Let's end the great CoC economy debate once and for all

it doesn't matter whether or not there're more bases to loot after the update, all these arguments are pointless because they are talking about it from their own perspective.

The in-game economic system as a whole only concerns two things - loot injected, and loot spent (which is gone forever, keep in mind).

The injected loot comes from 1. collectors, 2. loot bonus, 3. war loot.

The post-update injected loot comes from the same source, but the difference is less loot bonus will be generated - be it the removal of TH sniping or progressive loot bonus based destruction percentage. You can't argue against that.

Since we don't know the exact numbers, we can't predict whether the injected loot will be less or more then the loot spent after the update, but one thing that you can be guaranteed is less loot, as a whole, will be earned. As a result, the development progress, again as a whole, will be slower for sure unless there're further changes to counter the missing injected loot.

EDIT: in case some miss the point of this thread, I'm merely trying to say it's pointless to debate whether the loot will dry up or there'll be more bases to loot, because we don't know the exact numbers. The only thing that can be expected based on what we've known so far is the overall progress will be slower without any further changes.

i think of the economy as more of an ecosystem, each TH level being on its own level in the food chain

the resources will start getting juggled around the lower levels where its super easy to gain 250K< per raid, then those resources are raided by the higher, stronger links, and then ultimately wind up in my storages to be used on LV11 walls:o

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DaiGuren

i think of the economy as more of an ecosystem, each TH level being on its own level in the food chain

the resources will start getting juggled around the lower levels where its super easy to gain 250K< per raid, then those resources are raided by the higher, stronger links, and then ultimately wind up in my storages to be used on LV11 walls:o

---

Lol'd :)

10charmanders

Until they announce the next level collector and your theory goes out the window.

Who do you people think Supercell are? Do you think they're making this up as they go?

Stop making these rubbish threads.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DaiGuren

i think of the economy as more of an ecosystem, each TH level being on its own level in the food chain

the resources will start getting juggled around the lower levels where its super easy to gain 250K< per raid, then those resources are raided by the higher, stronger links, and then ultimately wind up in my storages to be used on LV11 walls:o

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by shapesh1ft

Lol'd :)

10charmanders

---

Same here. Good stuff.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 4rcanine

Until they announce the next level collector and your theory goes out the window.

Who do you people think Supercell are? Do you think they're making this up as they go?

Stop making these rubbish threads.

---

All the theories and statements are based off of what we know so far. What you just said is just as rubbish as any of the posts right now.

Wanna know why in the latest interview over 80% of the game is TH snipes?

Its because of the economy of the game...plain and simple.

If folks didn't have to next endlessly to find loot I'm quite certain there would be less TH snipes.

I don't hit next if I see a 200k/200k plus base come up and wait for a TH snipe.

I'm sure some of you do...like lower guys trying for achievements.

But endless nexting is just killing the economy even more....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 4rcanine

Until they announce the next level collector and your theory goes out the window.

Who do you people think Supercell are? Do you think they're making this up as they go?

Stop making these rubbish threads.

---

Elixir for lvl6 walls...just saying :smirk:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by x0pht

All the theories and statements are based off of what we know so far. What you just said is just as rubbish as any of the posts right now.

---

So your theory plus his theory equals what exactly???

I think that both of you are like the rest of us - speculating about what the game will like look like while waiting for the update to drop...

Patience grasshopper!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Denton

So your theory plus his theory equals what exactly???

I think that both of you are like the rest of us - speculating about what the game will like look like while waiting for the update to drop...

Patience grasshopper!

---

We can make logical conclusions based on the available info. We cannot speculate what SC is going to do to fix those issues (higher collector production)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Teflonsean

Wanna know why in the latest interview over 80% of the game is TH snipes?

Its because of the economy of the game...plain and simple.

If folks didn't have to next endlessly to find loot I'm quite certain there would be less TH snipes.

I don't hit next if I see a 200k/200k plus base come up and wait for a TH snipe.

