[Tips & Tricks] Defensive Mechanics against New Wall-Breaker AI

Foreword: Many AI enthusiasts, such as Hannibal, Junliang, Daddy, Flammy, and myself, have been actively testing various wall configurations to efficiently defend against the new revamped Wall-Breaker AI, since the release of Patch 3.54. I will continuously update this guide as more mechanics are discovered. Special thanks to everyone who contributed in these researches.

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The new AI ignores most decoys as soon they are "open." Therefore, the idea of these mechanics is not to completely nullify Wall-Breakers' usage via decoys, but to maximize the numbers of Wall-Breakers required to breach the design. They are, more or less, more efficient ways to utilize walls for "boxes inside of boxes inside of boxes."

X-Junctions: Avoid joining T-junctions to minimize the new blast radius' effectiveness; requires higher numbers of Wall-Breakers to "open up" individual compartments.

http://i40.tinypic.com/34o3klt.jpg
(5)

http://i45.tinypic.com/20zv285.jpg
Avoid X-Junctions by creating staggered T-Junctions

The next mechanic has 2 unique effects, depending on the Wall-Breakers' relative deployment locations. The idea is to create unnatural, lengthened paths, which separate the Wall-Breakers from the army, making them more vulnerable.

Partially enclosed compartment: L-shaped wall strip that will attract Wall-Breakers when they are deployed away from the open gap. This also works as a funnel. (1)

Maze strip: When Wall-Breakers are deployed close to the gap of the mentioned partially enclosed compartment, the horizontal strip acts as a maze to lengthen the Wall-Breakers' path, increases the chance of Wall-Breakers being sniped down before reaching the target walls.

http://i49.tinypic.com/34xpeg9.jpg
Partially enclosed compartment/Maze strip creating unnatural and lengthened Wall-Breaker paths

Replay compilation demonstrating these mechanics:

http://youtu.be/V2M0dYCCQyk

Wall Cushion - Double perimeter layer, which forces Wall-Breakers away from certain important compartments. (1)

http://i47.tinypic.com/35830a1.jpg
Double-layered walls force Wall-Breakers to go to thinner layers of other compartments

http://i46.tinypic.com/ac7w91.jpg
Another variation of Wall Cushion

Demonstrative replays showcasing clever applications of Wall Cushion:

• http://youtu.be/FkZxey6RZVw (3)
• http://youtu.be/6gj5yI-lzTU - Redirects Wall Breaker path over traps (4)

http://i1342.photobucket.com/albums/...ps431a0b86.jpg

Decoy Island - Satellite enclosed compartment that attracts Wall-Breakers away from the main base; similar effect of "spikes." (2)

http://i49.tinypic.com/v62kn9.jpg

Enclosed, individual building lures Wall-Breakers away from the main base

Detailed discussion with demonstration of Decoy Island: http://youtu.be/6zVLG97dmd0 (2)

Additional Mechanics - Coming soon.

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Sources

(1) Flammmy - http://youtu.be/jEjOSEN9Llo
(2) Daddy - http://youtu.be/6zVLG97dmd0
(3) Soki - http://youtu.be/FkZxey6RZVw
(4) TimTheEnchanter - http://youtu.be/6gj5yI-lzTU
(5) Junliang

Ping, that's a nice video. I agree completely with the T junction part. I think that's a particularly big deal right now when invading forces are going to be breaching outer layers quickly, and you want to slow their movement (via wbs or direct attack) through the base. And as your examples nicely illustrate, given the increased wb radius, they need to be spaced by two tiles rather than the weak T of a one tile offset.

However, it's worth noticing that the wallbreakers display very different behavior towards your strip in each clip. In the first attack it essentially replicates the hole widening bug. It's hard for me to tell what they're targeting in the second attack as they die so quickly to your large (♥♥♥) bombs. It may be the hole widening bug again. But in the third their activity seems consistent with the path length theory. Same with the fourth where from a different spawn point yet they ignore the strip completely.

Your video perfectly illustrates my problem with wb exploits right now -- they're based on buggy behavior. And the bugginess is dependent on where the wb is spawned from. Two attacks from the same side of the base may not produce the same bugginess depending on the square the wb is launched from.

This presents two problems. First, defensively if you can't rely on the wb to act reproducibly to your tile pattern, it's hard to evaluate the value you're getting for each wall tile in the pattern. Secondly, I'm very much expecting the bugs to be fixed. At least, SC will both surprise and disappoint me if they don't.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hannibal

Ping, that's a nice video. I agree completely with the T junction part. I think that's a particularly big deal right now when invading forces are going to be breaching outer layers quickly, and you want to slow their movement (via wbs or direct attack) through the base. And as your examples nicely illustrate, given the increased wb radius, they need to be spaced by two tiles rather than the weak T of a one tile offset.

