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Thread: Does Clan War Leagues make you strongly consider maxing your engineered bases?

  1. #91
    Millennial Club MajorJohnson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2222 View Post
    On sign up day (I think it might be 2 days) each clan that wants in will designate the players eligible for war that week. Not everyone who is on that roster has to actually get into the 15 for the war each day, but the 15 must come from that roster. The top 15 from that roster will determine which tier you get put in the very first time. After that, weight no longer matters. You will go up or down based on how you do during league week.

    No one will get placed into tier 1, they will have to win to get into it.

    The non-maxed bases clans, which is most clans, will be in lower tiers earning rewards that will help them max out faster.
    Well it seems like you will able to add more than 15 members which makes me wonder how league placement would work. You are also kinda forced to try to constantly add weight else fight alot of unwinnable wars if you had big bases on one season but not the next if there carry over.

    Would each win/loss over the consecutive days bring you up or down in a tier over initial placement? Does it reset each month? Does it rank bases by their TH or their war weight?

  2. #92
    Millennial Club PapaTroll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2222 View Post
    In war leagues the engineer attacks 7 times and defends seven times compared to regular wars where it would attack 14 times and still only defend 7 times. That makes the account with offense ahead of defense not as valuable in war leagues, although that isnít the main reason traditional engineering is a disadvantage in war leagues. The lack of weight in the matchmaker is the main reason.
    While it is true that the engineer defends seven times, but it is only once against each team. You win by winning more stars than the team in second place. As long as the engineer can earn more stars against all teams than he surrenders against the single second best team, then it is not the "definite disadvantage" we have been discussing for the last seven months.

    Of course a full strength TH11 is more valuable than an engineered TH11 in all situations. This is true in clan wars. This will still be true in CWL. But if you don't have enough 12/11/10 to fill an entire roster then bringing your engineer is the next best thing. You may not make it into the top tier, but just because I am not listed among the top 200 players on earth doesn't stop me from enjoying the game.

    When you look at the rewards structure, you may see what I mean.

    You get medals for participation. No penalty for engineers.
    You get medals for stars. Engineers, despite their weak defense, score stars.
    You get medals for winning your league. One out of eight wins, seven lose. But the win is based on winning stars, and engineers score stars. The engineer penalty, stars surrendered, is diluted among all seven opposition clans. But every star won goes onto my score.

    To be clear, I will say it again. THIS WILL NOT NOT NOT GET YOU TO THE TOP TIERS. But for the average Joe's in tiers 8 through 12, where th bell curve is going to dump most of us, there is no disadvantage to end engineering.

    Or as I said before, for the hoi polloi, the defacto effect will be de minimus.

    These forums are English only. Please refrain from speaking ancient Greek or Latin.
    Listen, and understand! That Engineer is out there! It can't be bargained with. It can't be reasoned with. It doesn't feel pain. It doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear. And it absolutely will not stop... ever, until your win streak is broken.

  3. #93
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    Agreed only in part Papa. If you happen to be working your way up the tiers, an engineer may gain you stars. It stops winning you stars when your wins start moving you up in leagues where those stars get harder and harder to achieve. Once your clan reaches its balance point, the engineer starts to hurt you defensively and starts being ineffective in obtaining stars. Ergo, any ‘advantage’ is nullified.

  4. #94
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    I suppose the question of upgrading the said engi base depends on where ones preference lies.
    As CWL unleashes, it is a 1 week per month event. For the other 3 weeks of the month it is business as usual, with random spins.
    Since the manicured account is preferential for that clans random spins, then it is unlikely that any change would be considered, Certainly not in the early days, where people start jockeying for tier stability. And as already pointed out, a lighter weight defence is not putting the clan under unbearable pressure, so that they enforce a drop defence or drop out rule. At least, not for the short term.
    The decision will be made at a much later date than now, if a clan wishes to push for a higher tier standing, or random becomes the clans secondary aim.
    I myself am looking forward to getting going, simply because the carrot that is the win streak/war log will be removed, so is a no pressure zone.

