The engineer and the "flop"

[Lunaticfringe]

In my opinion, the should be, is that wars should be decided by the clan's team work, effort, attacking skills and base layouts(not upgrade route) during the 2 days of war. Not the moment the war is declared.

See above, which I think most reasonable people would also want. If anyone argued otherwise, I'd raise an eyebrow.

I/my clan don't mind small advantages obtained through whatever means, especially if it's just through wise upgrading, it's when things are taken to extremes that often cause the problems, like entire clans pushing the limits. Unfortunately, this type of strategy seems to becoming more and more common

I like the "what should be" "what is" formulation. I think the average thread flips back & forth unpredictably & incoherently, and there's a lot more agreement with a little more specificity to the subject.

And then I'll suggest that all the "what should be" arguments be snail mailed to Helsinki where they might make a difference, but that seems to ♥♥♥♥ people off...

Maybe so, but "what should be" is what seems to be generating all these threads. Is there are more common post than that of engineering? Cloud issues are common threads, TH11 material (or lack thereof), etc. get lots of traction, but it still seems they fall far short of engineering threads...

[TankSinatra]

Maybe so, but "what should be" is what seems to be generating all these threads

Unquestionably true, but its the powerless arguing with the powerless. The stakes are small, the virtue signaling blinding.

[Razz42]

I think a better analogy is boxing or wrestling with weight classes. We do not want heavy weights (th11s) with light weights (th7-8-9). When that happens the war is no longer about strategies and how you play, it is just numbers that win.

[TankSinatra]

I think a better analogy is boxing or wrestling with weight classes. We do not want heavy weights (th11s) with light weights (th7-8-9). When that happens the war is no longer about strategies and how you play, it is just numbers that win.

You're not fighting heavyweights with lightweights though. You're fighting players that have figured out where to efficiently pack weight & how to cut before weight in. Its a legitimate gripe that the weight-in system should be changed, but SC sets the rules and they've failed to correct the issue over & over again. Maybe this time will be different, we'll see.

[strandwolfza]

You're not fighting heavyweights with lightweights though. You're fighting players that have figured out where to efficiently pack weight & how to cut before weight in. Its a legitimate gripe that the weight-in system should be changed, but SC sets the rules and they've failed to correct the issue over & over again. Maybe this time will be different, we'll see.

and because SC have failed multiple times to correct the MM, let's engineer our bases so we get a huge advantage in wars against players who only want to play the game how it was meant to be played (engineering is not in the spirit of the game, as darian said in the interview with ash). you engineers want to know too much and meddle with things that you shouldn't. things like war weight or how the MM works aren't of your concern. you should only play the game, improve your attacking skills and base design and that's it, and let supercell worry about the MM. even if the MM is faulty, the problem only exists because engineers decided to exploit it. I'll never accept that engineers are innocent and all the blame falls only on supercell. Never.

and after the announcement made by darian there was some engineers wanting to know what exactly would be changed so they could "give their opinion on whether it would work or not". give me a break. if they shared such information with you you would only use it to game the MM even more, as darian said it himself in the interview with ash

I really hope everything goes as announced so there'll be no more advantage to engineering and no more easy wars for your lot

[Razz42]

You're not fighting heavyweights with lightweights though. You're fighting players that have figured out where to efficiently pack weight & how to cut before weight in. Its a legitimate gripe that the weight-in system should be changed, but SC sets the rules and they've failed to correct the issue over & over again. Maybe this time will be different, we'll see.

Troopswise it is fighting heavyweights with lightweights. It is nothing smart or brilliant or ingenious...like wow they know how to gem up troops and keep weight low...how do they do it? Currently, we have a war with engineered bases...extra th11s with wardens, higher troop levels, and more troops space. Those are just numbers and that all it takes, no special strat or great execution and timing. There was a time when war clans wanted 3 star strats only....now just give me an engineered base and done. I think SC is working on it as the revamped build packages reflect that. I think any change to MM in terms of troop levels and so on could spell trouble. My guess is the whole remove stuff was emulated behind the scenes already and would make a mess. I hope it is addressed. I like an earlier post on TH sniping changes, like easy loot was just wrong or took away from real play...I'm not really sure.

[BoBoTheGoat]

and because SC have failed multiple times to correct the MM, let's engineer our bases so we get a huge advantage in wars against players who only want to play the game how it was meant to be played (engineering is not in the spirit of the game, as darian said in the interview with ash). you engineers want to know too much and meddle with things that you shouldn't. things like war weight or how the MM works aren't of your concern. you should only play the game, improve your attacking skills and base design and that's it, and let supercell worry about the MM. even if the MM is faulty, the problem only exists because engineers decided to exploit it. I'll never accept that engineers are innocent and all the blame falls only on supercell. Never.

and after the announcement made by darian there was some engineers wanting to know what exactly would be changed so they could "give their opinion on whether it would work or not". give me a break. if they shared such information with you you would only use it to game the MM even more, as darian said it himself in the interview with ash

I really hope everything goes as announced so there'll be no more advantage to engineering and no more easy wars for your lot

While Darian appears to be a stand-up guy and has done some good things for the clash community in his short time being the community manager, some of the things he says do seem rather hypocritical.