However, it's worth noticing that the wallbreakers display very different behavior towards your strip in each clip. In the first attack it essentially replicates the hole widening bug. It's hard for me to tell what they're targeting in the second attack as they die so quickly to your large (♥♥♥) bombs. It may be the hole widening bug again. But in the third their activity seems consistent with the path length theory. Same with the fourth where from a different spawn point yet they ignore the strip completely.

Your video perfectly illustrates my problem with wb exploits right now -- they're based on buggy behavior. And the bugginess is dependent on where the wb is spawned from. Two attacks from the same side of the base may not produce the same bugginess depending on the square the wb is launched from.

This presents two problems. First, defensively if you can't rely on the wb to act reproducibly to your tile pattern, it's hard to evaluate the value you're getting for each wall tile in the pattern. Secondly, I'm very much expecting the bugs to be fixed. At least, SC will both surprise and disappoint me if they don't.

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I wouldn't hold your breath on bug fixing, but I agree with your assessment entirely.

Prime examples of how the AI is not "fine". Consistent behavior would be nice.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hannibal

Ping, that's a nice video. I agree completely with the T junction part. I think that's a particularly big deal right now when invading forces are going to be breaching outer layers quickly, and you want to slow their movement (via wbs or direct attack) through the base. And as your examples nicely illustrate, given the increased wb radius, they need to be spaced by two tiles rather than the weak T of a one tile offset.

However, it's worth noticing that the wallbreakers display very different behavior towards your strip in each clip. In the first attack it essentially replicates the hole widening bug. It's hard for me to tell what they're targeting in the second attack as they die so quickly to your large (♥♥♥) bombs. It may be the hole widening bug again. But in the third their activity seems consistent with the path length theory. Same with the fourth where from a different spawn point yet they ignore the strip completely.

Your video perfectly illustrates my problem with wb exploits right now -- they're based on buggy behavior. And the bugginess is dependent on where the wb is spawned from. Two attacks from the same side of the base may not produce the same bugginess depending on the square the wb is launched from.

This presents two problems. First, defensively if you can't rely on the wb to act reproducibly to your tile pattern, it's hard to evaluate the value you're getting for each wall tile in the pattern. Secondly, I'm very much expecting the bugs to be fixed. At least, SC will both surprise and disappoint me if they don't.

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Thank you and great analysis, Hannibal. :) I did notice a lot of inconsistencies as well, especially in the first clip, where the horde of WB's stayed on the strip. I tried to rationalize their behavior using the presented information on the AI with no lucks.

Here's my take on the other clips:

In the 2nd clip, after breaching the Archer Tower compartment, they targeted the strip due to the long distance (around the strip to the right) from their spawn point to the closest "enclosed" building, which was the cannon. After that compartment was breached, they targeted the layer in front of the AD. Since they were spread out, they all went to different individual walls, whichever one was closest to each of them.

The WB's in the 3rd clip were all over the place so I can't really pin-point any out too well. However, it seemed the attacker deployed his WB's in a horizontal swipe so each WB had its own relative closest building and path length, therefore splits off in all different directions.

The 4th one was definitely strange. The Archer Tower to the right was definitely closer to the spawn point than the DE Drill, but they ignored it completely. Do you think it has something to do with the Archer Tower being under attack when the WB's were deployed?

Also, I am pretty frustrated with "hole-widening" bug as well. Have had to pass up one too many easy loots just because my WB's wouldn't open up the inner chamber.

thnx pekkachu

Nice, and how do you think this design will do?

http://i50.tinypic.com/69166v.png

*come here chop front row seat first*

Good luck Pekkachu ! :o

*Back to working on my special video*

Quote:

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Originally Posted by pinser

Nice, and how do you think this design will do?

http://i50.tinypic.com/69166v.png

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Wow that is an amazing design. Where did you find it?!

Haha let me know how it works out vs. the new AI. ;)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Junliang

*come here chop front row seat first*

Good luck Pekkachu ! :o

*Back to working on my special video*

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Better have "SPECIAL THANKS TO PEKKACHU FOR BEING MY ***TH SUB" at the end. :o

They seriously need to change the "Wallbreakers will attack the nearest wall" on the loading screen message because right now, it's not entirely true..... <_<

nice thread! some great tactics listed also. the video quality makes it hard to watch for me but i get the idea.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by RegaliaRemix

They seriously need to change the "Wallbreakers will attack the nearest wall" on the loading screen message because right now, it's not entirely true..... <_<

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They also need to change "Upgrade your walls to slow down the enemies." haha

Quote:

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Originally Posted by facescraper

nice thread! some great tactics listed also. the video quality makes it hard to watch for me but i get the idea.

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Glad I could help! What was wrong with the quality? I thought it was HD. Just wondering so I can make improvements in the future. :)

how weird, the first time i played the video it came out really fuzzy but i tried again and it was ok. not sure what happened?! i blame youtube! ;-)

http://imgur.com/fj5RyhD.jpg

Just redesigned, pardon ugly walls ...