I'm sure some of you do...like lower guys trying for achievements.

But endless nexting is just killing the economy even more....

---

Nexting is extremely costly, but at times there is no choice. Especially in the lower leagues where you will not get a bonus to cover your loot. When attacking a base for 200k both you have more storages to attack now so is less likely that ou are getting that entire 200k. They can't remove nexts cost but it is way to high right now, it is draining loot quickly

The debate will end once the patch is released and we all see how it actually pans out.

Right now we just have fears and theories on what is going to happen.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by shapesh1ft

We can make logical conclusions based on the available info. We cannot speculate what SC is going to do to fix those issues (higher collector production)

---

Fair points and my perspective is that that until the update drops and the community starts adapting, it is hard to know what it will really mean from a based design / army comp...

I expect that like every other system, some will adapt well and thrive and some will die! :confused::confused::confused:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Denton

Fair points and my perspective is that that until the update drops and the community starts adapting, it is hard to know what it will really mean from a based design / army comp...

I expect that like every other system, some will adapt well and thrive and some will die! :confused::confused::confused:

---

I have already started digging my COC grave 😓🔫

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 4rcanine

Until they announce the next level collector and your theory goes out the window.

Who do you people think Supercell are? Do you think they're making this up as they go?

Stop making these rubbish threads.

---

The frightening reality is, yes, yes they are.

They have already adjusted two parameters of the pending update, based on feedback from various threads in this forum. They are simply making it up as they go along.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Denton

Fair points and my perspective is that that until the update drops and the community starts adapting, it is hard to know what it will really mean from a based design / army comp...

I expect that like every other system, some will adapt well and thrive and some will die! :confused::confused::confused:

---

Pretty much. It is more kind of an ethical issue though in judging the way others have played the game for three years. Many of my clanmates don't really care about farming but like only chatting and war attacks every 2 days. They mostly live from their collectors and make super slow progress but they enjoy playing this way.

No one ever complained about this issue and game design. The recent sneek peeks were a surprise to so many people with a huge game design change based on intent from several years ago. That is why there was so much backlash because they became successful with players who enjoyed a game for years, and then after they are fully invested into the game, it alienates them and pushes them away.

Everyone thinks farming is the only part of the game and this update tells us the intention of the game was to make farming a core part of it. That's fine and all but many paying customers have different kind of lifestyles, schedules, and preferences playing this game for years with TH10s even. Some of these paying customers are the group of people that will "die" and they will just stop opening the app anymore if they can't progress or have fun.

Before, there was a choice for many players to play the game in many different ways. But after the update, there is really only a very few available playstyles. Nothing wrong with it but some people cannot just adapt when they were already making slow progress and spending their time in the game with different stuff.

Personally, I'm an active clasher and I think I will be just ok in the update, but I'm still very concerned about the economy if they don't make changes to balance the slash in loot injection rate. Many of my friends have to adjust heavily, play more, or just leave.. and that is kind of sad when they wre my mates playing this game for so long.

Just posted a thread kind of addressing exactly what you're calling "mere conjecture" at this point. It's true that most of what everyone is doing is just speculation. There is no way to know what the loot situation is going to be like for *everyone* (especially since everyone raids a little differently).

However, my thread does address an "absolute" in the new update: "The Death of Collector Raids" as I called it. That is a fact...those dead/inactive bases will be dropping from search queues at a higher rate than ever before; and if something isn't done, it will ruin the game for a lot of binge-raiding farmers.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rykan

Just posted a thread kind of addressing exactly what you're calling "mere conjecture" at this point. It's true that most of what everyone is doing is just speculation. There is no way to know what the loot situation is going to be like for *everyone* (especially since everyone raids a little differently).

However, my thread does address an "absolute" in the new update: "The Death of Collector Raids" as I called it. That is a fact...those dead/inactive bases will be dropping from search queues at a higher rate than ever before; and if something isn't done, it will ruin the game for a lot of binge-raiding farmers.