For example, he shared that the devs don't want to invalidate any playstyles but also want to adjust matchmaking for more fair wars and less advantage to those who build defenseless bases. While the degree of adjustment will be unknown, making matchmaking fair for the majority of the community will invalidate engineering. Unless, of course, the matchmaking actually can match engineer with engineer clans. Which I find doubtful. If engineers will match clans who benefit from the matchmaking adjustment, then that invalidates what an engineered clan aims to do. Thus invalidating it anyways.

He also shared that there are several mechanics or interactions of the matchmaker was, "honestly I don't know." So I'm hoping for the best but preparing for the worst.

[TankSinatra]

and because SC have failed multiple times to correct the MM, let's engineer our bases so we get a huge advantage in wars

If you like. Or don't, and take your chances with random spins. Or give up on random spins like the serious brawlers have and do league/ potlucks/ FW.

against players who only want to play the game how it was meant to be played (engineering is not in the spirit of the game, as darian said in the interview with ash).

I've explained elsewhere, over & over again, that THE WAY THE GAME IS MEANT TO BE PLAYED is to be a defense heavy preemie, gem often, and care about the trophy game. The tutorial, game mechanics, gem pack offers lead you there every time. I'm guessing neither of us is playing THE WAY THE GAME IS MEANT TO BE PLAYED, and neither of us should care.
And I'm struggling to see the same full throated denunciation of engineering in Darian's statements that you seem to see. I see him saying that engineering is an artifact of the matchmaker, and they want to reduce the advantage there. Which is what a lot of engineers have been saying for maybe a year now.

you engineers want to know too much and meddle with things that you shouldn't. things like war weight or how the MM works aren't of your concern. you should only play the game, improve your attacking skills and base design and that's it, and let supercell worry about the MM even if the MM is faulty, the problem only exists because engineers decided to exploit it.

My clan ignored the MM until the MM hit us over the head, hard & repeatedly, with a cluebat. Very early in clan wars a bunch of us went th9 at the same time, dropped xbows, and I'm sure you know how that went.

I'll never accept that engineers are innocent and all the blame falls only on supercell. Never.

Innocence, blame... wait a sec, we're still talking about a game right?

and after the announcement made by darian there was some engineers wanting to know what exactly would be changed so they could "give their opinion on whether it would work or not". give me a break. if they shared such information with you you would only use it to game the MM even more, as darian said it himself in the interview with ash

Not sure what this is about, ton of people on the forum (pro and anti engineer) ask for transparency so there's less advantage for the excel brigade. I'm not one of them, there might be good reasons to keep things opaque.

I really hope everything goes as announced so there'll be no more advantage to engineering and no more easy wars for your lot

Don't worry I'll be fine. Put together a 28 streak in my main clan with a single engineered account (basically a .5, which isn't engineered I'm told its a sensible upgrade path). I play the game as it is, change the rules and I'll play under those rules.

[strandwolfza]

While Darian appears to be a stand-up guy and has done some good things for the clash community in his short time being the community manager, some of the things he says do seem rather hypocritical.

For example, he shared that the devs don't want to invalidate any playstyles but also want to adjust matchmaking for more fair wars and less advantage to those who build defenseless bases. While the degree of adjustment will be unknown, making matchmaking fair for the majority of the community will invalidate engineering. Unless, of course, the matchmaking actually can match engineer with engineer clans. Which I find doubtful. If engineers will match clans who benefit from the matchmaking adjustment, then that invalidates what an engineered clan aims to do. Thus invalidating it anyways.

He also shared that there are several mechanics or interactions of the matchmaker was, "honestly I don't know." So I'm hoping for the best but preparing for the worst.

I agree with you but you can't ignore that darian is the PR guy from supercell so he must say some politically correct things like "not wanting to invalidate any playstyle" (even when it's clearly NOT true) and some other times he must say "he doesn't know" as a way to avoid answearing certain questions when he's being interviewed (in case you really didn't know, darian, I'm sorry)

[BoBoTheGoat]

I agree with you but you can't ignore that darian is the PR guy from supercell so he must say some politically correct things like "not wanting to invalidate any playstyle" (even when it's clearly NOT true) and some other times he must say "he doesn't know" as a way to avoid answearing certain questions when he's being interviewed (in case you really didn't know, darian, I'm sorry)

I get what you mean. But several times throughout the video you could hear Darian pause and think of the wording he wanted to use to answer the questions the best he could, even if the response didn't necessarily answer the question. Along with telling Ash straight up, that he can't comment on this or that, which he did a few times. If he said he honestly doesn't know, I wouldn't see why not to believe him.

And I agree, even if the matchmaking changes did annihilate engineering, it isn't in their best interest and tell everyone that's what will happen. But if it does annihilate engineering, I would expect Darian to be given a big raise and a new office.