Mass Drag question

I've gotten pretty good with the mass dragon attacks. I'm TH8 and and usually get three stars more than half the time against the other TH8's and TH9's. My typical strategy has been to use 3 lightning spells right at the beginning and then unleash my 10 level three dragons with one extra in the castle (usually level 2). Down an AD the defending village typically has an extremely difficult time dealing with the 11 dragons in the air. As I lay deploy the dragons I typically deploy them in a bracketed fashion in a straight line so that they reach the remaining two AD's as quickly as possible. sometimes wonder though, if I should be using three rage spells instead of taking out that one AD with lightning. What would you guys do? For the question assume that the AD's are centralized and triangulated. Thanks.

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Originally Posted by wormwood1

I've gotten pretty good with the mass dragon attacks. I'm TH8 and and usually get three stars more than half the time against the other TH8's and TH9's. My typical strategy has been to use 3 lightning spells right at the beginning and then unleash my 10 level three dragons with one extra in the castle (usually level 2). Down an AD the defending village typically has an extremely difficult time dealing with the 11 dragons in the air. As I lay deploy the dragons I typically deploy them in a bracketed fashion in a straight line so that they reach the remaining two AD's as quickly as possible. sometimes wonder though, if I should be using three rage spells instead of taking out that one AD with lightning. What would you guys do? For the question assume that the AD's are centralized and triangulated. Thanks.

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Personally I prefer rage to lightening. As a rage can assist with taking out the AD as well as 3+ other buildings if spell dropped properly. The way you are dropping drags is right. I like to think of it this way: If you drop 4 drags and it attacks one building that can be 2 shot, then two of the drags are not attacking and wasting valuable time.

I use niether rage or lightning with dragon hits.... I prefer heal.

Rage makes the dragons move a bit faster, and burn stuff a bit faster. But heal reduces the damage that AD is doing to your dragons so they have longer to destroy it, and other targets nearby. I am finding that heal spells are more effective with dragons. While rage/heal/lightning is more effective in combination with balloon attacks.

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Originally Posted by kristinepixie

I use niether rage or lightning with dragon hits.... I prefer heal.

Rage makes the dragons move a bit faster, and burn stuff a bit faster. But heal reduces the damage that AD is doing to your dragons so they have longer to destroy it, and other targets nearby. I am finding that heal spells are more effective with dragons. While rage/heal/lightning is more effective in combination with balloon attacks.

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I hate to say it sir, but as I understand your logic, I believe you are a minority in using heals with drags.

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Originally Posted by Yelfiah

I hate to say it sir, but as I understand your logic, I believe you are a minority in using heals with drags.

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I might be in the minority, but it works pretty well, and with heal I can use fewer dragons. :)

Thanks for the input guys.

had considered heal in the past. This war I'm gonna try 3 rages. Maybe with one attack I'll try 2 rages and 1 heal, just to see.

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Originally Posted by kristinepixie

I might be in the minority, but it works pretty well, and with heal I can use fewer dragons. :)

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What would you use in the place of drags? Why would you want to? Unless you are doing drags/hogs.

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Originally Posted by Yelfiah

What would you use in the place of drags? Why would you want to? Unless you are doing drags/hogs.

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Yeah I wouldn't want to replace drags with anything except sometimes with 4 hogs to get to an exposed AD

Mass drag is my strat too as a low TH8. I use:

- 3 lightning on most central, highest lvl AD
- CC Hogs/Giants/Wizards and 20 army camp space to take out a 2nd outer AD
- 9 lvl 2 dragons in a line with intent to destroy the 3rd AD

I take out most TH8 and low TH9 with 3 stars unless they have 3 high level central AD. So the consensus is that 11 dragons with rage is better than this? I'm open minded and loaded with elixir.

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Originally Posted by budawpi

Mass drag is my strat too as a low TH8. I use:

- 3 lightning on most central, highest lvl AD
- CC Hogs/Giants/Wizards and 20 army camp space to take out a 2nd outer AD
- 9 lvl 2 dragons in a line with intent to destroy the 3rd AD

I take out most TH8 and low TH9 with 3 stars unless they have 3 high level central AD. So the consensus is that 11 dragons with rage is better than this? I'm open minded and loaded with elixir.

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Regardless of other things mentioned in this post, yes, the consensus is that rage is the best spell for mass drag.