---

Unless a lot of people simply end up playing less, and letting their collectors fill up.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 4M07H3RRU5514

The frightening reality is, yes, yes they are.

They have already adjusted two parameters of the pending update, based on feedback from various threads in this forum. They are simply making it up as they go along.

---

What if they were planning on those values from the start and just set them higher at first to give people the illusion that they are listening to them?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 4M07H3RRU5514

The frightening reality is, yes, yes they are.

They have already adjusted two parameters of the pending update, based on feedback from various threads in this forum. They are simply making it up as they go along.

---

Adjusting parameters is different than making it up as they go along.

They chose specific numbers based upon their own decisions, but upon seeing the concerns on the forum, they changed them.

Changing in response to feedback is very different than making it up as they go along.

I have 2 accounts. One is in Masters, the other in Silver. I find tons of snipes with a ratio of 1:2 in silver compared to 1:20 searches in Masters. Where is the 80% in Masters? I surely don't see it. Now We're forced to keep TH in. What made them panic? I honestly don't know. But I had a feeling it was going to change when we had the "White Flag" Event. Another similar event followed right after if you guys remember.

We now need to attack with a full army. In wars, it's ok to train a full army, spells, because that's the intent. You need a strong army to gain stars. Zero stars is a fail. That was the mission, our goal. In farming, it's the exact opposite. You need a fast, cheap army to spend less but gain more to progress. We don't care if we one star, two stars, three stars or even zero star, as long as we get the loot offered we're fine. That was the intent. That was our mission, our goal.

If the game was created to be played as intended, they should've had this update way before the other updates, even before clan wars was introduced. I would've understood then. But 3 years later? after players have settled in with cheap armies to farm, easy shield, easy loot. 3 damn long years. With this sudden update, I feel it's a little bit too late to be added.

Adapt or quit. Those words seems to go hand in hand with every new update that comes out now. When will we see updates that have more positive replies than negatives?

Just my thoughts...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rykan

Just posted a thread kind of addressing exactly what you're calling "mere conjecture" at this point. It's true that most of what everyone is doing is just speculation. There is no way to know what the loot situation is going to be like for *everyone* (especially since everyone raids a little differently).

However, my thread does address an "absolute" in the new update: "The Death of Collector Raids" as I called it. That is a fact...those dead/inactive bases will be dropping from search queues at a higher rate than ever before; and if something isn't done, it will ruin the game for a lot of binge-raiding farmers.

---

I would say that SC needs to stop hiding the dead and abandoned bases as much as they do. It would drop more loot back into the game by releasing these bases back in from time to time. If they are dead, that loot is not going anywhere. Thus putting in will be an easy infusion of loot. They could also bring in a quest chain, still possible! They would also help with the cash flow by bringing in loot that is generated through quest prises.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Awness

Adapt or quit. Those words seems to go hand in hand with every new update that comes out now. When will we see updates that have more positive replies than negatives?

Just my thoughts...

---

Never, in any game ever will the positive replies outweigh the negitive. People optimistic about changes are less likely to voice their opinion.

There is a reason those words go hand in hand with game changes. They are often spoken by people who have been through this kinda thing through multiple games for years upon years. The sky isn't falling.

The whole debate on if the available resources will start becoming scarce is irrelevant. There is not a limited amount of loot in the game. The ability to buy gems to buy more loot makes it endless.

It's similar to our actual currency system, an outside source can just keep pumping in money. Our governments have no real backing of the dollar anymore, they print money when needed.

There will always be gemmers, and there will always be an exponential amount of resources being added from that. In fact, the longer you have been playing this game, the more of an advantage you have because just as in life, time is the most valuable resource. Every update adds months of time and billions of resources required to max. The newer players will be that much more behind or have to spend that much more to gem and catch up, which produces more loot.

So in reality, veterans should embrace updates, even encourage them, because that is what ultimately keeps people spending money on the gem, which generates new resources. Non-gemmers need the gemmers, it's the only way you get to play for free.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by x0pht

All the theories and statements are based off of what we know so far. What you just said is just as rubbish as any of the posts right now.

