"Multiple Mythologies" For Play - CoC 2.0!

So, after reading numerous posts requesting new troops and buildings, which range in style and real-world mythology form around the world... I started getting the idea that what people want is more variety. Far and away the two most common requests seem to be Clan War, and a variety of troops and defense types.

My thoughts went to the original Starcraft, with well-balanced playable "races," each with a unique mix of troops and buildings. So: What if CoC had different "races" as paths of development? Each with a different balance/specialty?! (Maybe call them "mythologies" or something else less loaded.)

Realistically, the more troops added to the game as it exists, the more complex it will get. The end result is that there will either be a gazillion different troops, watering the whole thing down, or new troop additions will be so disruptive to the game balance it could make the whole game fail. So adding more troops to the existing game is perhaps the wrong direction to go. Perhaps more troops can be added a different way...

So what if, like Starcraft, players could start their village and choose a path? This path would affect everything from the types of troops to spells and to defenses. How? you ask?

By electing a "Mayor" to govern your Town Hall! Once your village reaches the level where the basic 4 "races" of troops are unlocked, players could select a "Mayor" in the TH that defines what "mythology" their village follows.

So, what "races or mythologies"? you ask? The game has already got a mixed, multicultural society that includes barbarians, goblins, giants, skeletons, and dragons -- a really mixed mythology. And of course there's already the goblin villages. Instead of trying to come up with whole new mythologies, it would be easiest to just create specialty villages based on (and extended from) what already exist. There could be a development mode for each race/mythology/type, but with some (i.e. the Wizard, Healer) being a universal class type, and unique Heroes.

For example (and remember, just examples for the purpose of illustrating the idea!):

The Multicultural Mix: the existing setup.
- Same as currently exists, represents a good balance between high number versus high damage and a range of HP.
- Defenses are balanced, with variety of types of damage and air vs. ground.


The Vikings: source troop, the Barbarian/Archer/Giants.
- experts in brute force
- Generally low troop cost and housing space, medium/average production times
- Average HP, Average Damage, Average Speed, High Numbers

• Most troops are ground-based (fewer aerial troops, but aerial troops are stronger to offset imbalance)

- Defenses: much like current, good mix, but one less mortar and one extra canon.
- Wizard-class: (The Seer) deals fire-damage, purely offensive
- Other specialty units:

• The Battering Ram (wall breaker unit - weaker damage than bombs, higher HP and survives after destroying a wall, moving on to the next wall, moves somewhat slowly)
• Mountain Giant: damage soak, and ranged attacks by throwing barbarians into villages (can be shot down, aerial unit)

The Goblins: source troop, the Goblin.
- experts in stealth and speed
- Low and medium troop cost/housing space, either fast or slow (not medium) production times.
- Low HP, Low Damage but Specialty Damage multipliers, High Speed, High Numbers

• All troops are highly specialized, gaining multipliers against target, but otherwise weak

- Defenses: extra traps, extra walls, but one fewer canon and archer tower
- Wizard-class (Shaman) deals acid damage (low initial damage, but acid damages is cumulative over time, and persists for 3 or 4 seconds after unit is destroyed)
- Other specialty units:

• The Goblin Catapault (fires goblins into the base over walls! fires 5 to 10 troops at a time, but somewhat inaccurate!)
• Goblin Balloons: individual goblins strapped to small individual ballons, take 2 housing space, are cheap to make but quickly shot down (damage soak unit/distractor)

The Undead: source troop, the Wallbreaker/Balloon.
- experts in explosives and regeneration
- Generally medium to high troop cost, highly variable housing space, medium to slow production times
- Low HP (but regenerate), Variable Damage, Variable Speeds, Variable Numbers

• Weak troops, but take HP from what they damage, extending their life (therefore weakest at range, deadliest close up)

- Defenses: favours splash damage types, Lich Tower reanimates attacking troops after death as Zombies
- Wizard-class (Lich) deals lower damage with ice-based spell, but reanimates opponents Clan Castle troops after death
- Other specialty units:

• Zombies: very low production cost, .5 housing space, deal very little damage, have very little HP. Instantly destroyed by fire and archers.
• Vampire: flying unit until it lands to attack, fast movement

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Other ideas:

The Forest's Revenge: a village made up animal troops, pixies and nymphs, druids, and natural buildings (Treant's as defensive towers?)

The Desert: a desert villages with scorpion riders, sand worms (burrowing troop!), and pyramids...

etc...


