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Thread: Siege Machineó friend or foe?

  1. #1
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    Siege Machineó friend or foe?

    I did a search and didnít find a corresponding thread; I hope this isnít a repeat of a thread.

    Iíve been with the same core group for about four years. We started the war clan thing about three years ago. Our bases have grown up together and weíve endured many changes and updates, both good and bad. Weíre maxers and take the game seriously enough to research, practice, come home from work early for war attacks, etc. When TH12was released, I was only short on some walls and we decided that I should do the TH12 ug so we could have sieges.

    What weíve noticed since Iíve become a 12 is that our matches are horrible even though our rosters are essentially the same. In the past, thatís been okay, because our strategy and skill compensated for our lower town halls. Itís different now and I think itís because of the siege.

    Unless you forget to choose the siege before an attack, chances are any dip will result in a three star with a siege. Now that townhalls are again being placed outside of the base, most jumps amount to a decent percentage two star. So, a warís outcome essentially comes down to who has the most higher level townhalls capable of dipping and getting a three star without much skill. Thatís due to the siege, I think.

    Iím very curious to know otherís opinion on this. It used to be that weíd watch attacks and admire strategical nuances; now, we just watch spray/pray/siege.

    Obviously, this is also a matchmaking issue. Weíve never had this many losses in such a short time and, since the update, weíve had our one TH12 face at least two TH12s in every war. Our 11s are routinely outnumbered, too. Before the siege, this might not have been as ominous, but the siege seems to have lessened the effects of skil and strategy.
    Proud coleader of Ancient Hunters (#82R2G08U), a US based, adult war clan

  2. #2
    Hmm...I like siege machine. Its allowing each townhall to finally get 3s with some confidence.

    Our 10s can 3 enemy 10s and our 11s can 3 the enemy 11s.

    Were not seeing very much dipping in our wars at all anymore.
    Co-Leader of Monkey Bizness. Lv 18 constant war clan. #GV228Q9
    The Frosty Trinity
    Blaze - TH12 - K60/Q56/W30
    Fire - TH12 - K50/Q50/W20
    Inferno - TH12 - K50/Q50/W20


  3. #3
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    Sorry to hear about your string of bad luck. It sounds like growing pains. Base design will take some time to adjust. Siege and new troop levels have made it a little bit easier to dip attack.

    TH12 is the new 11. TH11 is the new 10. Dips are dips and should be easier to 3 three star.

    Maxers have always had this issue. If you have any max 11s they should go to 12. Same with 10s. And if they move up, have them build all new defenses immediately.

    Best of luck!

  4. #4
    Forum Champion Warios's Avatar
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    IMO as soon as you start to run engineered bases, MM can do weird things. I would drop the 50/50/20 with no IT's or EA, and see if that helps even out the number of top end hits each clan has. And both sides have Siege Machines available so that also keeps it at an even playing field.

    your recent war, 1 th12 to 2 th12, 5 th11 to 4 th11, fairly even at the top, at this time since th12 are not very developed yet defensively.


    then lower down, they win on the engineered TH11 numbers that sit amongst the th10's or lower.
    Last edited by Warios; July 12th, 2018 at 04:15 AM.
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  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Easyluck View Post
    Sorry to hear about your string of bad luck. It sounds like growing pains. Base design will take some time to adjust. Siege and new troop levels have made it a little bit easier to dip attack.

    TH12 is the new 11. TH11 is the new 10. Dips are dips and should be easier to 3 three star.

    Maxers have always had this issue. If you have any max 11s they should go to 12. Same with 10s. And if they move up, have them build all new defenses immediately.

    Best of luck!

    Thank you for the kind words! Thatís what I was thinking, too. We just arenít that practiced at losing like this!
    Proud coleader of Ancient Hunters (#82R2G08U), a US based, adult war clan

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    Thank you! I guess that was our issue...it wasn’t close to equal at the top. Their 2 was much stronger than my week old TH12! In the past, we could compensate for that imbalance with solid attacks, but the siege has kind of nerfed that.

    i think I just need to build the proverbial bridge and get over it....appreciate all the insights!
    Proud coleader of Ancient Hunters (#82R2G08U), a US based, adult war clan

  7. #7
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    Has the offense on each side in your matches been approximately similar? If, as we suspect, eagles and infernos now weigh much less, then the predicted result, if you are warring with any engineered bases, is for offense to be similar and opponent defense to be better (if the opponent is not engineered, or less engineered).