---

and you don't know very much, quit whining about the loot.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rahle

I have already started digging my COC grave 😓🔫

---

I am sure that you will adapt and figure out how to make it work for you... :cool:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by shapesh1ft

Pretty much. It is more kind of an ethical issue though in judging the way others have played the game for three years. Many of my clanmates don't really care about farming but like only chatting and war attacks every 2 days. They mostly live from their collectors and make super slow progress but they enjoy playing this way.

No one ever complained about this issue and game design. The recent sneek peeks were a surprise to so many people with a huge game design change based on intent from several years ago. That is why there was so much backlash because they became successful with players who enjoyed a game for years, and then after they are fully invested into the game, it alienates them and pushes them away.

Everyone thinks farming is the only part of the game and this update tells us the intention of the game was to make farming a core part of it. That's fine and all but many paying customers have different kind of lifestyles, schedules, and preferences playing this game for years with TH10s even. Some of these paying customers are the group of people that will "die" and they will just stop opening the app anymore if they can't progress or have fun.

Before, there was a choice for many players to play the game in many different ways. But after the update, there is really only a very few available playstyles. Nothing wrong with it but some people cannot just adapt when they were already making slow progress and spending their time in the game with different stuff.

Personally, I'm an active clasher and I think I will be just ok in the update, but I'm still very concerned about the economy if they don't make changes to balance the slash in loot injection rate. Many of my friends have to adjust heavily, play more, or just leave.. and that is kind of sad when they wre my mates playing this game for so long.

---

Well thought out post with many of the same thoughts that I have had; luckily for us, we have plenty of time to play as we live in a ♥♥♥♥ country with nothing much to do except workout and clash...

I guess from my perspective that people who want to play will adapt as we have through many TH levels, CW match ups, new leagues, updates, etc. and there will always be turnover in the community....

Exactly. The only reason the game has continued to be successful is because of the steady updates and changes to the game. It's the new challenges and complexity the changes bring that keep people motivated to continue. Would anyone still be playing if there were no dark troops or clan wars??

Change is necessary within technology to keep it relevant. Supercell will adjust as needed. If you want to just be a farmer, that's fine, the warriors of the world need you to loot from. It works that way in the real world too. Pick your role.

And if that seems unfair, I believe there's a game called FarmVille that could use a passive farmer.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Scheffer

The whole debate on if the available resources will start becoming scarce is irrelevant. There is not a limited amount of loot in the game. The ability to buy gems to buy more loot makes it endless.

It's similar to our actual currency system, an outside source can just keep pumping in money. Our governments have no real backing of the dollar anymore, they print money when needed.

There will always be gemmers, and there will always be an exponential amount of resources being added from that. In fact, the longer you have been playing this game, the more of an advantage you have because just as in life, time is the most valuable resource. Every update adds months of time and billions of resources required to max. The newer players will be that much more behind or have to spend that much more to gem and catch up, which produces more loot.

So in reality, veterans should embrace updates, even encourage them, because that is what ultimately keeps people spending money on the gem, which generates new resources. Non-gemmers need the gemmers, it's the only way you get to play for free.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Denton

Well thought out post with many of the same thoughts that I have had; luckily for us, we have plenty of time to play as we live in a ♥♥♥♥ country with nothing much to do except workout and clash...

I guess from my perspective that people who want to play will adapt as we have through many TH levels, CW match ups, new leagues, updates, etc. and there will always be turnover in the community....

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Scheffer

And if that seems unfair, I believe there's a game called FarmVille that could use a passive farmer.

---

♥♥♥♥ - I actually used to play that for about six months to donate to my wife...:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Biscuittt

Never, in any game ever will the positive replies outweigh the negitive. People optimistic about changes are less likely to voice their opinion.

There is a reason those words go hand in hand with game changes. They are often spoken by people who have been through this kinda thing through multiple games for years upon years. The sky isn't falling.