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Anyway, this is just a fledgling idea, but could be a way to introduce whole new collections of troops to be developed without over-complicating the existing game.

the idea is not bad but it has some flaws to it for example, the idea has to be made copyright and this is acually asking for too much as it will be hard for them to make it with a game already play by millions but it would be best if this idea were to be put into a new game which you could suggest to supercell

By that logic this game is already breaking copyright because it's a lot like Warcraft I & II.

The game mechanic isn't something you can copyright. There are other games very similar to Starcraft, too, and they're fine.

I like the way there will be a more diverse base to attack not just because of the layout.

Check this thread, it also has some specialization ideas
http://forum.supercell.net/showthrea...0106-Clan-Gods

I love this idea! A "Choose your path" method would be very effective. I was thinking it would cost gems to change class or whatever you call it. Best one of these ideas ever! May i suggest that you add that each group has a nemesis/opposite? (more effective or less effective etc.) Also, their nemesis is the replacement of the goblin campaign.

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Originally Posted by FungKoo

By that logic this game is already breaking copyright because it's a lot like Warcraft I & II.

The game mechanic isn't something you can copyright. There are other games very similar to Starcraft, too, and they're fine.

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ok but that doesn't change the fact that it will be hard to put on as there are already tons of people who play coc and this idea requires the whole thing to almost completely change.

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Originally Posted by DarkMetronaJ

ok but that doesn't change the fact that it will be hard to put on as there are already tons of people who play coc and this idea requires the whole thing to almost completely change.

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Well......... people have to adjust anyway and it doesn't change as if they are removing all barracks and that, it is still keeping the original idea.

they could implement an idea like this after level 10

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I love this idea! A "Choose your path" method would be very effective. I was thinking it would cost gems to change class or whatever you call it. Best one of these ideas ever! May i suggest that you add that each group has a nemesis/opposite? (more effective or less effective etc.) Also, their nemesis is the replacement of the goblin campaign.

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Personally, I don't think it needs to cost gems to "elect a mayor"/change class/race/mythology. But, I can see that attaching a small gem cost might be a good idea. To explain...

Part of an idea like this is adding an element of play to extend the game, so high level players don't just sit there at the top with nothing left to do, and so new players can explore different paths. The things is, gems can pose the same advantage as they do currently.

Basically, let's say a player hits level 50 in the regular game as we know it, then decide they want to develop a Goblin village. They tap the Town Hall, elect the Goblin mayor, and reload the game into their brand new Level 0 Goblin village. So they set some things to upgrade and start developing their village. The village will develop only if the "mayor" remains in power -- in otherwords, you can't jump from class to class to get them all developing simultaneously. You have to do them linearly.

Gems are really just a shortcut. You get impatient, so you spend money. The same will hold true if development from mythology/class to mythology/class remains linear. So the financial benefit to Supercell remains the same, and in fact effectively adds 3 times the number of opportunities to use gems (if it was just this model exactly, with a Viking, Goblin, and Undead class added -- though more are of course possible).

So, that's why I don't think gems to elect a mayor are required.

If it went this way, the other thing would be that trophy count would be unique to each class. So you might be a level 50 Multicultural Mix (the current regular game) with 1560 trophies, and Level 12 Goblin with 403 trophies, and Level 0 of the other classes. They'd have to do this to ensure fair competition between villages. All things considered, that's relatively easy to keep track of. Then, if there was a player ranking that included you level and trophies in each class, there'd be a broader dimension to it.

Plus, clans could have mixed village types, which adds a tactical element to clan leadership. (I have another idea for Clan Warfare that I'm working on and will post sometime in the near future ;) )

I like the idea of a nemesis. :) Rock paper scissors built into the game!

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ok but that doesn't change the fact that it will be hard to put on as there are already tons of people who play coc and this idea requires the whole thing to almost completely change.

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I included the existing game as the default way to play, so it stays there. I don't think it changes completely. This is just to add something else to do, expanding the game, adding interest and options for new and old players, and adding lots of elements of strategy.

Plus, with all the other changes that keep being made (like Dark Elixir, new troops for DE and for regular ol' E, extra defenses), the game changes anyway. BUT, it only changes for the highest level players. If they add new troops, I think it would add interest if they weren't just adding high level troops, but also low level troops, so there can be alternatives to the barbarian, archer, and WB, to expand the way we play, rather than only making the game a grind to get to the highest level, which is just expanded forever further and further out of reach of new players.

Keeping the game development to the end fairly short makes a game more interesting to new players. The further out of reach it gets, the more impossible it seems. Also, there's the entrenched top Clans, which will basically never go away, because they are made up of the longest-playing players. Fair enough on the one hand, but disheartening to newer players on the other because it's basically impossible for someone new to ever be top ranked.