So do you think I should change it more? To create more T-junctions? Also, I protect a lot of useless stuff. Am I better off using funneling techniques?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jenniifuh

http://imgur.com/fj5RyhD.jpg

Just redesigned, pardon ugly walls ...

So do you think I should change it more? To create more T-junctions? Also, I protect a lot of useless stuff. Am I better off using funneling techniques?

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Your ugly walls have been pardoned..

JK. ;) I see that you're staggering your walls to minimize WBs' effectiveness. However, the new/larger splash radius will still be able to blast those junctions away.

The gray circle is what the red ones should look like. Also, in my opinion, a successful design should have a little bit of funneling to deal with mass Tier 1 armies.

http://i45.tinypic.com/2ip9l.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pingfao

Your ugly walls have been pardoned..

JK. ;) I see that you're staggering your walls to minimize WBs' effectiveness. However, the new/larger splash radius will still be able to blast those junctions away.

The gray circle is what the red ones should look like. Also, in my opinion, a successful design should have a little bit of funneling to deal with mass Tier 1 armies.

http://i45.tinypic.com/2ip9l.jpg

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Ah damn it, I was afraid of that. Back to slowly moving the walls around........ XD

Thanks a lot for the feedback though.

What clan are u in right now I was going to attack you with lvl 6 troops :) but I knew I was going to fail last time I saw u was in the bullies

Hi Junior. Right now I'm hiding out and am clanless. I'm working on a design but it's slow going given that I don't get attacked much. I'd certainly welcome your attack with level 6 troops. ;)

Haha I would fail ;) anyways if u need a clan you can come and join us (OrderOfThieves) were very active and friendly

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pingfao

This is a work in progress. I've been toying around with various different designs since the patch, and here are some results so far.

The new AI ignores most decoys as soon they are "open." Therefore, the idea of these mechanics is not to completely nullify Wall-Breakers' usage via decoys, but to maximize the numbers of Wall-Breakers required to breach the design. They are, more or less, more efficient ways to utilize walls for "boxes inside of boxes inside of boxes."

X-Junctions: Avoid joining T-junctions to minimize the new blast radius' effectiveness; requires higher numbers of Wall-Breakers to "opening up" individual compartments.

http://i50.tinypic.com/nh1iiq.png
Avoid X-Junctions by creating staggered T-Junctions

The next mechanic has 2 unique effects, depending on the Wall-Breakers' relative deployment locations. The idea is to create unnatural, lengthened paths, which separate the Wall-Breakers from the army, making them more vulnerable.

Partially enclosed compartment: L-shaped wall strip that will attract Wall-Breakers when they are deployed away from the open. This also works as a funnel.

Maze strip: When Wall-Breakers are deployed close to the gap of the mentioned partially enclosed compartment, the horizontal strip acts as a maze to lengthen the Wall-Breakers' path, increases the chance of Wall-Breakers being sniped down before reaching the target walls.

http://i50.tinypic.com/rihedc.png
Partially enclosed compartment/Maze strip creating unnatural and lengthened Wall-Breaker paths

Here's a replay compilation of how these mechanics work:

http://youtu.be/V2M0dYCCQyk

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I've also been tweaking these settings since this new update was released, and yes, the T junction works - have been implementing these such that it would require at least 10-15 WBs to get to the middle compartment.

From the attacker's perspective, I like the WB AI, now we know at least to some more extent about where the WB will be heading after the first set is launched, so better control than the previous AI for sure! Keep up the good work - I will be watching this thread closely for any more of your findings.

(popcorn)

Very well done, PinGfao,
even if I am, TBH, very tired of all these wallbreaker threads by now.
(=.=)'

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This little Potato is seriously carb'd out from all the corn that's been passed around these show times...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hannibal

Hi Junior. Right now I'm hiding out and am clanless. I'm working on a design but it's slow going given that I don't get attacked much. I'd certainly welcome your attack with level 6 troops. ;)

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StilL Skipping Cant find you... ( i liked one of your previous designs 3 boxes ... it was like 9 perfect Wbs :)









Very informative post pING... i agree with maggie (:

Very nice video. hope u keep working hard to let others know AI of new wb. I somehow feel that new wb are female (no offence). Not easy to know what they do next, I am no mel gibson

You may want to add one more trick: partial double walls will attract wbs to where the single walls place. This is an example

A B C

1+++++++2
+++++++++++++++++
WT
+++++++++++++++++
DE

Think wb at B will destroy stupid double walls in front of WT and open a path to DE storage? Nah, anywhere whether A, B, C you deploy wb, it will go to point 1 or point 2. You know where to deploy yr traps and segmented yr core follow the position 1&2 to distract the wb.

P.s: My lesson learnt after I failed attack a base using that arrangement. :cool:

Sorry for double post, realize that the space rendering isn't working in the forum. Hope you got the idea.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by blackdragon

You may want to add one more trick: partial double walls will attract wbs to where the single walls place. This is an example

A B C

1+++++++2
+++++++++++++++++
WT
+++++++++++++++++
DE

Think wb at B will destroy stupid double walls in front of WT and open a path to DE storage? Nah, anywhere whether A, B, C you deploy wb, it will go to point 1 or point 2. You know where to deploy yr traps and segmented yr core follow the position 1&2 to distract the wb.