  8. #8
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    [QUOTE=littledoctor;11790652]Has the offense on each side in your matches been approximately similar? If, as we suspect, eagles and infernos now weigh much less, then the predicted result, if you are warring with any engineered bases, is for offense to be similar and opponent defense to be better (if the opponent is not engineered, or less engineered).[/QUOT

    Thanks, Little Doctor, for the questions!

    Offenses havenít been similar at the top, but theyíre similar from 10 down. Weíre seeing a lot of bottom bait and those bases that have only cannons. In our last war, a 25x25, the enemy put 5 bottom baits in. None of their 10s had infernos. We had about the same number of 11s and those were offensively and defensively similar. Their two 12s, though, were stacked offensively and defensively. Iím our only 12 atm and Iíve only been a 12 for a week. At the time, I had added all the new traps and the Tesla. I did a Queen and barb ug and I had two upgraded camps. My only troop ug were bowlers. Their two 12s had all camps upgraded, the th was upgraded twice, and they had fully maxed war comps.

    We have a friend of the clan visiting and heís a 10.5. Could that one base have triggered this kind of a match for us??
    Last edited by Rebecca00; July 12th, 2018 at 04:40 PM.

  9. #9
    [QUOTE=Rebecca00;11791083]
    Quote Originally Posted by littledoctor View Post
    Has the offense on each side in your matches been approximately similar? If, as we suspect, eagles and infernos now weigh much less, then the predicted result, if you are warring with any engineered bases, is for offense to be similar and opponent defense to be better (if the opponent is not engineered, or less engineered).[/QUOT

    Thanks, Little Doctor, for the questions!

    Offenses haven’t been similar at the top, but they’re similar from 10 down. We’re seeing a lot of bottom bait and those bases that have only cannons. In our last war, a 25x25, the enemy put 5 bottom baits in. None of their 10s had infernos. We had about the same number of 11s and those were offensively and defensively similar. Their two 12s, though, were stacked offensively and defensively. I’m our only 12 atm and I’ve only been a 12 for a week. At the time, I had added all the new traps and the Tesla. I did a Queen and barb ug and I had two upgraded camps. My only troop ug were bowlers. Their two 12s had all camps upgraded, the th was upgraded twice, and they had fully maxed war comps.

    We have a friend of the clan visiting and he’s a 10.5. Could that one base have triggered this kind of a match for us??
    it's possible but then again so is anything when it comes to the matchmaker. i will say you guys seem to win most of your matches so were the recent one or two bad match-ups an abnormality?

    if so i would consider the 10.5 as being a reason.
    Co-Leader of Monkey Bizness. Lv 18 constant war clan. #GV228Q9
    The Frosty Trinity
    Blaze - TH12 - K60/Q56/W30
    Fire - TH12 - K50/Q50/W20
    Inferno - TH12 - K50/Q50/W20


  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warios View Post
    IMO as soon as you start to run engineered bases, MM can do weird things. I would drop the 50/50/20 with no IT's or EA, and see if that helps even out the number of top end hits each clan has. And both sides have Siege Machines available so that also keeps it at an even playing field.

    your recent war, 1 th12 to 2 th12, 5 th11 to 4 th11, fairly even at the top, at this time since th12 are not very developed yet defensively.


    then lower down, they win on the engineered TH11 numbers that sit amongst the th10's or lower.
    I am in Rebecca's clan. Even before the TH12 upgrade when we were strictly maxing, I was noticing that we were often out numbered on TH11s and EA. For instance, if we had 5 TH11s with say 9 levels of EAs then the opponent would have 6-8 11s with 11-12 levels of EAs. But then we were rarely matched with engies. It would be usually 0 sometimes 1 or 2 sandbaggers. The last few wars, especially the last two we've seen 10s and 11s from top to bottom. I never added hero levels up back then - this could have been the difference. We usually won these wars anyway, and they were always close, so clearly the MM was working well.

    As for the specific account you reference, we're going to ask him to drop his missing TH10 defenses. My guess is he will also need to drop the TH11s too, but he's a great attacker so we're going to take it slow.

    Finally, we usually run with THs down to level 8. I talked to leadership about dropping that to 12-10 (which would actually exclude me from war heh). I don't really like this and think it's a bit ridiculous that to get a good war you've got to leave out low level players (I mean seriously, having a few 7s and 8s at the bottom shouldn't mean you suddenly get matched against opponents with 8 sandbaggers), but I get it. Right now the consensus is we're going to continue taking down to 8. I guess eventually that might change although we will probably wait until at least the time at which SC thinks they've fixed the engineering issue.
    Last edited by Thegreatpuma; July 12th, 2018 at 05:18 PM.

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