Instead of expanding the game linearly by adding higher levels and not changing it at lower levels at all, which will only cause the game to stagnate, I think it would be wiser to go lateral and broaden the ways to play within the existing game mechanic. I'm proposing we play the exact same way, but with options based on alternative balances within the mechanic.

I think adding this to the game would make it more complex and unneeded i think the game is best the way it is and YES

People do want clan wars and more troops to make it interesting which I agree on but this idea although good will make the game more complex rather than interesting so
maybe people are right when they say clan wars or new troops but also considering the people who have already started the game wat then they would have to restart he game going by this idea which people like Jorge Yao won't be happy about


anyway nice ispdea but not needed

Sorry FungKoo, but your idea has gotten far too complicated than i first thought. Simplify your thoughts. Sorry but i'mjumping the fence.

Although it is cool, I think that would change the whole point of clash of clans. It is a perfect, easy game I can check on every few hours (or longer), change a few things, wait for my builders to finish etc. The game is perfectly made so that as you progress, you end up needing to spend more time on the game.

This would mess up the balance a lot.

Boris, I'm not sure what I said that made it more complicated. Were you thinking that you could shift to a new troop type/"class" and retain your level and trophies? (i.e. you wouldn't have to redevelop things?)

That's viable, too, of course. It would add new strategies of play, which would be interesting all by itself. It doesn't have to be a way to extend the game.

I suppose the development part could be handled just having the other troop types be upgradeable in the Lab, without needed to develop/upgrade other buildings types you can only get when playing as a certain "class."

I'm not fixed on the idea being any one particular way -- it's entirely open to suggestions. :)

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Originally Posted by FungKoo

Boris, I'm not sure what I said that made it more complicated. Were you thinking that you could shift to a new troop type/"class" and retain your level and trophies? (i.e. you wouldn't have to redevelop things?)

That's viable, too, of course. It would add new strategies of play, which would be interesting all by itself. It doesn't have to be a way to extend the game.

I suppose the development part could be handled just having the other troop types be upgradeable in the Lab, without needed to develop/upgrade other buildings types you can only get when playing as a certain "class."

I'm not fixed on the idea being any one particular way -- it's entirely open to suggestions. :)

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I was thinking all players would have one base, with their own path. Not multiple bases. Also, i was saying it was complicated because your response was very all-over-the-place. Also also, i was thinking you got this from the start. Correct me if i am wrong.

Thanks
Boris

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Originally Posted by icemann

I think adding this to the game would make it more complex and unneeded i think the game is best the way it is and YESPeople do want clan wars and more troops to make it interesting which I agree on but this idea although good will make the game more complex rather than interesting so maybe people are right when they say clan wars or new troops but also considering the people who have already started the game wat then they would have to restart he game going by this idea which people like Jorge Yao won't be happy aboutanyway nice ispdea but not needed

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Thanks ice for saying what I meant clearly since I've never been good at explaining

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I was thinking all players would have one base, with their own path. Not multiple bases. Also, i was saying it was complicated because your response was very all-over-the-place. Also also, i was thinking you got this from the start. Correct me if i am wrong.

Thanks
Boris

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Oh, I see. No, I think you misunderstood my original point -- it was never about having only one path, but about having the option to switch.

I thought about that, having only one path, but then it's really limiting in the long run. You end up stuck with whatever you select at the beginning, so you might as well just keep the game the way it is. I was thinking that along the way you might want to be able to change classes and try out/develop a different class, with different troops and slightly different defensive arrangements, to add to the way you play.

Now I understand the objection of others. There's no sense being fixed on one path and not being allowed to change. That doesn't add anything for players who already have villages -- only for people who are just starting the game. And that would only make things more complicated, not more interesting. And since there's no way to reset to zero and maintain your existing village, it wouldn't be at all desirable to have other classes.

No -- the original idea, that I first posted, all along has been to be able to change your "active village" to a particular class/mythology, and that each class/mythology has a slightly different balance of troops and defenses to add variety to the game.

What it you simplified it a little.

One path troops are a % stronger

Another path towers are a % stronger

Another building hit points are a % stronger

You can only pick one of the 3 paths and a building is required. The more you upgrade the building the higher the % is. The "building" could be a statue of your specific path.