P.s: My lesson learnt after I failed attack a base using that arrangement. :cool:

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would lightning spell ur DE storage so walls are ..........




And that is another pointless reply in a pointless thread

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Aussi

would lightning spell ur DE storage so walls are ..........




And that is another pointless reply in a pointless thread

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Its not a pointless thread :rolleyes:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by denial

StilL Skipping Cant find you... ( i liked one of your previous designs 3 boxes ... it was like 9 perfect Wbs :)

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I was starting to feel happy with a design I had just before the addition of the 25 walls. Now I'm trying to figure out the best way to graft those onto a basic design I think that I like.

1637 trophies this morning and no shield. Come at me bro! ;)

I knew the builders huts would come in handy sometime...enclose them with walls and you effectively have your spikes back about 3:30 in is the replay of these working

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6zVLG97dmd0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6zVLG97dmd0

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Aussi

would lightning spell ur DE storage so walls are ..........




And that is another pointless reply in a pointless thread

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Pointless for u but may help others. If y dont like this just ignore. Still lighting the DE? Loser.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Daddy

I knew the builders huts would come in handy sometime...enclose them with walls and you effectively have your spikes back about 3:30 in is the replay of these working

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Very useful info! I'm gonna try to implement some of this! Thanks!!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Daddy

I knew the builders huts would come in handy sometime...enclose them with walls and you effectively have your spikes back about 3:30 in is the replay of these working

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That's what I did with mine, except I connected them to the main main base so enclose them all. Haven't seem them work yet.

That's probably because yours are connected to your main base and farther away from the map periphery. Daddy's are free floating and closer to potential spawn points.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hannibal

That's probably because yours are connected to your main base and farther away from the map periphery. Daddy's are free floating and closer to potential spawn points.

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Well, I haven't even seen anyone deploy WBs on me yet, plus I have no significant amount of resources available. I have been raising my trophies again, maybe I'll get some rougher customers soon.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by blackdragon

You may want to add one more trick: partial double walls will attract wbs to where the single walls place. This is an example

A B C

1+++++++2
+++++++++++++++++
WT
+++++++++++++++++
DE

Think wb at B will destroy stupid double walls in front of WT and open a path to DE storage? Nah, anywhere whether A, B, C you deploy wb, it will go to point 1 or point 2. You know where to deploy yr traps and segmented yr core follow the position 1&2 to distract the wb.

P.s: My lesson learnt after I failed attack a base using that arrangement. :cool:

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Thanks for bringing that up. I have seen this mechanic quite often while farming. Will add it to the OP. :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Daddy

I knew the builders huts would come in handy sometime...enclose them with walls and you effectively have your spikes back about 3:30 in is the replay of these working

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6zVLG97dmd0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6zVLG97dmd0

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I'm glad you posted that here. I pm'ed you regarding referencing your finding and video a couple of hours ago. Will add this to the OP as well. :o

so sorry i didn't reply my bad, been mad busy and thanks for your support with this idea, i'd be very interested if others have evidence of it working or not

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pingfao

I'm glad you posted that here. I pm'ed you regarding referencing your finding and video a couple of hours ago. Will add this to the OP as well. :o

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These methods look exactly what one of my clan mate is doing. I guess he wasn't crazy lol

Nice tips Pingfao, I have learn something new today. Thanks :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Daddy

so sorry i didn't reply my bad, been mad busy and thanks for your support with this idea, i'd be very interested if others have evidence of it working or not

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I am interested to see how effective it is as well. I like the idea of luring/isolating WB's away from army, making them easier to snipe.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Soki

Nice tips Pingfao, I have learn something new today. Thanks :)

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Glad to help. :o

I'll be adding additional anti-WB mechanics as I find them, so stay tuned! Feel free to share your findings as well.

Ping, want try some decorations ? :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1eHDDw_vlI&list=PLUYDE7MiyjxJHs94whuJnBs5-DL_AB4Dv&index=49

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Junliang

Ping, want try some decorations ? :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1eHDDw_vlI&list=PLUYDE7MiyjxJHs94whuJnBs5-DL_AB4Dv&index=49

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nice. nice edits too man... best i've seen! ;-)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Junliang

Ping, want try some decorations ? http://forum.supercell.net/images/smilies/biggrin.png

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Yeah, I've noticed that troops still "avoid" the actual decoration, but not tile that the decoration is on. Why'd you think I still have all my decorations plus the new flag? ;)

I'll add decorations to the OP, once we've figured out an efficient way to use them to "guide" WB.

Bump......

1. Added a demonstrative replay of the Wall Cushion mechanics. Thanks for the submission, Soki.
2. Added proper credits to contributors.
3. Fixed large image issue.

