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  Click here to go to the first staff post in this thread.   Thread: Yet another NO MATCH FOUND; going on 6 days now.

  1. #11

    Same problem

    Some problem

  2. #12
    Grinch of Tomville's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blombardo View Post
    ...
    Yes once in a while we had it set so that the enemy had zero chance to win - I do recall quite a few of those that I created using roster engineering tricks - so 5% of the clans had no chance a all and yes - that is a problem - for that clan - because they didnt understand how the game worked. -- but it happened to us as well... The clan who upgraded smarter - engineered better - was going to win. every time - skill would have no say in the matter...

    If that clan really wanted to win - they would have learned how to upgrade and they would have upgraded smarter - used a better roster - had better offense and then they would have won...

    The problem here - doesnt rest in any individual players hands -- it rests in the DEV's hands. They made a system - some of us figured it out and played to the best of our ability to win...

    The Devs need to set standards - tell us how they WANT us to play - tell us how they WANT wars to be matched - then tell us what an ideal war roster should look like!...

    They need to sticky a post somewhere saying -- THE IDEAL CLAN WAR COMPOSITION FOR the IDEAL FAIR MATCH is:

    then with a set standard that the entire community can strive for -- we can all set up to attempt to meet that goal. As a clan leader you can then build a roster -- that is the ideal example...
    You have a rather idiosyncratic view on this that seems formed by a WAAC mentality (win at all costs). This is evident from the very assumption that clan leaders would (or should) commonly be out there building “the ideal war roster” specified down to precise counts at various th levels, rather than taking whomever is available, acceptable and wanting a war. The hardcore war clan is the exception not the rule, and not representative of whom the devs are designing for as the priority: they want something that works fairly and delivers a good experience for everyone.

    Supercell have indicated to us how they want wars to be matched: fairly for all different build types without any one build type being able to “engineer better” for a matchmaking advantage over other build types. How they want you to play is freely choosing to follow your build preferences, rather than building in ways specifically tailored to game advantage from flaws in the matchmaker itself - they want you to play the game, not game the play.

    If you spent years crafting something specifically tailored to maximally exploit the matchmaker flaws to the hilt, then that’s on you rather than them if when they move to remedy flaws it then stops working to secure maximal advantages in fast matches.
    Last edited by Grinch of Tomville; October 4th, 2017 at 10:58 AM.
    Chapter One #22V00CGY Level 13 International clan
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  3. #13
    Not giving you a match at all is better than matching you against a clan you have a big advantage over. So, it sounds like an improvement, although still not perfect. Would you prefer after a certain time the matchmaker intentionally give you a big disadvantage, but at least you get a match?
    Th11 here, several other accounts th8-10. Click here to see how trophies are calculated. Some tips/thoughts on Legends here. Engineers aren't the problem, they are the symptom of a problematic matchmaker. My Legends hope: PvP 5500+ with attack limit, leave rest same, including usual legends from 5000-5499 or, maybe even better, create a new 3rd trophy ladder for PvP and leave legends alone. Contact SC here

  4. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by 2222 View Post
    Not giving you a match at all is better than matching you against a clan you have a big advantage over. So, it sounds like an improvement, although still not perfect. Would you prefer after a certain time the matchmaker intentionally give you a big disadvantage, but at least you get a match?
    This

    The problem is that you have such a stylized roster that no one else has one similar. It's not like SC can force other clans to run a roster like yours. If there are no clans in the pool that match up then you wait.

  5.   This is the last staff post in this thread.   #15
    Darian[Supercell]'s Avatar
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    As I said in the Q&A video, while engineering is not cheating, it is gaming the system. Our responsibility is to try and eliminate as many loopholes as possible that allows Clans to gain an unfair advantage over another, and to try and create a fair environment for matchmaking. Although on paper that sounds like a very noble and simple objective, the complexities behind it are insane when dealing with the number of Clans that participate in Clan Wars and the sheer variety of rosters that each Clan creates. I promise that's not an excuse or justification, just a bit of understanding on what is going on.

    If a Clan is gaining an unfair advantage by gaming the system, we are going to try and eliminate as many of those loopholes as possible.
    "If his unpleasant wounding has in some way enlightened the rest of you as to the grim finish beneath the glossy veneer of criminal life and inspired you to change your ways, then his injuries carry with it an inherent nobility, and a supreme glory. We should all be so fortunate. You say poor Toby? I say poor us."
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  6. #16
    Grinch of Tomville's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2222 View Post
    Not giving you a match at all is better than matching you against a clan you have a big advantage over. So, it sounds like an improvement, although still not perfect. Would you prefer after a certain time the matchmaker intentionally give you a big disadvantage, but at least you get a match?
    And it’s better in a way I haven’t seen anyone point to much so far: if say 500 very heavily engineered clans each take 8 days to get a match, rather than completing 4 wars in that time, and if they would have had an advantage about say 75% of the time (they wouldn’t stick with it if it didn’t pay off often), then it’s suceeded in improving things overall as well more than double that number of clans have dodged those particular bad match bullets. And those bullet-dodging clans have in turn been available to match other similar clans, rather than having been taken out of the pool of possible matches by the dissimilar heavily engineered clan. So there’s a ripple effect at work I think, where the matchmaker holds a hard line on matching the most extreme builds too quickly rather than fairly.
    Last edited by Grinch of Tomville; October 4th, 2017 at 12:08 PM.
    Chapter One #22V00CGY Level 13 International clan
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  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darian[Supercell] View Post
    As I said in the Q&A video, while engineering is not cheating, it is gaming the system. Our responsibility is to try and eliminate as many loopholes as possible that allows Clans to gain an unfair advantage over another, and to try and create a fair environment for matchmaking. Although on paper that sounds like a very noble and simple objective, the complexities behind it are insane when dealing with the number of Clans that participate in Clan Wars and the sheer variety of rosters that each Clan creates. I promise that's not an excuse or justification, just a bit of understanding on what is going on.

