Allow us to upgrade our walls with elixir again or Reduce the price to upgrade them.
Printable View
Allow us to upgrade our walls with elixir again or Reduce the price to upgrade them.
I completely agree with this, my elixir storage always gets full once I'm done building the 2-4 elixir buildings in a TH upgrade. You're basically stuck holding onto Elixir anywhere from 3-7 days before you can upgrade a unit, meanwhile you have all your defenses to upgrade and walls (which are insanely expensive)Quote:
Originally Posted by Keroll
This patch basically screws over anyone who hit th7-8 after the patch. All these bases have upgraded walls and you're stuck with bad defenses or bad walls.
You still can with Level 9+ Walls. They only just changed it, so I don't see them changing it back just yet, if at all.
So basically the game is too difficult for you and you want it to be easier?Quote:
Originally Posted by Keroll
That last update completely screwed newer players. It is about impossible to upgrade your walls without being able to use elixer or gold. Bad, bad decision and should be reversed because it doesn't affect all players equally.
Stop complaining. What about those people who already upgraded their walls? Go farm. You can still use elixir to upgrade walls to 9+.
Lv 9 wall for th7
i think thats good
No, it only screwed over the TH8's. If you don't count walls, the upgrades at TH7 cost way more elixir than gold.Quote:
Originally Posted by CaptainZ
If you factor in that you should be spending elixir on spells/armies for raiding, then TH7 should be fairly balanced, even including walls with gold only. Sure, there might be a little excess elixir, but not a ton. You shouldn't be sitting on a full elixir storage for a month. If you are, you did it wrong. You rushed your elixir upgrades, or you farmed more elixir than gold. I honestly have no pity for TH7's that complain about not being able to upgrade their walls with elixir.
TH8's, on the other hand, require way more gold than elixir, even if you don't count the walls. The walls just add insult to injury. The TH8's are the only ones who got screwed by the update. I do feel sorry for them.
But it's a balancing act by Supercell. If Supercell let TH8's upgrade walls with elixir, it would make it that much harder for TH9's to farm effectively. And you'll be at TH9 for a lot longer than the extra few weeks you have to grind out your walls at TH8. If it really bothers you that much, upgrade to TH9 as soon as you max all your buildings, regardless of whether your walls are finished.
Impossible? Lol. You might want to save yourself anguish later on in the game and quit now because if spending 200k per wall is impossible for you, then you are really going to struggle if you ever make it to TH9 where upgrades cost 3, 4, and 5 million or more of gold.Quote:
Originally Posted by BillKost
stop cry, its better than was before ...
U have to farm to upgrade everythink, why each newbie wanna have lower costs of everythink or everythink on lower th ? ...
3 mil per wall is easy if loot not as bad as now new year boost hopefully make more good baseQuote:
Originally Posted by Scuba061
Walls are not owed to players. They are to be earned. The problem with having elixir for L8 walls is that it makes them insanely easy to get. With the excess elixir, walls function soley as a resource dump, which defeats the purpose of even having them.
L8 walls are the pivotal point when players decide if walls are important to them. It should not be given away. You can do just fine with L7 walls at TH9 and beyond. You want better walls? Earn them. Stop complaining that you lost a way to dump your resources into something that you never would have bothered upgrading in the first place because it was too difficult for you.
You're really gonna drop the "walls are not owed, earn them" line to this guy when you fought me tooth and nail on both points when I said to either:Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuba061
A) get rid of elixir for walls entirely "But they're too expensive at lvl 9+, it's needed!" Too bad, walls are earned, not owed. Earn it with gold, it should be a grind.
or 2) reform the system so that all THs from 7-10 can use elixir on them, but with only "excess, earned elixir" so that they can't break the economy. "People should be able to use elixir on walls whenever they want if that's what they want to do and not have a minimum held first." Fine, then release it totally unrestricted for TH7+ again and don't complain when the economy goes to hell once again.
You are such a troll it is unbelievable. Find literally one thing that doesn't immediately contradict yourself in every one of your arguments, and stick to it. Jesus Christ...