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Originally Posted by budawpi

Mass drag is my strat too as a low TH8. I use:

- 3 lightning on most central, highest lvl AD
- CC Hogs/Giants/Wizards and 20 army camp space to take out a 2nd outer AD
- 9 lvl 2 dragons in a line with intent to destroy the 3rd AD

I take out most TH8 and low TH9 with 3 stars unless they have 3 high level central AD. So the consensus is that 11 dragons with rage is better than this? I'm open minded and loaded with elixir.

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Your strategy is exactly like mine, so are your results.

Im gonna do an attack here soon against a pretty well maxed out TH8 with centralized AD and Im gonna bring 3 rage spells. We'll see what happens.

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Originally Posted by wormwood1

Your strategy is exactly like mine, so are your results.

Im gonna do an attack here soon against a pretty well maxed out TH8 with centralized AD and Im gonna bring 3 rage spells. We'll see what happens.

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Please update us on how it goes.

Sounds great, let us know! I want to improve my dragon strat versus centralized AD which is what I have trouble with. I will eventually introduce GoWi__ into my army possibilities, but we all know how long unit upgrades take.

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Originally Posted by kristinepixie

I might be in the minority, but it works pretty well, and with heal I can use fewer dragons. :)

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Originally Posted by Yelfiah

What would you use in the place of drags? Why would you want to? Unless you are doing drags/hogs.

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Heal spell costs less than a dragon.
Each heal spell used basically replaces 1 dragon for me. So while the savings are not HIGH, it is there. ((I admit though, that i have not used rage enough yet to decide when the best moment to drop it comes, or how to use it best))

Dragons are totally A.D.D. They tend to spread out and go all sorts of wonky directions once dropped. To keep the flight of dragons focused to the center and to max the damage %, you want to take out some of those boarder buildings. Cheap easy way to do that? Archers, or barbarians.

Theres also a pride point. Folks whine and complain that a mass dragon attack takes no strategy. I play with different troop combo's until I find the one that works best, and with dragons... Mass numbers is overkill. I personally prefer to do 6-7 dragons, and then the rest archers, and a CC full of archers. I que up 3 heal spells but rarely need more than one to remove the AD's, and the outer ring of exposed buildings. the dragons handle the "meat" of the base and the archers keep them focused to the center. That is a strategy, not a dragon spam.

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Originally Posted by kristinepixie

Heal spell costs less than a dragon.
Each heal spell used basically replaces 1 dragon for me. So while the savings are not HIGH, it is there. ((I admit though, that i have not used rage enough yet to decide when the best moment to drop it comes, or how to use it best))

Dragons are totally A.D.D. They tend to spread out and go all sorts of wonky directions once dropped. To keep the flight of dragons focused to the center and to max the damage %, you want to take out some of those boarder buildings. Cheap easy way to do that? Archers, or barbarians.

Theres also a pride point. Folks whine and complain that a mass dragon attack takes no strategy. I play with different troop combo's until I find the one that works best, and with dragons... Mass numbers is overkill. I personally prefer to do 6-7 dragons, and then the rest archers, and a CC full of archers. I que up 3 heal spells but rarely need more than one to remove the AD's, and the outer ring of exposed buildings. the dragons handle the "meat" of the base and the archers keep them focused to the center. That is a strategy, not a dragon spam.

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Can I ask what TH you are?

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Originally Posted by Yelfiah

Can I ask what TH you are?

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oh heck, Im just a TH7, TH8 in another day. lol But I spend a lot of time experimenting with troops tactics. TH lvl doesnt not preclude experience and understanding of AI.

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Originally Posted by kristinepixie

oh heck, Im just a TH7, TH8 in another day. lol But I spend a lot of time experimenting with troops tactics. TH lvl doesnt not preclude experience and understanding of AI.

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No it doesnt, but your lack of experience does. We are discussing using drags in a war raid, which in this case means that cost is meaningless. When using drags, it is best to use either mass drags or drag/hog. There really isnt another great way to use them. As previously mentioned, you should be dropping your hogs in a line across one side of the base preferably. Doing this means that at least some of the drags will occupy the center of the base, they will attack the closest building, knowing that makes drags fairly easy to control.

I attacked their top base, a TH8 with 3 centralized level 3 AD's with 11 drags and 3 rage. I used the rage spells to "guide" the dragons to the center to destroy the AD's and town hall. The rest played cleanup. Guys I had SEVEN dragons still alive after the 3-star. Im not kidding.

