Why does our clan ALWAYS get unfair matchups in war?

So our clan has completed close to 20 wars now and it seems that every time we get paired up with a clan that completely overpowers us. I have read a ton of stuff online and every explanation seems to explain why we sometimes get bad matchups, but in theory, those reasons would also mean we would get favorable matchups more often. I know what most people say matchups are based off of (hero levels, army camp capacity, defensive towers, upgraded troops, walls, spell levels, etc...) and that it doesn't include trophies. 5 out of the last 6 wars, the opposing clan has been better than ours in literally every category mentioned (including experience level) and we have stood no chance at all. I'm not here to complain or whine, just wondering what we can do to ensure we get more even matchups. Any ideas why we always seem to get overpowered? We have a decent array of levels in our clan, but even so, their top guys greatly overpower our top guys, and their lower guys seem to overpower our lower guys. We have about 30 members as well. Thanks.

One of the reasons is your start war time.....do it totally different time for your next war.

If you usually start war at 8pm your time....start it at 2am or 10am.....

Try it out....

There can be a variety of reasons. Are the offense of all your members maxed for their respective TH?

I don't know what to tell you. For some reason we seem to get matched with inferior opponents on the regular, except the last one. I knew before it even started we were in trouble. They toyed with us a bit before stepping on our collective throats. 144-102...something does seem off about the way matchups are created. I'd rather we get a. It more of a regular challenge, and now tasting defeat at the hands of an obviously over powering clan I know the flip side to that equation as well.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kruzkal

There can be a variety of reasons. Are the offense of all your members maxed for their respective TH?

---

No they are not, but the troops we use for war are. Most of our top guys have level 6 giants, level 5 hogs, and level 6 archers

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by azbro

One of the reasons is your start war time.....do it totally different time for your next war.

If you usually start war at 8pm your time....start it at 2am or 10am.....

Try it out....

---

I was wondering about this with our clan. Our leader is in Australia and when he was starting the wars around 3-5pm his time, we were getting easier match-ups. Now that I'm starting the wars between 7-10am EDT, the matchups have gotten tougher.

I think the more premie your clans bases are, the greater chance you will be matched up with clans that will spank you.

Especially true for your top 10-15 bases, as these bases have a greater weighting in terms of the determining the enemy you 'll end up being paired up with.

In other words, if you have a bunch of TH10s that converted over before maxing all defenses at TH9, you'll have a greater chance of getting an unfavorable matchup in clan wars.

Wish I could quantify this more, but this is the feedback I've been noticing first-hand in the 40+ wars my clan has participated in.

Hush little baby don't you cry, everything is gonna be alright.

What clan are you in? We could easily answer this by looking at all your rushed bases ;)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by hawdog

I think the more premie your clans bases are, the greater chance you will be matched up with clans that will spank you.

Especially true for your top 10-15 bases, as these bases have a greater weighting in terms of the determining the enemy you 'll end up being paired up with.

In other words, if you have a bunch of TH10s that converted over before maxing all defenses at TH9, you'll have a greater chance of getting an unfavorable matchup in clan wars.

Wish I could quantify this more, but this is the feedback I've been noticing first-hand in the 40+ wars my clan has participated in.

---

I think the same thing.

The matchmaking algorithm obviously needs work. My clan has had the opposite issue. Most of our opponents have been "falling off a log" easy to beat and we are far from an elite war clan. We have 10 year olds who hold one finger down for 20 seconds until all their barbs are gone and such. My guess is that the composition of our clan somehow throws off the matchmaking system to get us easier matches and yours is doing the opposite.

Another data point to further the discussion.

Context:
* Matches are typically 50v50 or 45v45 depending on who happens to be on vacation that cycle
* 3 TH10, ~20 TH9s, balance all well upgraded TH8s

We don't accept rushed bases, and all players have to be proficient in at least 1 and preferably 3 trophy army compositions.

* Roughly 22'ish wars of which we have won 16. 2 losses were close matches to ghosting clans, 2 we were outright blown out, 2 were even matches where we lost by the slimmest of margins. Out of the 16 wins, I would say better than half were even matches, with the balance being wins against poor clan compositions (ie only 15 raid ready players out of 50). By contrast we have 50 players that are proficient and capable in starring throughout the range up or down the chain.

* We have slightly tweaked our search times to give us more sensible matchups and although it's hardly statistically significant, it has at least temporarily improved our matches.

The principle we instill is, "attack your match", in that the expectation is that you 2 star your numeric opponent. Every member has training, and we regularly practice trophy attacks by declaring one night "revenge night".

So for better or worse, we've beaten equivalently matched clans, we've been clans that we were outmatched against, we've also been beaten by clans that were just better at executing across the board even though they were lower (that only happened once :P)

So my point is, it's not so much about the matches as much as it is about having a consistent set of capabilities throughout your range of bases and not all about 12 players at the top who are counted upon to win the war for you. We've had several matches where our 25-50 crew successfully 3* their range, where our 1-25 crew could not and having the 25-50 crew perform that consistently was the key to winning.

