That is not "A league for 14 to 16 year olds", that is "Yeah, a 5 year old can be beat up by 18 year olds provided there are no more than four 18 year olds are doing the beating".

    If you really want a league as you are inferring, it would be something like this:
    + 8 and under League: All players must be no higher than TH 8
    + 9 & 10 League: All players must be either TH 9 or 10
    + 10 & 11 League: All players must be either TH 10 or 11
    + TH 12 Lightweight League: TH 12s only with a war weight no greater than x
    + TH 12 Heavyweight League: TH 12, no weight restrictions.
    Last edited by rowman; June 7th, 2019 at 06:30 PM.

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