I think the trick is to drop the rage spells RIGHT when you first come into range of the air defenses. Any sooner is a waste.

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Originally Posted by Yelfiah

No it doesnt, but your lack of experience does. We are discussing using drags in a war raid, which in this case means that cost is meaningless. When using drags, it is best to use either mass drags or drag/hog. There really isnt another great way to use them. As previously mentioned, you should be dropping your hogs in a line across one side of the base preferably. Doing this means that at least some of the drags will occupy the center of the base, they will attack the closest building, knowing that makes drags fairly easy to control.

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I would generally agree, in a war raid cost should not matter. But one of the other CHIEF complaints about mass drags in war is that you lose resources even though you win.

My method addresses these two complaints about mass dragons:

• mass dragons in war raid cost more than you gain. (not if you use other troops with it and utilize the right spells) I break even or gain a bit of elixir with my method.
• mass dragons in war are not a "strategy" they are a spam. (a large group of dragons placed carefully, WITH other troops is not a spam. )

Does that mean than in a war raid I wont go all dragons for fun and burn a TH9 to the ground? Aw heck, I love doing that. And I can do it with ten lvl 1 dragons, no other troops and 2-3 heal spells. BUT I prefer to put some thought into how I attack. I still prefer heal spell to rage spell. (but then, maybe because I am a woman I prefer to see my dragons survive instead of go berserk and die before the mission is completed?)

I speak from my experience within my TH abilities. MANY of the people who use mass dragon tactics are TH7, or early TH8... JUST like me. They cant afford to use Hogs in every raid. They might not even have hogs yet. Heck a mid lvl TH7 might not even have rage yet. Heal spell is effective.

The OP is a TH8. He/she may not have upgraded the rage spells totally yet, may not have the ability to take more than 200 troops, and may not have upgraded hogs enough to make a difference against big bombs yet. My experience and input is relevant in this discussion.

Dragons are not easy to control. They attack the nearest target, which means that the group WILL split up, spread out and be easier for AD/WT/AT and air bombs to pick off. Yes, hogs to one side will help, but DE is precious at TH7/8. Hogs are not always the best option... Even in a war.

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Originally Posted by kristinepixie

I would generally agree, in a war raid cost should not matter. But one of the other CHIEF complaints about mass drags in war is that you lose resources even though you win.

My method addresses these two complaints about mass dragons:

• mass dragons in war raid cost more than you gain. (not if you use other troops with it and utilize the right spells) I break even or gain a bit of elixir with my method.
• mass dragons in war are not a "strategy" they are a spam. (a large group of dragons placed carefully, WITH other troops is not a spam. )

Does that mean than in a war raid I wont go all dragons for fun and burn a TH9 to the ground? Aw heck, I love doing that. And I can do it with ten lvl 1 dragons, no other troops and 2-3 heal spells. BUT I prefer to put some thought into how I attack. I still prefer heal spell to rage spell. (but then, maybe because I am a woman I prefer to see my dragons survive instead of go berserk and die before the mission is completed?)

I speak from my experience within my TH abilities. MANY of the people who use mass dragon tactics are TH7, or early TH8... JUST like me. They cant afford to use Hogs in every raid. They might not even have hogs yet. Heck a mid lvl TH7 might not even have rage yet. Heal spell is effective.

The OP is a TH8. He/she may not have upgraded the rage spells totally yet, may not have the ability to take more than 200 troops, and may not have upgraded hogs enough to make a difference against big bombs yet. My experience and input is relevant in this discussion.

Dragons are not easy to control. They attack the nearest target, which means that the group WILL split up, spread out and be easier for AD/WT/AT and air bombs to pick off. Yes, hogs to one side will help, but DE is precious at TH7/8. Hogs are not always the best option... Even in a war.

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It's obvious that you will think you are right no matter what I say, so good luck to you.

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Originally Posted by Yelfiah

Regardless of other things mentioned in this post, yes, the consensus is that rage is the best spell for mass drag.

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You know this thread?
http://forum.supercell.net/showthrea...%28A-B-Test%29

Kind regards
Patrick

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Originally Posted by kristinepixie

I would generally agree, in a war raid cost should not matter. But one of the other CHIEF complaints about mass drags in war is that you lose resources even though you win.