Nice thing see you still have debate on other thread lolQuote:
Originally Posted by Goobers
everyone just stick to idea that benefits him more except some people
I am th8 and there is no problem to earn gold for walls. It is not easy, but it is possible to build them all in quite sort time. The only problem for me is, that I have full elixir storages almost all the time since last update and believe me I tried really hard to spend it for various baracks upgrades. But I am attacking a lot and gold can be spent for walls. however there is nothing to spend elixir for. The only way to balance is making army of dragons for example, which is not really necesary for farming. I wouldn't mind spending elixir for walls again. At least for lvl8 walls. Th7 can use gold for it, it wasn't difficult at all.
I am lucky when i am on last starge of th8 they bring this feature and bcoz of that almost not having excess of elixQuote:
Originally Posted by Goldentown
and as th9 now they make it lv9 ++ thats good timing farming lava now
u just need luck bro/sis
Hey, it's all about balance. Make level 8 walls available with elixir, and yes, it will benefit TH8's (well, at least the ones that have finished all the elixir upgrades they plan to do).Quote:
Originally Posted by AlvinSoehendryWijaya
Make walls gold-only at TH8, and it benefits TH9's. The benefit to TH9 players is admittedly smaller than the benefit to TH8's. But that's where you have to factor a few things in. You will be at TH9 for a LOT longer than at TH8, even if you can only buy level 8 walls with gold. More elixir available for TH9's to farm from TH8's means they have more elixir to build strong armies to farm for gold and DE. It also gives them the elixir they need to buy L9 and L10 walls, which cost WAY more than the L8 walls.
On the balance, I think it's better for the game overall to have it the way it is now.
What Goobers has suggested is a compromise, which would give the TH8's (and TH7's) a way to build their walls faster, while also leaving most of their excess elixir in play (i.e., available to be looted). For a TH8 (or TH7), it's better than the current situation. So why oppose it? L7 and L8 walls aren't coming back, no matter how hard people cry, so why not accept a compromise that helps TH8's while also keeping things essentially the way the are for TH9's?
it will make end game harderQuote:
Originally Posted by Xitra
just in case farming 8 mil elixir for a single lv 11 wall except they add +50% storage for elixir
really?
except you do this to only th7/8
Worst post of the day, and he's spamming every thread he can find with it. At least he has figured out to search.Quote:
Originally Posted by tth5
And again, that limitation is only for those players who farm that effectively at those higher TH lvls, and it's only for elixir. Keep in mind that looking at this from before the update, it's still allowing players to use elixir whereas that wasn't even a possibility before. The compromise would allow players to upgrade walls much faster than when gold was the only option, but would retain farming to essentially the same levels as if this update were never released (but it drastically reduces the amount of wasted elixir when compared to elixir never being allowed for walls, thus giving elixir significant value again to every TH, regardless of how developed their TH is).Quote:
Originally Posted by AlvinSoehendryWijaya
It's also just temporary, as they will finish their endgame defensive structures much quicker than what they'll even be able to make a dent in the endgame walls. And if that temporary waste that comes from needing to hold the lootable max in elixir is really that big of a problem to a specific player, there's always the option that has been available to all players since walls required builders to upgrade: keep one builder free at all times. If players place a higher priority in upgrading their walls than progressing all other structures as quick as possible (and they're farming at that insane rate up at TH10) they can sacrifice 20% efficiency in their building upgrade progress so that they never waste elixir for walls.
Like Xitra said, it's a compromise. I've never tried to deny that. Yes, it doesn't allow everyone to continue dumping elixir exactly as they are now, but it's a compromise which hardly limits what TH9/10s can do, restores the economy for TH10s, and also allows TH7/8s to use elixir on walls once again.
Something similar was just discussed in our clan chat, and there was a very good point made about how it is important to keep the game difficult. People would not still be playing this game if it were easy to finish, they would have moved on to something else and Clash would be dead.Quote:
Originally Posted by AlvinSoehendryWijaya
Before this change, it was a real nightmare to get elixir at th8, 9, and 10. Everyone was dumping it into walls. You're not going to be a th7 forever. It doesn't even take that long to move up to 8, and when you do the current system will benefit you.
