Clan war Opt in and Out was done wrong.

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Originally Posted by Foreigner

Would this still be a problem if the leader/co-leaders' selection corresponds to clan members' preference by default? It does, when you go to the screen to start the war it shows what they picked and you can leave it or change it.





I'm not criticizing SC for this feature. It does make my job easier and I appreciate they finally implemented this feature I have been waiting for. But just like Jwp721 said in post #30, I too think it can be improved a little more. Not just for my clan but thousands of casual clans out there. Treat it as a friendly suggestion, not criticism.

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But I think the OPs suggestion of having everyone opted out after each war is not an improvement at all. In fact I think it is a terrible idea that would make a mess of things

And the title of this thread very much sounds like criticism. I felt bad when I saw it for how unfair a statement I thought that was.

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Originally Posted by Hickster83

I truly don't understand why so many people cant grasp the logic here.

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Yep yep yep.

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Originally Posted by rwelshjr

But I think the OPs suggestion of having everyone opted out after each war is not an improvement at all. In fact I think it is a terrible idea that would make a mess of things.

And the title of this thread very much sounds like criticism. I felt bad when I saw it for how unfair a statement I thought that was.

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I agree the title is unnecessarily harsh, but it's a topic of my interest because I had a similar thought due to my experience in the past few days. It was my job to make sure everyone in my clan understands the new system and repetitively remind them to change their preference if they think they will not be able to participate. I believe if everyone was opt out on the first day, we would be able to start levelling our clan sooner because then we'd know everyone who opt'ed in have done so under their consent. Even if we end up starting with less people, it's better than going with more people with a small risk of having a few of them unable to participate, or wait a whole day to make sure everyone got the message. We chose to wait a whole day to make sure everyone got the message. Maybe my clan is different because we usually have people taking a day off especially on weekdays, that's why I was certain some members wouldn't be able to participate even though their preference says otherwise.

For more war-oriented clans it will probably be different. And I can agree that it would be a chore if the leader needs to opt out every single member one by one, resulting unnecessary mess as you implied. But I also think this problem isn't too difficult to solve. With my very limited programming experience, I think it can be solved by passing a value so that the default selection the clan leader sees is the same as clan members' preference. This way if every member opt'ed in, every member in the leader's UI is automatically selected. And maybe add a "select all/unselect all" checkbox if it helps. (I have never started a clan search after the update, only screen shots, so a part of this is speculation.)

As for OP's idea, I don't think it's a good idea to opt out after each war, but to opt out after each matchmaking was made. This way every member is given a 48 hour time to change their preference before the next war is started. This would be a useful addition for my clan and alike because only a portion of us want to war consecutively. We are bound to have people who participated in today's war but may not be available 48 hours later. To ensure everyone enrolled in the clan can participate, I think it's better if they are assumed to be out unless they opt'ed in within 48 hours. I'm one of the most active war participants in my clan and I personally wouldn't mind doing pressing a few buttons every 48 hours to reduce the uncertainty to the minimal.

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Originally Posted by dave5872

You are probably in a big time war clan where everyone is all fired up about wars all the time so I understand why none of this makes sense to you. The other 95% of us aren't ......

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That is a ridiculous statistic. If its 95% anything its that 95% are the clans where the whole point is to do war so everyone is going always barring occasional special situations. Especially since this topic is about clan war features its war clans that will be using them the most. You are going to have to accept that if your clan is not about war you are in fact in a very tiny minority. It would be a mistake for them to make things hard for 95% of the people just to appease a handful of guys that are only complaining that they are expected to do a little clan management.

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Originally Posted by Foreigner

As for OP's idea, I don't think it's a good idea to opt out after each war, but to opt out after each matchmaking was made.

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I am not a fan of the current opt-in mechanism but opting out after every single war sounds a bit like overkill. It should have been done right from the beginning when this feature was introduced, changing anyone's war setting afterwards is bound to create problems and confusion unfortunately ...

There are still a couple of possible solutions that SC could implement without impacting the non-stop war clans where almost everyone is active too much:

1. Reset everyone to opt-out at the beginning of the season to ensure that long-term inactive players' settings are set to "out".
2. Allow leaders/cos to change players' default settings (which would allow leaders to overwrite the war preferences of inactive players)
3. Make the player selection page where players are selected/excluded by whoever is starting the war "stick" so that minimal changes are needed when starting the next war. Once inactives have been excluded they would not be included automatically in the next war even if their preference is set to "in"
4. Automatically set players' war preferences to "out" based on some criteria that have yet to be determined (e.g. not using at least 1 attack or even going online in last war). This should be configurable in the settings since different clans have different tolerance levels.
5. Add some additional information on player selection page so that whoever is starting the war can easily identify inactives and make sure they are included (e.g. last time they attacked, last time they were online, war participation for last 3 wars, etc.)

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Originally Posted by CanadianLegend

There are still a couple of possible solutions that SC could implement without impacting the non-stop war clans where almost everyone is active too much:

1. Reset everyone to opt-out at the beginning of the season to ensure that long-term inactive players' settings are set to "out".
2. Allow leaders/cos to change players' default settings (which would allow leaders to overwrite the war preferences of inactive players)
3. Make the player selection page where players are selected/excluded by whoever is starting the war "stick" so that minimal changes are needed when starting the next war. Once inactives have been excluded they would not be included automatically in the next war even if their preference is set to "in"
4. Automatically set players' war preferences to "out" based on some criteria that have yet to be determined (e.g. not using at least 1 attack or even going online in last war). This should be configurable in the settings since different clans have different tolerance levels.
5. Add some additional information on player selection page so that whoever is starting the war can easily identify inactives and make sure they are included (e.g. last time they attacked, last time they were online, war participation for last 3 wars, etc.)