No Problem, It was my pleasure to share. ;)

This is a very helpful thread on defensive mechanics against new WB AIs. Good job PingFao!

Attach is a pic of my current base. I enjoy wbs go in a zigzag manner towards my main base. ;)


Attachment 5264

Quote:

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Originally Posted by GonFreakss

This is a very helpful thread on defensive mechanics against new WB AIs. Good job PingFao!

Attach is a pic of my current base. I enjoy wbs go in a zigzag manner towards my main base. ;)


Attachment 5264

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Thank you. Glad I could help. Love the staggered T-junctions & the Northern wall cushions in your design. ;) How do the Southern maze-like strips work? Or are they just temporary since you haven't figured out where the new walls should be? haha

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Soki

No Problem, It was my pleasure to share. ;)

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Keep the findings & ideas coming! I encourage everyone to contribute, so we can all learn how to defend more effectively against these revamped, wall-breaking buggers.:)

Really helpful, this, with your theme park has lead me on a winning streak;)

Pingfao,

Do you know if when WB pick their nearest building to free, will they count a hidden tesler or will they ignore it for a known building ?

cheers m8 great work
pompeypaul

Quote:

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Originally Posted by pompeypaul

Pingfao,

Do you know if when WB pick their nearest building to free, will they count a hidden tesler or will they ignore it for a known building ?

cheers m8 great work
pompeypaul

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If the tesla is inactive and enclosed, the wall breaker will not take that box into account.
But once the tesla is active and still enclosed, the wall breaker will then take that enclosed box into account.

Thanks Boss :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Junliang

If the tesla is inactive and enclosed, the wall breaker will not take that box into account.
But once the tesla is active and still enclosed, the wall breaker will then take that enclosed box into account.

---

Quote:

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Originally Posted by pompeypaul

Thanks Boss :)

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you're welcome :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by pinser

Really helpful, this, with your theme park has lead me on a winning streak;)

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The park doesn't work anymore, silly. :p

Quote:

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Originally Posted by pompeypaul

Pingfao,

Do you know if when WB pick their nearest building to free, will they count a hidden tesler or will they ignore it for a known building ?

cheers m8 great work
pompeypaul

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Thanks for the kind words. As Junliang mentioned, Hidden Tesla compartments will attract Wall Breakers once the Tesla has been activated. I toyed around with this idea briefly using open Hidden Tesla pockets to create unexpected Wall Breaker paths, which can throw attackers off. ;)

Thanks PingFao,

The Southern strips are meant to be maze-like funnels for giants and wbs. Those white walls of mine has not been attacked by wbs ever since they were erected. Once wbs spawn, they will zigzag and attempt to attack the walls behind my canon. :D

I am still playing around with it. If you want to check out my base every so often, you are welcome to visit.

Proud elder of Summer Land,

GonFreakss

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pingfao

Thank you. Glad I could help. Love the staggered T-junctions & the Northern wall cushions in your design. ;) How do the Southern maze-like strips work? Or are they just temporary since you haven't figured out where the new walls should be? haha



Keep the findings & ideas coming! I encourage everyone to contribute, so we can all learn how to defend more effectively against these revamped, wall-breaking buggers.:)

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by GonFreakss

Thanks PingFao,

The Southern strips are meant to be maze-like funnels for giants and wbs. Those white walls of mine has not been attacked by wbs ever since they were erected. Once wbs spawn, they will zigzag and attempt to attack the walls behind my canon. :D

I am still playing around with it. If you want to check out my base every so often, you are welcome to visit.

Proud elder of Summer Land,

GonFreakss

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Do you mind sharing a couple of replays on how those strips work? I'm interested to see how far Wall-Breakers would zigzag, instead of blowing a path through the strips.

Wow, nice thread, great job Pingfao and all the contributors. Nice findings and I think I will redesign my base soon - waiting for league to come out then do it together!

Sorry if this was posted before but, in response to Daddy's video, I do not think the decoys work exactly like that. Don't wall breakers head for the nearest enclosed building, AND take the nearest path to them? With that said, that is the reason why in the practice map, the wallbreaker still went through the wall once the tower was destroyed. With the decoy builders hut, I would assume that once archers destroy the hut, one could drop wallbreakers and it would go for the other walls of the base.

Correct me if mistaken.

Thanks

Quote:

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Originally Posted by RickyMcFerrin

I would assume that once archers destroy the hut, one could drop wallbreakers and it would go for the other walls of the base.

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I used them for quite awhile, unfortunately wb attack were rare for me. I had 3 traps, one time archers destroyed the hut and wbs ignored it. Another time they couldn't have worked better, the first deployment took one decoy then the second went, what I'd have thought, way out of it's way to get another. So you are correct but the decoys do work if the attacker misses them or doesn't understand why they're there.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3401784/Phot...%2022%20PM.png

The goal here is to protect my air defense. My hope is that the first couple wallbreakers will be funneled into the spring trap and activate the tesla, and that further wallbreakers will be diverted toward the tesla's compartment. The secondary purpose of the tesla is to give my point defense more time to shoot giants before they take out the AD and can safely deploy a healer.