Never said anything about needing to use elixir on walls at L9+ because it's too hard. But then again, you're the same person who said it's "significantly easier" to raise 1 billion in total resources than it is to farm 112.5M in gold, so I don't really expect much in the way of intelligent conversation coming from you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Goobers
I've already explained everything and have been consistent. Bottom line is that all these crybabies want is an easy way to build walls. The ONLY reason they want this is to dump excess elixir. You think these same losers who have trouble raising 500K in gold for a wall will be able to dump excess elixir into walls at TH9? They won't have the same excess since there is way more to spend in elixir at TH9 and TH10. The elixir wall update won't even do these losers any good beyond L8 walls.
Prior to the initial wall update, there was excess elixir at ALL LEVELS. It was a devalued resource that even high level players didn't trouble themselves to protect. This adds at least some value to it.
Are you purposefully trying to derail discussions that have substance with nonsense, or are you just an actual moron? I did not say that, and do you know why I didn't say that? B/c it's a stupid and blatantly incorrect statement, and I can mentally operate at a level above "trolling" to know that it's stupid.Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuba061
You, on the other hand, legitimately assumed that I was inferring players could and would farm gold to elixir at a 1:8 ratio when I gave you the example of just how broken the current system is, and how TH9s can easily game it to dump all their elixir from storages even without having skull walls. So don't try and misquote what I say as idiocy when you have been displaying it with full context.
And I have constantly stated that those players are wrong, as they are looking at it from the selfishness of one TH lvl, the one they are currently at (TH8). It should in absolutely no way go back to lvl 7/8 walls in the same fashion as before. What I've proposed couldn't be further from what these kids are spamming here on the forum.Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuba061
However most of them are not saying that it's too hard to farm 500k gold, but once again you go and reword their complaints into some non-argument that they've never said in the first place. In fact they are farming resources at solid rates, but 75%+ of the elixir they raid ends up going to waste every raid, b/c they have overflowing storages. They have buildings that require gold to upgrade, so they can do walls but only with what's left after the upgrade, and only in gold, while TH9/10s are able to continue to have an otherwise highly devalued resource that they can commit 100% to walls while doing their normal progression.
To say that the only reason they want it back is to dump elixir is also totally subjective. I would agree with you as this being their reason, but TH9s are doing the same thing, so don't try and make it like TH8s were the ones responsibly for ruining the economy with the update. Pshh, as if it's on them, and not the system that allows elixir to be dumped into walls without any restriction that's to blame.
That is correct, and it also caused zero problems with the economy. When they went from no elixir for walls, to being able to dump as much elixir as they could into walls, elixir went from being of little value to established THs, to being so scarce that it became the most sought after resource, and consequently broke the entire economy. Elixir is a staple in the offensive aspect of the game, which is what drives this game. Having too much didn't cause any actual problems with being able to play the game, but having little to none of it in the matchmaking queues caused very real problems and has a far worse result. The swing was far too great, and the source that caused it (elixir for walls) needed to be modified so that elixir can still hold value to all players, but doesn't do what the first and second update did, and allow it to be used without restriction. That's the entire reason I made that thread, to fix what problem this still absolutely causes for TH10s.Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuba061
http://supercell-forum-content.s3.am...quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Poppoger http://supercell-forum-content.s3.am...post-right.png
I am primarily interested in creating a defensive village. I was very happy that we were able to use elixir for wall upgrades, and extremely unhappy that that was changed. 200k and 500k walls for an entire village are extremely hard to do with just gold!
http://supercell-forum-content.s3.am...quote_icon.png Originally Posted by Scuba061 http://supercell-forum-content.s3.am...post-right.png
They're supposed to be hard. And really, 200k walls are not difficult at all.
"They're supposed to be hard..." but they're supposed to be considerably less hard when you're a TH9, when you can use both resources to do them. Sound logic, buddy.
Here's what you said, Goobers. What you said is in blue. Copied it from the thread that you were kind of to post a link. I thank you for saving me time. Here you say EXACTLY WORD FOR WORD that it is considerably easier to to build walls at TH9 (farming 1B in combined resources) than it is to farm in just gold at TH8 and below.
You just look at this with ZERO common sense. Yes, they THEORETICALLY could job it. But it's makes absolutely zero sense except to you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Goobers
I've asked this before and you haven't given me a satisfactory response. If a player has trouble raising 500k to pay for walls, what makes you think they'll have it any easier paying an additional 4M per wall? If they think 500k is too much then they certainly will think 4M is too much. And as you've conceded, they really only want the elixir for walls as a resource dump. But consider WHY it's a resource dump. They won't have that same excess at TH9 when the upgrades are considerably more expensive.