    If a Clan is gaining an unfair advantage by gaming the system, we are going to try and eliminate as many of those loopholes as possible.
    Thank you Darian

    the matchmaker, while not perfect, seems very much improved in this regard.
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  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by blombardo View Post
    The match maker is completely broken.

    -Aged Greatness3 is currently suffering...

    yes -- all the players there are engineered -- and I mean - all of them -- maybe one or two are a semi normal th8.. .the rest are all various mini's with low weight and th11 research 20/20/10 or so heroes that -used -to get th9 mirrors this entire past year --- and used- to get th8 mirrors the year before (none have gained weight; just the MM changes have given them harder matches over time)

    most of these accounts are permanently like this; only thing changing are hero levels, walls and research going up...


    The MM never used to have any issues matching engineered clans... now the MM is refusing to match them at all.


    The option to 'use normal accounts' is not an option... we have other clans where we use those type of accounts.


    --the MM needs fixed.


    -- No advice needed -- we will not be changing or adjusting our line up... these various accounts have worked in wars for the past 4 years just fine and should be working now and in the future...

    Generally we would use a max 10.5 on top with a ton of 9.11's under it - some defenseless and various other mini's across the bottom in 40x size wars. since the latest MM we've tried various smaller size wars with no match found over and over.
    SC has been very direct in saying that some very highly engineered clans will never be able to find a match under the new mm. Either change your lineup or just give up doing wars in this clan, too.

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by blombardo View Post
    No.

    What worked fine for me - also worked fine for 95% of the clans we went up against. Yes once in a while we had it set so that the enemy had zero chance to win - I do recall quite a few of those that I created using roster engineering tricks - so 5% of the clans had no chance a all and yes - that is a problem - for that clan - because they didnt understand how the game worked. -- but it happened to us as well... The clan who upgraded smarter - engineered better - was going to win. every time - skill would have no say in the matter...
    So you're saying that skill with attacking or building good bases for defense is unimportant, whereas skill with a spreadsheet is extremely important? Why do you play this game, anyway?

  10. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darian[Supercell] View Post
    As I said in the Q&A video, while engineering is not cheating, it is gaming the system. Our responsibility is to try and eliminate as many loopholes as possible that allows Clans to gain an unfair advantage over another, and to try and create a fair environment for matchmaking. Although on paper that sounds like a very noble and simple objective, the complexities behind it are insane when dealing with the number of Clans that participate in Clan Wars and the sheer variety of rosters that each Clan creates. I promise that's not an excuse or justification, just a bit of understanding on what is going on.

    If a Clan is gaining an unfair advantage by gaming the system, we are going to try and eliminate as many of those loopholes as possible.
    Quote Originally Posted by nerfedname View Post
    Thank you Darian

    the matchmaker, while not perfect, seems very much improved in this regard.
    To give people an idea of just how improved the new mm is, consider this.

    My clan has had a nearly unending litany of fair and even wars for a the past year since we gave up running a bunch of perma-.5's. The only time that we had issues was when we had a bunch of max th10's who were afraid to click that upgrade button about 6 months ago, we were often at a 2 or 3 to 1 disadvantage on th11's for a while. However, we're through that phase and generally match pretty evenly. Our past 2 wars have been very extreme, and they're all because of our roster decisions:

    War 1:

    us:
    2 max th11
    4 85k+ th10
    2 max offense 72k 9.5's
    5 normal th9's
    1 brand new 56k th9
    1 50k 8.5 with max offense

    Them:
    3 max th11's
    1 10.5
    1 full 10
    another 10.5
    9.5
    9.11
    9
    9.5
    9.5
    9.11
    8.5
    8
    8

    That's right, 7 th11's, 3 of them with eagles, to our 2 th 11's. We were all ♥♥♥♥♥♥ off on prep day. Then we won 41-35 because their bases were so terrible and they couldn't attack to save their lives. It ended up being lopsided in our favor instead of theirs.

    I sent out a clan email stating that th9's needed xbows, th10 need infernos, and th11 need eagles to be included in war. The 2 9.5's and the 8.5 are all dropping their xbows/infernos.

    Next war:

    us:
    2 max th11
    4 th10 85k +
    4 th9 67k+

    them
    2 max th11
    4 th10 85k +
    4 th9 67k +

    Heroes and walls are very close, too. It's the best match we've had in a long time.

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