Again hardly a data point, but yeah - maybe try a different search time to see what you get, and stay out of asia prime time :)

I do strategy recaps to help our members tweak their attacks, you can watch the videos here if you think they're helpful.

http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCeF-TpaBPULsubbOdU5ce3g

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Xccam

... [removed stuff] They toyed with us a bit before stepping on our collective throats. 144-102......[removed stuff]

---

holy ♥♥♥♥... 144! We usually are 45v45 and I've never seen a score higher than 120 (our highest score is 118 iirc). Our composition is about 10-12 th10's, 15 or so th9's, 10 or so th8's and the rest th7's. Doing the math, we'll never see over 135, but you're talking about a 50v50 war and only missing out on 6 stars... is that normal for some folks? or is that just a totally mismatched war...

Hammer

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by hammer

holy ♥♥♥♥... 144! We usually are 45v45 and I've never seen a score higher than 120 (our highest score is 118 iirc). Our composition is about 10-12 th10's, 15 or so th9's, 10 or so th8's and the rest th7's. Doing the math, we'll never see over 135, but you're talking about a 50v50 war and only missing out on 6 stars... is that normal for some folks? or is that just a totally mismatched war...

Hammer

---

Not sure about their TH level, but there are clans that have gotten 135/135.

Read This:

http://forum.supercell.net/showthrea...-Out-Your-Base

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by hawdog

I think the more premie your clans bases are, the greater chance you will be matched up with clans that will spank you.

Especially true for your top 10-15 bases, as these bases have a greater weighting in terms of the determining the enemy you 'll end up being paired up with.

In other words, if you have a bunch of TH10s that converted over before maxing all defenses at TH9, you'll have a greater chance of getting an unfavorable matchup in clan wars.

Wish I could quantify this more, but this is the feedback I've been noticing first-hand in the 40+ wars my clan has participated in.

---

Actually a strat that i see in wars is th 10s with ♥♥♥♥ defense but maxed troops so they will get matched up with lower lvl ppl

my clan is currently going through the same downward spiral in wars, since a couple of our guys maxed out th9 and trying to get heroes to level 25 each we are getting matched against clans with 5-6 th10 while we only got 3 th10, technical 2 th10 and 1 a very premie th10 getting hit hard by loot penalty.in clan of 20 vs 20 it's extremely difficult for us since we can't afford to lose more than 2 attacks. we are also reluctant to add more th9 as that led to even thougher opponents.we tried changing war search times but nothing seems to work . Some members are now thinking of leaving due to those 1 star difference defeats

In the original post, there was talk about trophy counts not affecting the matchups. But other areas, I've heard the exact opposite. We're essentially going to test this theory very soon...

Here's the factors:
1) Majority of our core clan remains the same. Couple add-ins, but nothing crazy (no new maxed th10's or extremely low bases).
2) Had about 30-35 wars, won 24. Tough matchups at times, and only got smoked once, so the matchups have been relatively consistent.
3) Before trophy push, 2-3 players in masters, but most in crystal2-3 and gold1-3.
4) After trophy push, 20 players in masters, a few in champion.

So at the end of the trophy push we'll be WAY higher than we were. I'll report back on our findings - will let you guys know if our opponent is similar in the past, or WAY tougher (clan war set to start Sunday August 10th).

Hammer

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by hammer

holy ♥♥♥♥... 144! We usually are 45v45 and I've never seen a score higher than 120 (our highest score is 118 iirc). Our composition is about 10-12 th10's, 15 or so th9's, 10 or so th8's and the rest th7's. Doing the math, we'll never see over 135, but you're talking about a 50v50 war and only missing out on 6 stars... is that normal for some folks? or is that just a totally mismatched war...

Hammer

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by corporatetool

Not sure about their TH level, but there are clans that have gotten 135/135.

---

From my limited war experience, if you're looking to get really high star totals you should either be one of the top clans or have all your members be th 8 or below. From what I've seen, it's relatively common for th 7-8s (ones that are good attackers, of course) to 3-star other people their th level. It gets much tougher at th 9, especially with all the nerfs to hogs, and once you get to th 10 (again, unless you're one of the top clans) you can forget about 3-starring people with decent bases.

As for the OP, I'm not sure there's any consistent sweet spot for start time, but changing it can't hurt. Also, even when my clan has been absolutely crushed (it's happened a few times, unfortunately), it's usually been because the opposing clan warred more often and was made up of people up and down the board who were attacking as well as the top 5-10 attackers in my clan.

