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Thread: The Official Forum Leaderboards V2!

  1. #11
    Tomville's Avatar
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    There seems to have been some strong reactions to what I wrote, and some misunderstandings of what was meant.

    In no way was it a suggestion to “rewrite history”: what happened happened. My concern is somewhere else, as will hopefully become clear.

    Saying that banned members are “no longer part of the community” is true by definition: they were once a part of this community but unfortunately repeatedly proved unable to keep their behaviour within the forum requirements and so were removed from the community as the ultimate disciplinary action.

    The point I was getting at was a thought that came up for me reading the words of the quote in the OP: “deserve credit for great accomplishments”. It’s pretty obvious how high rep could be called that, but not immediately so clear how high traffic to one’s page or high number of VM might. To make sense of these being called “great accomplishments” we surely can’t just mean volume, as a huge volume of quasi-spam or inanity could do that. So I think the idea must be those are “great accomplishments” in the sense of community building actions, for VM at least. (I’m not so sure on the other, but maybe someone could explain that).

    So finally (sorry for taking so long to arrive at the point), my concern was that it seems to me at least as if we might be recognising someone for community building activity when in fact they ended up becoming so destructive for the community as to need removal. (I also have some concerns about memorialising or continuing to call to mind these problematic former members, but those are different issues.)
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  2. #12
    Super Member jemstone's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tomville View Post
    There seems to have been some strong reactions to what I wrote, and some misunderstandings of what was meant.

    In no way was it a suggestion to “rewrite history”: what happened happened. My concern is somewhere else, as will hopefully become clear.

    Saying that banned members are “no longer part of the community” is true by definition: they were once a part of this community but unfortunately repeatedly proved unable to keep their behaviour within the forum requirements and so were removed from the community as the ultimate disciplinary action.

    The point I was getting at was a thought that came up for me reading the words of the quote in the OP: “deserve credit for great accomplishments”. It’s pretty obvious how high rep could be called that, but not immediately so clear how high traffic to one’s page or high number of VM might. To make sense of these being called “great accomplishments” we surely can’t just mean volume, as a huge volume of quasi-spam or inanity could do that. So I think the idea must be those are “great accomplishments” in the sense of community building actions, for VM at least. (I’m not so sure on the other, but maybe someone could explain that).

    So finally (sorry for taking so long to arrive at the point), my concern was that it seems to me at least as if we might be recognising someone for community building activity when in fact they ended up becoming so destructive for the community as to need removal. (I also have some concerns about memorialising or continuing to call to mind these problematic former members, but those are different issues.)

    So if someone doesnt have lots of good rep like you, then we arent important at all??

    And if someone is banned.... That autmatocally makes them a bad person? People do make mistakes..... While I dont praise them highly for their actions that got them banned in the first place... But saying they arent important for the things they did while they were active and contributing to this community deserves a mention.
    Last edited by jemstone; March 25th, 2018 at 01:27 PM.
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  3. #13
    Tomville's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jemstone View Post
    So if someone doesnt have lots of good rep like you, then we arent important at all??

    And if someone is banned.... That autmatocally makes them a bad person? People do make mistakes..... While I dont praise them highly for their actions that got them banned in the first place... But saying they arent important for the things they did while they were active and contributing to this community deserves a mention.
    No, this is not what I said at all and certainly doesn’t reflect how I think. Rep has nothing to do with importance, and being banned doesn’t make you a bad person, just one who got themselves banned as a consequence of their considerable string of poor choices. I’ve tried to explain what my thought was, it doesn’t need more than that.
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  4. #14
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    It's good to see that you've taken over from Bmille3. He had done a lot of hardwork to get this done and I'm glad Bmille3 can now have some easy time after a good work done & maintained for so long.
    Last edited by Sammydict; March 25th, 2018 at 01:19 PM.
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  5. #15
    Super Member CometSmudge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tomville View Post
    There seems to have been some strong reactions to what I wrote, and some misunderstandings of what was meant.

    In no way was it a suggestion to “rewrite history”: what happened happened. My concern is somewhere else, as will hopefully become clear.

    Saying that banned members are “no longer part of the community” is true by definition: they were once a part of this community but unfortunately repeatedly proved unable to keep their behaviour within the forum requirements and so were removed from the community as the ultimate disciplinary action.

    The point I was getting at was a thought that came up for me reading the words of the quote in the OP: “deserve credit for great accomplishments”. It’s pretty obvious how high rep could be called that, but not immediately so clear how high traffic to one’s page or high number of VM might. To make sense of these being called “great accomplishments” we surely can’t just mean volume, as a huge volume of quasi-spam or inanity could do that. So I think the idea must be those are “great accomplishments” in the sense of community building actions, for VM at least. (I’m not so sure on the other, but maybe someone could explain that).