My method addresses these two complaints about mass dragons:

• mass dragons in war raid cost more than you gain. (not if you use other troops with it and utilize the right spells) I break even or gain a bit of elixir with my method.
• mass dragons in war are not a "strategy" they are a spam. (a large group of dragons placed carefully, WITH other troops is not a spam. )

Does that mean than in a war raid I wont go all dragons for fun and burn a TH9 to the ground? Aw heck, I love doing that. And I can do it with ten lvl 1 dragons, no other troops and 2-3 heal spells. BUT I prefer to put some thought into how I attack. I still prefer heal spell to rage spell. (but then, maybe because I am a woman I prefer to see my dragons survive instead of go berserk and die before the mission is completed?)

I speak from my experience within my TH abilities. MANY of the people who use mass dragon tactics are TH7, or early TH8... JUST like me. They cant afford to use Hogs in every raid. They might not even have hogs yet. Heck a mid lvl TH7 might not even have rage yet. Heal spell is effective.

The OP is a TH8. He/she may not have upgraded the rage spells totally yet, may not have the ability to take more than 200 troops, and may not have upgraded hogs enough to make a difference against big bombs yet. My experience and input is relevant in this discussion.

Dragons are not easy to control. They attack the nearest target, which means that the group WILL split up, spread out and be easier for AD/WT/AT and air bombs to pick off. Yes, hogs to one side will help, but DE is precious at TH7/8. Hogs are not always the best option... Even in a war.

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There are points I agree with here, but when I deploy my dragons they generally cross the entire village shoulder to shoulder in a single line and destroy everything in front of them while leaving nothing standing behind them. You have to place them right.

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Originally Posted by pmhausen

You know this thread?
http://forum.supercell.net/showthrea...%28A-B-Test%29

Kind regards
Patrick

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This is one person conducting one test. Too many variables for me to see this as conclusive.

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Originally Posted by Yelfiah

As previously mentioned, you should be dropping your hogs in a line across one side of the base preferably.

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I hope you mean Drags, not hogs... Dropping hogs in a line would be.. Ill-advised...

I too use heals rather than rage in my dragon attacks. I've experimented with both and found heals to be more effective in general although it depends on the base and the stuff the dragons need to get through before they reach the AD so sometimes pack a rage or two but never 3.

I've been giving this advice for a while now but nobody ever listens because 'the consensus is rage derp derp'...

This last attack I laid the dragons shoulder to shoulder in a line, a little closer together toward the middle where the AD's would eventually be. They started moving forwards together. After they got into range of the AD's, I dropped to rage spells side by side so that the dragons would fly directly into the ad's and destroy them, when that was complete I laid the third rage spell towards the third AD and it was destroyed. Cleanup was easy and the battle was over in 1 minute and 18 seconds and I lost FOUR DRAGONS guys. Four. 7 standing after the battle. There is no more effective dragon strategy than this. Not by a longshot. No way.

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Originally Posted by Jietoh

I hope you mean Drags, not hogs... Dropping hogs in a line would be.. Ill-advised...

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Yes I meant drags, thank you.

I'm with Yelfiah: Cost doesn't matter in CW and while dragons may be unstoppable to a TH7, they still require some amount of strategy to use.

I wouldn't say that Elixir and DE are precious to all TH7-8. I'm a BAM farmer between Clan Wars and always have max elixir and an abundance of accidental DE.

I tend to side with Kristinpixie,

What I like about Heal on Drags; is since the Dragons are pretty slow moving, High-HP troops, then Heal is pretty good for them to soak up while they obliterate towers.. the longer they live the better kinda mind set.

with Rage, while Awesome, they often out run the Rage's range on the way to the next target tower..so if you don't have a clean up crew following them then Rage can be a bit wasted in that regard.. (same with loons a bit aswell IMO) and its more expensive to cook, and takes 15min longer to cook as well.

I tend to take 2 rage if time is of no consequence (or if I boosted SF) but when I am pressed for time, the Heal's cheaper cost and faster cook time usually win out; esp for farming.. and I get nearly the same results. (based on the lvl 3 SF; that TH 7 & 8 share)

I also take 7-8 Drags and use other troops to help guide the Drags to the target spot and help take out A/Defs when possible.

its a matter of preference and raid style IMO

I have a mix of th7-10 in my clan and I see 3 lightning, 3 rage, 3 heal, sometimes a mix of rage/heal used for drags. It is my observation that you won't be able to three star every base you hit using the same spells each time unless you are hitting bases with similar layouts.