  5. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by joshsgrandad View Post
    I suppose the question of upgrading the said engi base depends on where ones preference lies.
    As CWL unleashes, it is a 1 week per month event. For the other 3 weeks of the month it is business as usual, with random spins.
    Since the manicured account is preferential for that clans random spins, then it is unlikely that any change would be considered, Certainly not in the early days, where people start jockeying for tier stability. And as already pointed out, a lighter weight defence is not putting the clan under unbearable pressure, so that they enforce a drop defence or drop out rule. At least, not for the short term.
    The decision will be made at a much later date than now, if a clan wishes to push for a higher tier standing, or random becomes the clans secondary aim.
    I myself am looking forward to getting going, simply because the carrot that is the win streak/war log will be removed, so is a no pressure zone.
    I am looking forward to it as well since win streak and the war log are such poor indicators of how skilled a clan is given the manipulation of the matches that take place today.

  6. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tosti111 View Post
    Agreed only in part Papa. If you happen to be working your way up the tiers, an engineer may gain you stars. It stops winning you stars when your wins start moving you up in leagues where those stars get harder and harder to achieve. Once your clan reaches its balance point, the engineer starts to hurt you defensively and starts being ineffective in obtaining stars. Ergo, any ‘advantage’ is nullified.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tosti111 View Post
    I am looking forward to it as well since win streak and the war log are such poor indicators of how skilled a clan is given the manipulation of the matches that take place today.
    I think Papa has said offense lopsided engineers will be happy to reside in mid tier league.

    For the long WS clan current engineers I think will not be too interested in CWL, since most of them actually dont have offense to compete in CWL, because of manicured offense, or they will only use the normal accts if they want to compete
    https://www.clashofstats.com/clans/a...VLPP80/members

    Engineered clan focused on crafting optimized bases

  7. #97
    Quote Originally Posted by MajorJohnson View Post
    Well it seems like you will able to add more than 15 members which makes me wonder how league placement would work. You are also kinda forced to try to constantly add weight else fight alot of unwinnable wars if you had big bases on one season but not the next if there carry over.

    Would each win/loss over the consecutive days bring you up or down in a tier over initial placement? Does it reset each month? Does it rank bases by their TH or their war weight?
    You can designate 15-50 members to be eligible to war. Each day for 7 days straight your clan will go to war with 15 of the players from your list. Yes, if you have a bunch of big accounts leave your clan, it will hurt you in future wars. No, you only move up or down a tier at the end of the 7 wars.


    Quote Originally Posted by PapaTroll View Post
    While it is true that the engineer defends seven times, but it is only once against each team. You win by winning more stars than the team in second place. As long as the engineer can earn more stars against all teams than he surrenders against the single second best team, then it is not the "definite disadvantage" we have been discussing for the last seven months.

    Of course a full strength TH11 is more valuable than an engineered TH11 in all situations. This is true in clan wars. This will still be true in CWL. But if you don't have enough 12/11/10 to fill an entire roster then bringing your engineer is the next best thing. You may not make it into the top tier, but just because I am not listed among the top 200 players on earth doesn't stop me from enjoying the game.

    When you look at the rewards structure, you may see what I mean.

    You get medals for participation. No penalty for engineers.
    You get medals for stars. Engineers, despite their weak defense, score stars.
    You get medals for winning your league. One out of eight wins, seven lose. But the win is based on winning stars, and engineers score stars. The engineer penalty, stars surrendered, is diluted among all seven opposition clans. But every star won goes onto my score.

    To be clear, I will say it again. THIS WILL NOT NOT NOT GET YOU TO THE TOP TIERS. But for the average Joe's in tiers 8 through 12, where th bell curve is going to dump most of us, there is no disadvantage to end engineering.

    Or as I said before, for the hoi polloi, the defacto effect will be de minimus.

    These forums are English only. Please refrain from speaking ancient Greek or Latin.
    Everything you have said here is true but doesn’t mention the fact that the engineer would be better off building defenses since there is no weight to them. That is not necessarily true in regular wars. I do agree of course an engineered or rushed th11 is going to be better than, say, a max th8. Again, though, that th11 will be even better if it builds all defenses. Many probably won’t care and will stay engineered because they will care more about regular wars and will prefer to keep playing at a disadvantage in war league.
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