Barbarian = stronger troops

Wizard = stronger towers

Goblin = stronger buildings

This would be a good idea for a new game... Not this one though.

if your trophies get frozen when you change your mayor it would be unfair for top players who could freeze their topscore and never drop down because they are protected via "mythology switch"

for the rest I like your idea

FungKoo, hmmm i got confused with your second explanation with trophy levels reseting to zero as a new base...

It kinda got more complicated. I thought at a certain level you can chose which specialty are you gonna take

Good point, Spatz, I hadn't thought of that.

I can see two ways to handle that.

1) Atrophy: (pun intended!) The base is unattackable because it is inactive, but there is slow trophy loss due to extended inactivity. Say, maybe 100 or so trophies per week (perhaps a % of your total would be smarter). To avoid trophy loss, you have to have your village be active for a minimum of, say, 3 to 8 or so consecutive hours within that week. Not much time, but long enough that it would slow development in your other villages. (Building in deterrents is essential, after all.)

This would have an added benefit of acting as a zeroing out on trophies for defunct players. If a player spends longer than two or three weeks at zero trophies, with continued atrophy, then their village gets suspended and removed from the game (which would also have the collateral benefit of cleaning up all the dead, single-member clans).

2) All Villages Are Co-Developable: so, even when your other 3 villages are inactive, they remain open for attack, upgrade, acquire resources, etc. The result of this is basically a game where you can manage up to 4 villages in total simultaneously. This might be too much -- perhaps you can manage 2 by default (for free), and by paying 1000 or so gems you can add a third village, 2000 or so for the fourth...

And, flipping from one village to another would count as that village being "logged off" and therefore attackable -- which is another solution to the 24/7 Online defensive strategy.

My problem with this option is that is changes the fundamentals of the game pretty substantially. I prefer the idea of each village "class" essentially being it's own individual path within the game. On the other hand, you could have it run basically as 4 or more different apps: "Clash of Clans: Classic!", "Clash of Clans: The Undead!", "Clash of Clans: Goblins!" etc... But, within that, I like the idea that each "class" of village could attack the other. Hence the idea of having the classes operate within the existing game, rather than parallel to it. But, if could be parallel just as easy. I'd sure download CoC: The Undead and play it if it came out tomorrow. :)

lol, lots of good ideas but it seems difficult to find a good balance. the big success of coc come with it's relative easy gameplay and this would get broken by you idea. you have to be constantly looking after your villages.

I think the different trophies impacted by the choice of your mythology is the difficult part in your idea. I would rather let one general trophy count.

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FungKoo, hmmm i got confused with your second explanation with trophy levels reseting to zero as a new base...

It kinda got more complicated. I thought at a certain level you can chose which specialty are you gonna take

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Any significant addition to the game -- whether it's a new way to play like water-based warfare, Clan Warfare, etc -- will be enormously complicated. It's difficult to imagine the entire game, with all the mechanics that have been balanced, and figure out a way to make it all work.

It's also extremely difficult to implement a change at any TH level lower than the highest -- currently 10 -- because no matter what it is, it will alter the fabric of the game underneath the highest level players. This is why so many updates and new buildings/units/etc are only added to the top, and not available to lower TH levels.

So the trouble with choosing a specialty at a certain level/TH level, is again that it would change the game underneath of the higher level players, so you somehow have to account for them. And really, if a major addition doesn't add something that the highest level players might also want to do, if it doesn't add interest and ways to play for them, then it's not going to attract those higher level players and keep them in the game longer (or help the game to earn their money).

So yeah... it is complicated.

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Spatz

lol, lots of good ideas but it seems difficult to find a good balance. the big success of coc come with it's relative easy gameplay and this would get broken by you idea. you have to be constantly looking after your villages.

I think the different trophies impacted by the choice of your mythology is the difficult part in your idea. I would rather let one general trophy count.

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Yeah, the trophy system is really the lynch pin of this whole idea.

The main issue I want to address with this idea is adding elements of strategy through a variety of types of troops, but in a way that maintains a balanced game.

Ideally, this idea would be something available to players who aren't yet at level 10 TH, but also available to level 10-ers. It's managing that, AND letting the trophies function, that makes it so tricky.

If there's a general trophy count, then I think the only workable solution is be able to flip your specialty and basically just re-skin your village. You'd keep everything you have at the same level. You'd have to be able to upgrade all of the types of troops from any specialty in your lab all the time.

The alternative, if you keep your current trophies but start a goblin village, say, from the beginning, is you'd have a super low level village but huge trophies, and you'd just get plowed by attackers in the match-up system.