I don't think most people take into consideration all of the variables. A lot of things go into the matchmaking algorithm - defensive building levels, troop levels, hero levels, wall levels. The walls are typically blamed for a lot of the mismatches for clans where that is a big problem. I don't think th level goes into it at all as that is usually the reason for the mismatch. We are a TH8-10 clan and are currently mismatched by another clan that almost doubles our number of double IT TH10s (8 vs 14). Now that hogs are nerfed, the higher level wars are almost always predictable based on the number of TH10s in each clan - more powerful spells, more troop capacity, and quantity of spells all go up at TH10 while the double ITs make it almost impossible to 2-star a TH10 with a TH9 - but I digress.

Walls get blamed for mismatches because they aren't factored in when you compare one base to another. Usually, it is 2 WBs on the outer walls and wizards on the inners, so people don't care who has pink walls vs. who has lavas. If walls play as big a role as I think they do in the matchmaking, then a TH9 with maxed defenses and lego walls would get matched with a fresh TH10 with purple walls and double ITs.

If you are constantly getting overmatched, take a look at your walls with a little more of an analytical slant and I think you will find that they are upgraded more than your opponent.

Just my 2c.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by hammer

In the original post, there was talk about trophy counts not affecting the matchups. But other areas, I've heard the exact opposite. We're essentially going to test this theory very soon...

Here's the factors:
1) Majority of our core clan remains the same. Couple add-ins, but nothing crazy (no new maxed th10's or extremely low bases).
2) Had about 30-35 wars, won 24. Tough matchups at times, and only got smoked once, so the matchups have been relatively consistent.
3) Before trophy push, 2-3 players in masters, but most in crystal2-3 and gold1-3.
4) After trophy push, 20 players in masters, a few in champion.

So at the end of the trophy push we'll be WAY higher than we were. I'll report back on our findings - will let you guys know if our opponent is similar in the past, or WAY tougher (clan war set to start Sunday August 10th).

Hammer

---

So we did the trophy push, made it to about 750 in rankings - pretty good for us. Had 1 make champion, 25 make masters, and the rest pushed well into crystal - some of the th7's made it to Crystal 1. All in all, a good run.

We started our clan war before anyone had dropped in trophy's and were matched up with a clan having FAR LESS trophy's (our "trophy count" was about 25,000 whereas the opponent was just under 20,000). The matchup seemed to be a good one - we had more th10's (17 vs 15), and they had no th7's (we have 4). 8's and 9's spread relatively even.

The end result of the clan war was not good... They are clearly a better war clan than we are - several of their th10's had maxed golems and pekkas along with a few having top valks (only 1 guy in our clan has achieved this). All their royalty was in the 20's and 30's (in their top 10), where we don't have anyone with royalty higher than 20. Not complaining tho... they are just better!

In any case, the experiment was a success! I feel confident in saying that trophy count has nothing to do with clan war matchups.

Hammer

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kementarri

What clan are you in? We could easily answer this by looking at all your rushed bases ;)

---

Yes indeed, almost 25% of my members are rushed including myself and we get tougher oppositions 30-40% of the time as well but that doesn't stop us from winning though. I just told my members to ensure that they should have a maxed at least 1 war troop matched at their TH level or risk a boot out from the war.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JohnDabCity

No they are not, but the troops we use for war are. Most of our top guys have level 6 giants, level 5 hogs, and level 6 archers

---

The only thing good for war there is hogs (and they are situational now at best, and require the right base and skill to use).

Lvl 6 giants are pretty useless in war and there isn't much of a difference between lvl 6 and lvl 5 archers. Those typically are seen more in farming, not war.

Golems, Witches, Pekkas, Drags, Loons are your key war troops. My guess if you are losing consistently is you are vastly outclassed on those. Wipe/Wiwi wrecks pretty much any TH9 (guaranteed 2 regardless of design, potential 3) and it's even more used by TH10's.

And changing up war start time was a good recommendation. I'd try that out.

I can give you advices on how to correct your matches...

Somehow we were like this before until we corrected the flaws...we didn't notice it was in the group and not the match system at all...buzz me up...we can assist you.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JohnDabCity

So our clan has completed close to 20 wars now and it seems that every time we get paired up with a clan that completely overpowers us. I have read a ton of stuff online and every explanation seems to explain why we sometimes get bad matchups, but in theory, those reasons would also mean we would get favorable matchups more often. I know what most people say matchups are based off of (hero levels, army camp capacity, defensive towers, upgraded troops, walls, spell levels, etc...) and that it doesn't include trophies. 5 out of the last 6 wars, the opposing clan has been better than ours in literally every category mentioned (including experience level) and we have stood no chance at all. I'm not here to complain or whine, just wondering what we can do to ensure we get more even matchups. Any ideas why we always seem to get overpowered? We have a decent array of levels in our clan, but even so, their top guys greatly overpower our top guys, and their lower guys seem to overpower our lower guys. We have about 30 members as well. Thanks.

---