Any reason why this wouldn't work? Anything anybody can think of to improve it?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Zombiebender

I used them for quite awhile, unfortunately wb attack were rare for me. I had 3 traps, one time archers destroyed the hut and wbs ignored it. Another time they couldn't have worked better, the first deployment took one decoy then the second went, what I'd have thought, way out of it's way to get another. So you are correct but the decoys do work if the attacker misses them or doesn't understand why they're there.

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Thanks for sharing your experience with that mechanic. I personally never tried it, so Daddy is the guy to talk to about it. :p

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Blobertson

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3401784/Phot...%2022%20PM.png

The goal here is to protect my air defense. My hope is that the first couple wallbreakers will be funneled into the spring trap and activate the tesla, and that further wallbreakers will be diverted toward the tesla's compartment. The secondary purpose of the tesla is to give my point defense more time to shoot giants before they take out the AD and can safely deploy a healer.

Any reason why this wouldn't work? Anything anybody can think of to improve it?

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Looks like a reasonable utilization of Wall Cushions to redirect WB paths over traps. Good job.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pingfao

Thanks for sharing your experience with that mechanic. I personally never tried it, so Daddy is the guy to talk to about it. :p

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Err, ok:confused:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Pingfao

Do you mind sharing a couple of replays on how those strips work? I'm interested to see how far Wall-Breakers would zigzag, instead of blowing a path through the strips.

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Hi Pingfao,

Sorry, I almost forgot about this thread. I am not tech savvy, so all I can do is add some pics of a zigzag wb attack by King Philip.

Attachment 5996

Initial attack is giant spawn... By the time they make it to the free cannon, 1 out of 8 giants left are left.

After some archer deployment, he sent in the WBs. Notice that they are targeting the walls enclosing the gold storage.


Attachment 6000

With the way the walls are set up, it forces the WBs to "zigzag" along their journey. Of course, they all die off by the time they get there. :cool: I wish I could have added more screenshots, but there's a size limit on attachments.


Attachment 6001

Quote:

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http://i49.tinypic.com/v62kn9.jpg

Enclosed, individual building lures Wall-Breakers away from the main base

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Builder gets defended!
Anyway, it seems effective since i attacked a base with the same setup and guess what! It did work! I lost 5 wb to that setup



Oh yeah, almost forgot: how do you post pics w/o being turned into thumbnail?

Naturally the builder gets defended, however neither does the Builder has enough hitpoints nor is it difficult to destroy to verify such a hugh amount of walls just for that.

You can just upload your picture somewhere in link it directly = no thumbnail and anyway preferable as the amount of space you've got here is laughable. 500kb... :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by PololoP

Naturally the builder gets defended, however neither does the Builder has enough hitpoints nor is it difficult to destroy to verify such a hugh amount of walls just for that.

You can just upload your picture somewhere in link it directly = no thumbnail and anyway preferable as the amount of space you've got here is laughable. 500kb... :rolleyes:

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Tnx for the picture tip

lol funny to see that pic again :) yeah it does work...but it would be nice to have 6 as there are some dead areas. The main thing though is if an attacker relies upon wall breakers for their strategy then taking them away from them causes them real issues....it throws them off. Their troops bunch up outside the walls a lot more giving a chance for my splash defences to work.

So the decoys are essential to me....but i am not sure how to progress it...i've been thinking of a decoy wing to force troops to go around ---- are wall pieces

---------(B)---------

Any thoughts?

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Originally Posted by Markoolio

Builder gets defended!
Anyway, it seems effective since i attacked a base with the same setup and guess what! It did work! I lost 5 wb to that setup



Oh yeah, almost forgot: how do you post pics w/o being turned into thumbnail?

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This was really helpful!

here is something that has been working for me fairly well. I think this is probably a subset of the "cushion" tactic but with some wb pathing prediction as well.

http://i1342.photobucket.com/albums/...ps431a0b86.jpg

as you can see in the image there is a buffer to either side of the junction and the outermost wall has a 1x1 additional buffer. this does two things pretty well:
1) wall breakers aim to the left of the 1x1 cubby
2) the next wall breakers path right through the spring trap.


here is a video of it in action:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6gj5yI-lzTU&amp;feature=youtu.be

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Originally Posted by TimTheEnchanter

here is something that has been working for me fairly well. I think this is probably a subset of the "cushion" tactic but with some wb pathing prediction as well.

http://i1342.photobucket.com/albums/...ps431a0b86.jpg

as you can see in the image there is a buffer to either side of the junction and the outermost wall has a 1x1 additional buffer. this does two things pretty well:
1) wall breakers aim to the left of the 1x1 cubby
2) the next wall breakers path right through the spring trap.


here is a video of it in action:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6gj5yI-lzTU&amp;feature=youtu.be