So I suppose there's nothing really wrong with doing it that way, flipping directly, but for the higher level players then it's only about attack/defense strategy. There's no development curve. And for Supercell, there's no added financial incentive, since those top players wouldn't need to develop/upgrade anything and spend money on gems (once at the top, they have probably spent all the money they need to or ever will spend, right?).

That's the other trick of any change. So many of people's feature requests never address the financial end. If the suggested modification doesn't include a potential for financial gain, Supercell has no real incentive to listen to it. Maybe, though, their financial strategy is based on farming the low level players and leaving the high level players as prestige markers -- representing the social hiearchy of the game -- and aren't concerned about getting more money from them.

If so, then the direct flip option (choose a mayor, and your village updates to that mythology/class parameters and maintains current levels of items as-is) is the way to go. Leaves the trophy system intact.



(Thanks, all, for your feedback, comments. The idea is evolving nicely :) )

I love the idea, just I don't think this will be implemented.
Reason: CoC devs are really close to the max amount of on-air data limit made by apple. Adding this or changing the game would need more space, and you cannot compare this to a fully featured PC game :/. Excellent idea though! Love it! Best idea I have seen on this forum after my ones obviously :p. No, I'm joking dude, this idea is better than my ones in my signature.

What's the on-air data limit? You mean a bandwidth limit? Or a limit on the size of the game itself?

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Originally Posted by FungKoo

So the trouble with choosing a specialty at a certain level/TH level, is again that it would change the game underneath of the higher level players, so you somehow have to account for them. And really, if a major addition doesn't add something that the highest level players might also want to do, if it doesn't add interest and ways to play for them, then it's not going to attract those higher level players and keep them in the game longer (or help the game to earn their money).

So yeah... it is complicated.

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What i meant is that there are simpler ways for your idea to be less complicated. Have it implemented after TH lvl 10. 10 is a good number to start a different aspect of the game. in that way it won't affect the levels below it.

The idea is not bad but, as is this is a very big change even in its simplest form, The fact it adds diversity to the game also makes it far harder to read in a few seconds the strength of a players base for this reason alone changes that effect a villages look may make players unhappy.
So for me its a no.

but adding complexity or extra troops is good see below.

if you just want new troop types a simpler hiring troops from a tavern or dock system can add new troops to all players at all levels just set the cost based on the troops power. Limit the amount of troops you can hire and how long you can have them.

To add extra complexity, why not in the form of mini games based around food and resources.
That can have effects on production in your main base so a mini game that give you mini villages to protect from goblins
if you do well you get extra resources. Or buffs for your main game.

or just add goblin raids to your base that if you win it resets some of the single player maps. Or just reward with troops or loot. Or allow you to capture goblins that you can attack players with. Like super goblins or archer goblins etc etc.


or simpler you have a mini game you can attack a random village built by supercell, with set amount of troops that are provided, if you win you get the loot the more you complete over a 2 week period the harder they become they could limit loot reward mini games to players with no shields so to stop possible farming from mini games under shields.


mini games should count as being logged in, so you are not just sat waiting for troops to build.

Their are many possible mini games based on clash that could be used to entertain players during troop builds waiting times.

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The idea is not bad but, as is this is a very big change even in its simplest form, The fact it adds diversity to the game also makes it far harder to read in a few seconds the strength of a players base for this reason alone changes that effect a villages look may make players unhappy.
So for me its a no.

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On the one hand, I see what you're saying. But, I think people would adjust quickly -- if it was limited to only a few available paths, say three or four at most, then people would learn quickly. Besides, most things would be the same: walls, barracks, lab, town hall, clan castle, etc.

Plus, learning the new strategies is basically what I'm suggesting would be interesting. People stop doing things that aren't challenging and when they aren't learning anything new...

Could we have a wizard race.
like there would be a wizard race among the other ones?
let me explain some ideas.
Red wizard:fire wizard that shouts fire balls like normal level 1-4 wizards and he would have a red outfit and area splash damage.
Yellow wizard: electric wizard that shouts lightning like level 5 wizard and has a yellow outfit and area splash damage too.
Green wizard: plant wizard that shouts out acid and has a green outfit
blue wizard:water wizard that shoots really boiling water at his enemies and does burning damage and blu outfit.
brown wizard: earth wizard that makes stone shards come out the ground just underneath walls to destroy them and shouts out heavy rocks onto buildings and has a brown outfit.
white wizard:ice wizard that shouts ice shards at his enemies to pierce them and also freeze them.

i hope you like it.


Sincerly, Miguel

Sorry for errors I just realized about them after I posted.