---

In case you haven't noticed the people who are for the update have terribly negative comments non stop. As he stated with the adapt or quit(great for the clash economy......). They are so busy agreeing with sc they won't listen to reasonably, cognitive, thought out concerns.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Denton

♥♥♥♥ - I actually used to play that for about six months to donate to my wife...:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:

---

Hahaha...it's inevitable with all those requests!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Scheffer

Hahaha...it's inevitable with all those requests!

---

Indeed...

We tried a few different clans but finally made our own 50v so the requests continues!

defense league bonus could be a thing, perhaps all the % they dont get when they lose is how much you get :eek: (based on the league bonus % but reversed since its defense)

After update snipers or people who get major part of loot by sniping are losing most. Then people who raid 2 times or less per day will lose some. For all others it going to be better game.

Let me say one more time, that sniper loot doesn't add to game economy, it does add to that small group who snipe a lot and then disappear from others. 95% of playerbase doesn't get benefit from sniper loot. We just burn gold on nexting these leftover villages which doesn't have much loot, all others are hiding.

Let's be realistic. A lot of the complaints from upper level players aren't purely self centered. They already have developed villages and upgrade at a faster pace than your average Joes, or else they would spend more time farming and less time on the forums.
I'm worried about the impact of the update on the economy. I could really care less about the impact for myself since my walls and heroes are fairly close to maxed, and I will have no problem keeping my builders/lab busy on defenses and troops that "only" require a couple million g/e a day to sustain.
Calling critics selfish is mischaracterizing their points.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 4rcanine

Until they announce the next level collector and your theory goes out the window.

Who do you people think Supercell are? Do you think they're making this up as they go?

Stop making these rubbish threads.

---

Uhm, yeah. Unless they're time travelers who really like making games, they are indeed making up the game as they go.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zedon

and you don't know very much, quit whining about the loot.

---

Why did u bother to reply if u didn't read the first post? Even the title should give u some hint. You know, that line of words which you clicked to get here?

No one knows the exact details of how much loot is transferred, generated or spent.. Until the update comes out no one has a clue how it'll effect things, SC probably has the best idea, even if it's not perfect.

How about wait and see, if the doomsayers were right the Coc apocalypse would happen every single update. Yet time after time it's never as bad as speculated.

It's an even playing field and anyone claiming to have a clue is sticking their finger in the air and guessing

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by xautumnashesx

No one knows the exact details of how much loot is transferred, generated or spent.. Until the update comes out no one has a clue how it'll effect things, SC probably has the best idea, even if it's not perfect.

How about wait and see, if the doomsayers were right the Coc apocalypse would happen every single update. Yet time after time it's never as bad as speculated.

It's an even playing field and anyone claiming to have a clue is sticking their finger in the air and guessing

---

Actually when elixir for lvl7 walls came out it was just as bad as people predicted. There is precedence.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by xyz123xyz

In case you haven't noticed the people who are for the update have terribly negative comments non stop. As he stated with the adapt or quit(great for the clash economy......). They are so busy agreeing with sc they won't listen to reasonably, cognitive, thought out concerns.

---

In case you haven't noticed the people who are against the update have terribly negative comments non stop(I can generalize too!).

The "adapt or quit" is usually tossed out there at the group that is so busy disagreeing with sc they won't listen to reasonable, cognitive, thought out responses.

The bottom line is that multiplayer online games change on a regular basis. For many of us who have been part of the online gaming community for many years this is nothing new. Ridiculous responses like "adapt or quit" or "see you next week" are in response to equally ridiculous ♥♥♥♥ . "X company is ruining Y and if they do Z I'm out of here!". Same player still playing the same game weeks later. History is a broken record.

Not to say good feedback isn't the good thing. Just not the "OMG NO TH SNIPES, SC IS GOING TO START WW3!!!!"

As for now, th9/8 gonna be hit hard... Tougher for th9 to save loot as their upgrades need big amount.