It's like saying that if I buy an $80,000 car (L8 walls), then I'll be eligible to buy a $500,000 car (L9 walls). Although, for the $500,000 car I can split the cost with someone and only owe $250,000. If I couldn't afford the $80,000 car (gold) what on EARTH makes you think I'll be able to raise the $250,000 (gold and elixir) to split with someone on the 2nd car???
And you want my solution?
I can give 2 craps about being able to use elixir or not for any wall level except 8. If these crybabies think it's sooooo impossible to farm 75K or 200K in gold per wall for L6 and L7, fine. Let them have their elixir upgrades for those level walls. It's irrelevant because building those walls with gold only is a joke anyway. And hey, it'll help solve that excess elixir problem for TH8s since they'll lose those 7s with abundant elixir.
L8 walls are the important ones where it's crucial that elixir can't be spent.
That is exactly what I said. Not that farming the 1B total resources is easier than farming 125M gold, but that it's easier when you can use both of the main resources instead of letting the other go to waste, virtual thin air. This has everything to do with the fact that TH9/10s can now game the system without building skull walls yet, while TH7/8s have had that ability removed for them entirely. It's inconsistent, and it continues to break the economy for TH10s b/c the second revert update was a lazy band-aid fix, where a reform of the system allowing it is what was actually needed...Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuba061
... but you seem dead set on not accepting that TH9s will do this, b/c it takes two modicums of sense to reach that resource dump opportunity instead of one, when before lvl 7+ walls were able to be done with elixir.Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuba061
The way it's set up now forces you (or I should say, strongly encourages you) to either move to TH9 right when your big ticket elixir upgrades are done, or forfeit quite a lot of elixir in the form of wasted raids, via overflowing storages. Don't drop this "TH9s could THEORETICALLY do it" line as if they're trying to figure out the algorithm for some financial derivative ♥♥. It is so basically understood for anyone who takes one minute to analyze their options.
What do you want me to answer? If they can barely farm 500k for a wall upgrade then no, it's gonna be near impossible for them to farm 4M. How does that validate anything you're saying?Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuba061
Nobody is saying that they can't farm 500k, they're saying that they have overflowing elixir storages that are utterly useless to them, while TH9/10s do not have that problem at all. Where are they saying that they need elixir for walls b/c they can't farm 500k gold?
And the reason it's not a problem for TH9s is purely due to this update. I have two accounts that have been to/through TH9, don't try and pass off this notion that TH9s have a limitless need for elixir where TH8s do not.
- 4 army camps
- laboratory
- spell factory
- 2 oil drills and storage (not completely necessary, but convenient, and throwing them in there just to stretch out the elixir requirements to help strengthen your argument as those 3 things require 8 total upgrades at TH9)
4th gold storage takes a grand total of like 4 days and less than 1M elixir to max out, so I'm not throwing that in there. Then Barbarians/Archers/Giants/Balloons lvl 6. Those are the necessary upgrades for becoming an established TH9. 14 upgrades requiring builders, and the entire thing can be completed in the first month. Then it's just grinding out farming while you choose whether to dump elixir into walls, upgrade dark barracks/regular barracks if you haven't completed them yet and feel like doing it, but the main point is that elixir is no longer a highly valued resource. Therefore it starts going into walls in order to keep elixir levels low while making base/wall progress.
I haven't completed the needed ones for my TH10 yet b/c of the garbage economy, but I can already tell you that it's just 4 army camps, lab, spell factory, 3rd oil drill and the 7th gold mine. 12 needed elixir upgrades and then 12 from the mine. Expensive upgrades, mind you, but just like TH9s, hardly limitless.