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Thats pretty smart mate :)

But its kinda situational haha, unless you really bait wall breakers to attack there using your resources.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TimTheEnchanter

here is something that has been working for me fairly well. I think this is probably a subset of the "cushion" tactic but with some wb pathing prediction as well.

http://i1342.photobucket.com/albums/...ps431a0b86.jpg

as you can see in the image there is a buffer to either side of the junction and the outermost wall has a 1x1 additional buffer. this does two things pretty well:
1) wall breakers aim to the left of the 1x1 cubby
2) the next wall breakers path right through the spring trap.


here is a video of it in action:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6gj5yI-lzTU&amp;feature=youtu.be

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Great application of Wall Cushions to redirect WB onto desirable paths, TimThePimp! In my opinion, any defensive mechanics that can predetermine certain behaviors from enemy troops are extremely helpful for building and trap placements. I will add your example to the OP. Keep the ideas coming guys. :)

How much space is the area splash for the new wall breakers? I need to know how much u need to space the walls for the T junction
thanks

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Originally Posted by TR3V0R

How much space is the area splash for the new wall breakers? I need to know how much u need to space the walls for the T junction
thanks

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Here is a graphical example

http://i40.tinypic.com/34o3klt.jpg

In A, and B, new wall breaker splash radius will open up both compartment

But in C, only DE compartment will be open up.

Hope this helps.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Junliang

Here is a graphical example

http://i40.tinypic.com/34o3klt.jpg

In A, and B, new wall breaker splash radius will open up both compartment

But in C, only DE compartment will be open up.

Hope this helps.

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hope u get th 9 soon ;)






Edit:spelt ur name wrong because of keyboard automatic word thing

Thx junliang, so there has to be one wall in between the 2 compartments right?

The double layer wall can be reversed for better effect.

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Originally Posted by facescraper

nice thread! some great tactics listed also. the video quality makes it hard to watch for me but i get the idea.

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What a nice face u have there XD

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Originally Posted by SuperJia

What a nice face u have there XD

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Is it my pekka or junliang's ironman or facescraper's barb

The decoy island works like spikes, but if archers just destroy the builder hut inside, the walls of the decoy island would be defending no building. Then would the wall breakers be able to skip the island walls and go directly to the main walls? :confused:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Junliang

Here is a graphical example

http://i40.tinypic.com/34o3klt.jpg

In A, and B, new wall breaker splash radius will open up both compartment

But in C, only DE compartment will be open up.

Hope this helps.

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Great visual example. Will add this to the OP for clearer demonstration. :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TR3V0R

The decoy island works like spikes, but if archers just destroy the builder hut inside, the walls of the decoy island would be defending no building. Then would the wall breakers be able to skip the island walls and go directly to the main walls? :confused:

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They would skip the islands.

Ping why can't I join

Hey Ping, I think it'll be good to also note the counter to Daddy's "one builder hut enclosed by walls" trick. If you were to destroy that builders hut first with archers, WB's would just run past and ignore the empty box. This is one attack strategy that I use often in enemy bases that have only 1/2 buildings enclosed, this substantially reduces the amount of WB's I need to get to the resources.

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Originally Posted by FiZiX

Hey Ping, I think it'll be good to also note the counter to Daddy's "one builder hut enclosed by walls" trick. If you were to destroy that builders hut first with archers, WB's would just run past and ignore the empty box. This is one attack strategy that I use often in enemy bases that have only 1/2 buildings enclosed, this substantially reduces the amount of WB's I need to get to the resources.

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Completely agreed. I use archers to take care of single/double building compartments as well. I think Daddy's generally idea for those islands is they provide a surprise element to inexperienced WB-users, much like the zigzags configurations pre-patch.

Hey all!

I thought I would share this video with you in light of this topic. Inevitably, our goal is to create as many X-junctions as we can with our base, but sometimes that's just not possible. Given the recent changes with the decorations we are pretty much screwed as far as trying to manipulate unit pathing.


Well Over the last 2 months I have been testing my hybrid and unfortunately as strong as it has held - it as always been weak at 2-4 spots that had T-junctions. I attempted to place spring traps @ T-junction locations which worked, but after they were set off and the next attack comes they would get it with one set.

With this method I have been able to last multiple attacks and win due to the attackers WB's failing and their units getting stuck at the 2nd/3rd set of walls due to running out of WB.

The goal is initially place a non-defensive 3x3 structure offset against the T-junction. On the side of the T-junction that is closer to the junction use spring traps and/or bombs on the opposite side of the building to assist your defenses in taking them down.

In addition - when you get regular decorations @ or around junction - adjust the defensive buildings 1 tile to the left/right so that it works in unison with the decoration. The building will force the WB to go to one side. The decoration will force it to go 2 tiles to the other side depending on what type of decoration it is. Bigger are better obviously but we beggar's cant be choosers ;p

It definitely is not as good as the decorations pre-update nor will it work everything however I have watched enough defensive replays to see that attackers pushing from 1 of 2 sides thinking that the T-junction is the way to go get randomly stopped at the 2nd section due to lack of WBs .