    So finally (sorry for taking so long to arrive at the point), my concern was that it seems to me at least as if we might be recognising someone for community building activity when in fact they ended up becoming so destructive for the community as to need removal. (I also have some concerns about memorialising or continuing to call to mind these problematic former members, but those are different issues.)
    Some banned members are still part of the community. They're active on discord and still part of the community.
    All the banned people on this list (and many not on it) were not destructive to the community. The fact that they're on the leaderboard shows they contributed far more to the community then they "destroyed."
    Last edited by CometSmudge; March 25th, 2018 at 01:36 PM.
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  6. #16
    Tomville's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CometSmudge View Post
    Some banned members are still part of the community. They're active on discord and still part of the community.
    All the banned people on this list (and many not on it) were not destructive to the community. The fact that they're on the leaderboard shows they contributed far more to the community then they "destroyed."
    I see we are speaking of different communities. I means this forum community, the members in good standing here, where the thread and this discussion is, not the far broader community of all Clash players. I thought that would be clear without saying as the thread list was specifically about forum related achievements, not wider in game achievements or contributions on other related social gaming platforms. A banned forum member is by definition no longer part of the forum community.

    My point was not to do with measuring the totality of what they did both good and bad over time (who could do that? Why would we want to, beyond knowing they were banned so it must have been pretty dire, especially given how many forum members never get even a single infraction over years of active membership?). I simply say that I question the appropriateness of inclusion if indeed what is being recognised is community building, as opposed to sheer volume (which isn’t actually “deserving credit as a great accomplishment”).

    If we are just measuring volume and not community building then that’s different, sure put them in... but in that case let’s not call it a “deserving credit as a great accomplishment” as opposed to inspiring something like the sort of response one has to a Guinness Book of Records entry for putting the most snails on your face or eating an entire Cessna plane.
    Last edited by Tomville; March 25th, 2018 at 03:04 PM.
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  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tomville View Post
    I see we are speaking of different communities. I means this forum community, the members in good standing here, where the thread and this discussion is, not the far broader community of all Clash players. I thought that would be clear without saying as the thread list was specifically about forum related achievements, not wider in game achievements or contributions on other related social gaming platforms. A banned forum member is by definition no longer part of the forum community.

    My point was not to do with measuring the totality of what they did both good and bad over time (who could do that? Why would we want to, beyond knowing they were banned so it must have been pretty dire, especially given how many forum members never get even a single infraction over years of active membership?). I simply say that I question the appropriateness of inclusion if indeed what is being recognised is community building, as opposed to sheer volume (which isn’t actually “deserving credit as a great accomplishment”).

    If we are just measuring volume and not community building then that’s different, sure put them in... but in that case let’s not call it a “deserving credit as a great accomplishment” as opposed to inspiring something like the sort of response one has to a Guinness Book of Records entry for putting the most snails on your face or eating an entire Cessna plane.
    That is not nice. I know BlindHaze and he is a very nice and kind man and you are being rude 😡

    He is banned but he is nice.

    Maybe you are on the list because you put snails in your face.

    I am very sorry and DeltaDroid says I cannot say what the moderators do so I have changed the post. I am sorry but angry too 😢
    Last edited by Yossi20; March 25th, 2018 at 06:08 PM. Reason: My gaurdian says I must change it

  8. #18
    10,000,001 Bmille3's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tomville View Post
    There seems to have been some strong reactions to what I wrote, and some misunderstandings of what was meant.

    In no way was it a suggestion to “rewrite history”: what happened happened. My concern is somewhere else, as will hopefully become clear.

    Saying that banned members are “no longer part of the community” is true by definition: they were once a part of this community but unfortunately repeatedly proved unable to keep their behaviour within the forum requirements and so were removed from the community as the ultimate disciplinary action.

    The point I was getting at was a thought that came up for me reading the words of the quote in the OP: “deserve credit for great accomplishments”. It’s pretty obvious how high rep could be called that, but not immediately so clear how high traffic to one’s page or high number of VM might. To make sense of these being called “great accomplishments” we surely can’t just mean volume, as a huge volume of quasi-spam or inanity could do that. So I think the idea must be those are “great accomplishments” in the sense of community building actions, for VM at least. (I’m not so sure on the other, but maybe someone could explain that).

    So finally (sorry for taking so long to arrive at the point), my concern was that it seems to me at least as if we might be recognising someone for community building activity when in fact they ended up becoming so destructive for the community as to need removal. (I also have some concerns about memorialising or continuing to call to mind these problematic former members, but those are different issues.)
    Why don’t you just make your own leaderboards, with the “perfect community building statistics?”
    Last edited by Bmille3; March 25th, 2018 at 05:32 PM.
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  9. #19
    Pro Member Bresn's Avatar
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    How is a community a community if it's only within the forums? A community is it's own thing, it's not something to be "confined" within a forum just because it started in said forum. It lacks context of why people are banned, it lacks context of what they did contribute as a member, and that certainly doesn't lend to basically erasing someone's legacy.
    Last edited by Bresn; March 25th, 2018 at 05:40 PM.
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  10. #20
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    Over the ongoing debate, I'll just say that if any forumer has earned a spot in any of the mentioned categories here then s/he should be mentioned in that particular category, irrespective of the fact that the s/he has gone active/inactive, infracted/banned etc. For IMO, what matters is that all those people were once a part of this community.

    Having said that, I can see Tomville's point, which seemingly got a bit exaggerated, but difference being his opinion is well suited for organization in the more pro space which isn't the cent per cent case here.

    Either ways, I'll suggest that we all get over that part and focus on getting featured upon one of mentioned categories.

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