There are some bases members used heal and didn't get the three star where if they would have thrown in a rage spell on high hp buildings could have turned the tide in their favor.

Each base you attack is situational and spells should be selected to aid you for that particular layout and how you intend to attack that layout. Sometimes lightning is best oddly enough, others times it may be heal or rage or a combo of each.

*side note - I converted most of my clan members to using lvl 6 bloons in cc over an extra drag and tanking with drag to take out air defenses.

I prefer using 8 drags and 8 balloons with 3 healing spells. I use the balloons to knock out as many AT's, WT's, & AD's first and drop the drags behind the balloons. I use at least two healing spells on the balloons to keep them alive as long as possible, while the drags are taking out the first few items. I'll drop the last healing spell on the drags as they're taking out the TH. That last healing spell allows 2-3 drags to regain strength as the other drags are taking out other defenses and such.

Townhall 7, 3 lightning seems the best for me.
Usually im 3 stars the townhall 8 in clan war.
10 dragons, 4hogs and 3lightning.


Now I'm using mass dragon to beef up my Barbarian Kings attacking townhall 8, 9 and 10.

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http://i.imgur.com/piNsfdl.png

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I do not use mass dragons often, but when I do, I carry all rage spells and try to get at least two stars.

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Originally Posted by Yelfiah

No it doesnt, but your lack of experience does. We are discussing using drags in a war raid, which in this case means that cost is meaningless. When using drags, it is best to use either mass drags or drag/hog. There really isnt another great way to use them. As previously mentioned, you should be dropping your hogs in a line across one side of the base preferably. Doing this means that at least some of the drags will occupy the center of the base, they will attack the closest building, knowing that makes drags fairly easy to control.

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When using drags, it is best to use either mass drags or drag/hog. There really isnt another great way to use them.

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Mass drags or drags/hogs are not the only effective way to use dragons. I am a loonion/dragloonion raider, and in my experience, the dragloonion strategy is remarkably effective. Correct me if I am mistaken, several other players take on very difficult bases with this strategy. This includes town hall 7/8 players in champion league pushing higher up, taking 1 or two stars against strong TH9's and 10's.

I would say it changes over time.

If attacking a th7 then lightning is most effective.
if attacking a th8 with level 1 or 2 dragons then heal works well.
if attacking a th9 with level 3 dragons then rage on.

Personally I only use mass dragons now when sf is upgrading so no spells but with proper strategy I still got 5 stars against th9 bases. There is some strategy involved in using them well.

I think rage is better, because the damage they get is double so they can destroy the AD easily

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Originally Posted by Syr1nax

I would say it changes over time.

If attacking a th7 then lightning is most effective.
if attacking a th8 with level 1 or 2 dragons then heal works well.
if attacking a th9 with level 3 dragons then rage on.

Personally I only use mass dragons now when sf is upgrading so no spells but with proper strategy I still got 5 stars against th9 bases. There is some strategy involved in using them well.

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This exactly, although I don't necessarily agree with lightning at TH7.

Heals become more or less ineffective when mass dragging a high-level TH9/10 base, especially with infernos. Heal can't make up 2-3 L6+ AD, L7+ Teslas, L3 ITs, L3+ Xbows, etc hitting you. When doing those bases it is very much a quick tactical strike to core the base and get TH, then let the ones that didn't make it to the core ring the base to pick up the 50%/2nd star.

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Originally Posted by Goose306

This exactly, although I don't necessarily agree with lightning at TH7.

Heals become more or less ineffective when mass dragging a high-level TH9/10 base, especially with infernos. Heal can't make up 2-3 L6+ AD, L7+ Teslas, L3 ITs, L3+ Xbows, etc hitting you. When doing those bases it is very much a quick tactical strike to core the base and get TH, then let the ones that didn't make it to the core ring the base to pick up the 50%/2nd star.

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Yeah I agree. However at TH8, I think heal would be more effective than rage because there are no x-bows shooting at you. We could actually do a calculation to work out whether heal or rage is more effective though, see if the DPS by having the dragon live longer is greater than the DPS of the rage spell plus the DPS for the rest of the time.

I'm using 3 heals with my drags and hit 100% almost all of the time (only not against TH 9 with 4xlvl5 ad or higher.

I like to use two rage and one heal. This works well for bases that have very centralized air defenses, because once my drags get into the center and all the ADs are shooting at them, I can use the heal and the dragons stay alive for much longer.