And yet you're still saying the same thing. It's still waaaay more difficult to farm L9 and L10 walls even if you can use both because it's costing you almost 9 times as much total resources. And "gaming" the system in the manner you suggest is not feasible for the type of players that are whining about this. For a hardcore, or even a very good farmer, this change won't matter at all because they are going to farm their walls regardless. The type of player who struggles to farm 112.5M won't even dream of trying to spend 500k gold at a time just for the sole purpose of dumping 4M elixir BECAUSE THEY CAN'T DO IT. I don't get what's so hard to understand about that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Goobers
And explain to me how that was any different than the way the system was before. If the gold/elixir upgrades are so out of balance, then it was just the same before the initial update. If the player is going to move up early, it's so they can use elixir for building or troop upgrades, NOT so they can try to dump 4M excess elixir per wall.Quote:
Originally Posted by Goobers
It validates everything. If it's near impossible for them to farm 4M, then that kind of makes it difficult for them to follow your genius plan of gaming the system by upgrading a single 500k wall at a time just so they can dump 4M more into that same wall.Quote:
Originally Posted by Goobers
Actually, yeah they are saying that. Have you not read the hundreds of complaints on here that the walls are sooooo impossible to do because they're too expensive? Pretty much the only way they can farm them is to use excess loot.Quote:
Originally Posted by Goobers
Oh wow, so now you're going to say which elixir upgrades are necessary and which onese aren't? Hmmm, I wonder how many of these crybaby TH8s actually do have elixir upgrades left, but simply don't want to do them because they're deemed "not necessary". Sorry, but if you have stuff you could spend elixir on, but choose not to for your own reasons, then that's your problem. In fact, there was one guy on another of these threads that said he had plenty of troop upgrades to do, but didn't want to them so it wouldn't affect his war ranking. Are freaking kidding me?? Sorry, no sympathy for people like that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Goobers
Ladies please. I don't even know what you two are arguing about any more.
Neither do I really. Just saw him call me out, so I responded.Quote:
Originally Posted by dahimi
I've had enough of this anyway. It's pointless.
They need to reduce the cost of high level walls in the first place.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dahimi
That's b/c I'm arguing with an idiot, which also says a lot about me lol. I had a very simple, very effective proposal that would eliminate the economical problems from elixir for walls, while letting TH7-10s be able to upgrade them with elixir. Then this clown comes and starts picking apart and rewording things I'm not even saying and throwing around nonsense to try and derail the main point that this proposal would accomplish.Quote:
Originally Posted by Scuba061
I had gotten through lv 7 walls and had around 30 lv 8 before the update. Then the update happened and I had already had all my troops upgraded so I was like YESSSSS Thanks COC!!! In the short time that they had it i got enough walls upgraded to were I only had 50 left. By the time they took it off. I was bummed lol. While at the same time I was a little mad because knowing that TH 7 can get their walls in half or three fourths of the time it took me too(honestly made me mad at that part lol). When the patch came off I just went down to silver one and two and farmed them like normal. My elixir quickly filled to 6mil. But before the patch walls were hard to upgrade and still are now. Why should that change? I have put time into them and to think that others spend less to get the same product. Is like if you buy a car for 5,000 $ and the value goes down on the car making it worth 4,500$ a week after you bought it you aren't gonna be happy Lol. Odd analogy I know LOL!!!. But to me that would be similar to what this thread is asking for.
Odd am I not ;) ?lol
Funny how the year or so it takes to max th9 and th10 is classified as 'just temporary'Quote:
Originally Posted by Goobers
I think they should bring back the elixir walls for lvl 7 or 8 walls because the price dramatically increases
No need to lower the requirement for elixir walls.
No need to lower the price either.
This game is built for the long run, I've been clashing for 2 years and still love it. Making walls difficult is one reason I still love the game today.
Quote:
Originally Posted by daz258
Exactly. Same here. Nailed it.
Also, many players suffered an elixir shortage at lower levels when they had the wall elixir upgrade for levels 6 and above, so you would be complaining about that if supercell changed it back.Quote:
Originally Posted by EpicChris
Actually you came on here and called me out. I wasn't responding to your ♥♥♥♥♥♥ed proposal because it wasn't even on this particular thread. But what do I know? I'm just reveling in how so much easier it is for me to do walls now that I can spend 1B in combined resources rather than the incredibly difficult task of farming 112.5M gold. Boy am I glad I'm past that stage. You made me realize how incredibly brutal it was to be a TH8 with excess elixir all the time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Goobers
Nice try, though... clown.