Hope this helps those who are unable to adjust all of their T-junctions..

~C.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5vzocBoN3E4&amp;feature=youtu.be

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Originally Posted by childish

In addition - when you get regular decorations @ or around junction - adjust the defensive buildings 1 tile to the left/right so that it works in unison with the decoration. The building will force the WB to go to one side. The decoration will force it to go 2 tiles to the other side depending on what type of decoration it is. Bigger are better obviously but we beggar's cant be choosers ;p

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Interesting stuff. So boughten decorations wouldn't work?

put holes in between walls like this

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--------

not like big difference
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Originally Posted by Zombiebender

Interesting stuff. So boughten decorations wouldn't work?

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It does :p
But not consistent enough to be use as a tactic, sadly :/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1eHDDw_vlI&list=PLUYDE7MiyjxJHs94whuJnBs5-DL_AB4Dv&index=49

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Originally Posted by Junliang

It does :p
But not consistent enough to be use as a tactic, sadly :/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1eHDDw_vlI&list=PLUYDE7MiyjxJHs94whuJnBs5-DL_AB4Dv&index=49

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correct. neither junliangs method or mine is 100% effective, but it helps. It's a little easier to accurately plan the wb deployment with an ipad but most use their iphones and always just a tad off. at least for those that are not stacking their troop composition with 12+ WB will have an issue if they take the bait.

Basically using non-defensive structures as "decorations" in addition to the decos that spawn and springtrap/bombs.

~C.

darn spammers..

Quote:

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Originally Posted by childish

Hey all!

I thought I would share this video with you in light of this topic. Inevitably, our goal is to create as many X-junctions as we can with our base, but sometimes that's just not possible. Given the recent changes with the decorations we are pretty much screwed as far as trying to manipulate unit pathing.


Well Over the last 2 months I have been testing my hybrid and unfortunately as strong as it has held - it as always been weak at 2-4 spots that had T-junctions. I attempted to place spring traps @ T-junction locations which worked, but after they were set off and the next attack comes they would get it with one set.

With this method I have been able to last multiple attacks and win due to the attackers WB's failing and their units getting stuck at the 2nd/3rd set of walls due to running out of WB.

The goal is initially place a non-defensive 3x3 structure offset against the T-junction. On the side of the T-junction that is closer to the junction use spring traps and/or bombs on the opposite side of the building to assist your defenses in taking them down.

In addition - when you get regular decorations @ or around junction - adjust the defensive buildings 1 tile to the left/right so that it works in unison with the decoration. The building will force the WB to go to one side. The decoration will force it to go 2 tiles to the other side depending on what type of decoration it is. Bigger are better obviously but we beggar's cant be choosers ;p

It definitely is not as good as the decorations pre-update nor will it work everything however I have watched enough defensive replays to see that attackers pushing from 1 of 2 sides thinking that the T-junction is the way to go get randomly stopped at the 2nd section due to lack of WBs .

Hope this helps those who are unable to adjust all of their T-junctions..

~C.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5vzocBoN3E4&amp;feature=youtu.be

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My apology for such a delayed response. I have been lurking and saw this topic being discussed. Been very busy, so I waited until I have a bit more time to add a proper reply.

1st of all, COMMENTARY FROM CHILDISH?! AWESOME! Admittedly, I skimmed through a lot of it due to limited time, but the topic you brought up is very interested. I personally have experienced the WB "looping around" the center of the decorations from an offensive point of view before, and have been wanting to play around with the idea. It is something very minor, but differentiates the hardcore/enthusiastic players from the casuals. Great find!

Hey all, I know this thread has been inactive for a while lol, but I have been recently thinking about AI Pathing not only for wall breakers, but for air troops as well.

A highly effective and dangerous (if your base is attacked with) army known as the Balloonion army has become more popular in Clash. From searching, I haven't found any bases that would be considered an Anti-Balloonion base.

As this thread has many posts from the game's most respected and well-known base designers, Pingfao and Junliang, including many other AI enthusiasts like Daddy, I was wondering if you guys would be able to design a first ever Anti-Balloonion base. :D

Of course I will be experimenting with air troop AI pathing in designing my base, I just feel that many people on this thread have had much more experience than I did in AI pathing and base designing.

If there already is an Anti-Balloonion base, I must have missed it lol. :D Please let me know if there is one.

Happy Clashing!
- Dub ;)

Attachment 27776
This is my base, copy if you want..any suggestions?

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Originally Posted by clashofwarriors

Attachment 27776
This is my base, copy if you want..any suggestions?

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I have a suggestion! DON'T BRING UP THREADS FROM MARCH!!! ;);););)

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Originally Posted by clashofwarriors

Attachment 27776
This is my base, copy if you want..any suggestions?

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And this is why some threads are closed because of people bumping them from almost a year ago...