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I don't want our players automatically opted out at the start of the season, start of the week, start of the month, whatever. I don't want players automatically opted out based on any criteria you could invent. This would create a ridiculous burden on every clan as now no one would would actually know who wants to actually be in or out as everyone would be set the same. It would destory every clan's war schedule. What happens to the clan who has a war scheduled but suddenly all their active players get reset to opted out? They get stuck with a big mess.

Our players actually want to play Clan Wars. I shouldn't have to manage my active players so that you don't have to manage your inactive ones. Who are we trying to serve, people who actually play the game or people who don't and couldn't be bothered to let their team know? Clan Wars has been out for almost a year now. If you don't know who your players are by now, no system is going to help you. If you have players in your clan who aren't playing, aren't donating, aren't participating in war, you can always remove them from your clan. If you want to carry them for some strange reason (they aren't benefiting you and they're not getting any benefit from being in the clan), then you should be prepared to manage it. You shouldn't expect the game to make it harder for clans who have members who actually play the game, just to make things easier for clans who don't.

Kick your inactive players. If they become active again, they can rejoin and opt out of wars.

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Originally Posted by SharkyFinn

I don't want our players automatically opted out at the start of the season, start of the week, start of the month, whatever. I don't want players automatically opted out based on any criteria you could invent. This would create a ridiculous burden on every clan as now no one would would actually know who wants to actually be in or out as everyone would be set the same. It would destory every clan's war schedule. What happens to the clan who has a war scheduled but suddenly all their active players get reset to opted out? They get stuck with a big mess.

Our players actually want to play Clan Wars. I shouldn't have to manage my active players so that you don't have to manage your inactive ones. Who are we trying to serve, people who actually play the game or people who don't and couldn't be bothered to let their team know? Clan Wars has been out for almost a year now. If you don't know who your players are by now, no system is going to help you. If you have players in your clan who aren't playing, aren't donating, aren't participating in war, you can always remove them from your clan. If you want to carry them for some strange reason (they aren't benefiting you and they're not getting any benefit from being in the clan), then you should be prepared to manage it. You shouldn't expect the game to make it harder for clans who have members who actually play the game, just to make things easier for clans who don't.

Kick your inactive players. If they become active again, they can rejoin and opt out of wars.

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a good leader should know who has or has not been on. I personally am always for war, but I should not have to go in and reset my war option, because other clans can't keep track of their players. If it's too much for you then maybe you need to step down and let a type A personality take over.

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Originally Posted by CanadianLegend

I am not a fan of the current opt-in mechanism but opting out after every single war sounds a bit like overkill. It should have been done right from the beginning when this feature was introduced, changing anyone's war setting afterwards is bound to create problems and confusion unfortunately ...

There are still a couple of possible solutions that SC could implement without impacting the non-stop war clans where almost everyone is active too much:

1. Reset everyone to opt-out at the beginning of the season to ensure that long-term inactive players' settings are set to "out".
2. Allow leaders/cos to change players' default settings (which would allow leaders to overwrite the war preferences of inactive players)
3. Make the player selection page where players are selected/excluded by whoever is starting the war "stick" so that minimal changes are needed when starting the next war. Once inactives have been excluded they would not be included automatically in the next war even if their preference is set to "in"
4. Automatically set players' war preferences to "out" based on some criteria that have yet to be determined (e.g. not using at least 1 attack or even going online in last war). This should be configurable in the settings since different clans have different tolerance levels.
5. Add some additional information on player selection page so that whoever is starting the war can easily identify inactives and make sure they are included (e.g. last time they attacked, last time they were online, war participation for last 3 wars, etc.)

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Those are some interesting points. But I think if changing anyone's war setting will create confusion for the users, point #1 and #4 will probably create some confusion as well. They are also not required if the "inactive" members are not really inactive but can change the setting themselves. In my scenario, the "inactives" refers to people who are technically active but regularly sits out on certain days, and the purpose of my suggestion was so that these people won't remain opt'ed in in case they forgot to change their setting after they have finished a war but planning to sit out in another war.

With the new system, my clan is trying to war 24/7 which is new for us consider we used to war only once a week. Not everyone in my clan is going to enjoy warring that much. We are bound to run in smaller group and have people opt in and out, and maybe one day someone will forget he is still opt'ed in for the war. I believe if we could reduce that possibility to the minimal, it would be easier for my clan's management. Clans with different orientation or management style may think otherwise, but I think it shouldn't cause too much trouble for them if other changes come with my suggestion.

Personally I like the set up but everyone is different

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Originally Posted by HolyCritacular

Or it could have been done a much easier way?

Forcing people to choose when it was implemented or default being out is not hard to change.

Now we have to lose a war, write down or kick those who don't pay attention. Get new members, write those down or kick those if they don't attack and repeat over and over again.

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You should have been doing this all along. My clan has used a bounce list every week for the past 6 months and there has not been a single war where we had under 95% participation.