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I'm just curious about what you guys think about DE usage, especially for those who are using BAM / Baloonions / Hogs strategy.
Dont you guys ever think using DE for dark troops are just a waste? Why don't you guys focusing on your heroes? because personally, i wont use DE for dark troops. Hence, i used them to level up my AQ and BK to reach lv 30 (i'm th 9 atm)
What do you guys think?
I have level 6 Ballons and level 5 minions, I get 3-4k dark a raid up in Crystal 1. Not bad and is very effective.
but imagine if you could save the minions dark elixirs cost sum up with what you get from the raid to level up your heroes. isnt that amazing?Quote:
Originally Posted by XethaPvP
I'm in the same boat as OP. Feel like my DE would go alot further being used to upgrade my heroes. Also, I don't like the idea of upgrading minions/hogs with DE only to use more DE to cook them.
How many levels is that? If i remember correctly minions upgrade cost are 10k 20k 30k 40k? That's like 100k, 2 hero levels.Quote:
Originally Posted by Citruslash
I'm willing to sacrifice two hero levels for max minions for sure. They make BAM and Miniball viable, which is basically all i use atm.
My suggested priority:
Minions > heroes to level 10 > hogs > heroes to level 15 > golem > witch > max heroes > valkaryie
Somewhat. Like Sandalhat said, there is a point at which you are better to upgrade your DE troops than your Heroes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Citruslash
I'm TH 8 and I've only upgraded my minions because using BAM, they do make a diffence for farming and mopping up what the Barcher crew could not get.
I do consider that the upgraded minions (to lvl 4 in my case, max at TH 8) give me better gold loot than the BK could if I upgraded him from say lvl 5 to 7 or even 8. The benefits of a versatile troop like the minions outweigh those of 2-3 levels on the BK.
I farm around 70k-80k DE daily with just giants barbars archers wb and goblins. So i gem my AQs upgrade time when my storage is filled up which is around once in every 2 days. She is going to be 33..
The argument is the same as asking why use traps or any troop? Why not just use your heroes and no troops as they cost nothing. The answer is the same, you can get more loot with a more expensive army. The DE invested in troops can earn you more DE in raids.
Really? Can you please put together a guide on how you get 70k per day with an army that takes 30 minutes to cook (and that is without spells). That's 48 attacks per day at 1500 DE a pop. I believe it can be done (I am sure you are above 2000 cups) but wow you really have to spend your entire life on CoC.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuvya
That won't work for Th8 and would be very difficult for th9. For a th8 your best bet is to get your minions to lvl 4 and BAM at 1600. Tons of DE left out in the open and you can profit 4-6k DE per hour (and profit 1 mil gold per hour at the same time). Any higher in cups as a th8 and you get mowed every time you log off. And it doesn't matter what base you use, lvl 6 giants will destroy your base and take your DE.
You have to spend money to make money...it's the same concept with DE (unless you are like this poster with th10, max troops, and lvl 30+ heroes).
Cheers!
Yes, to collect good amount of DE you must be at least crystal league. I m not limiting it to TH 8 or 9 or 10 since the type of attacks i make could be done with level 5 troops too. I forgot to add, I boost my barracks when i do that. So DE comes pretty fast. I will post some images for you in here to prove it. However, I just proved it in masters of coc tournament by raiding 300K DE in 4 days. I wasnt pushing to get more DE just because i was in tournament, its just my routine. I didn t even use a single DE troop to raid that amount or i didnt use spells often. You can also check that tournament thread.Quote:
Originally Posted by Smalls
You don't need to prove it. As I said, with th10 and lvl 30+ heroes I believed it could be done and now that you said you boost your barracks I have zero doubts that you do it. I know ppl have questioned me before in my claims that I can profit 4-6k DE in one hour with BAM - but I do it every day.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuvya
I just don't think the strategy is viable at th8. You just get killed too often with lvl 6 giants in crystal. Maybe a th9 could do it but those th10s with their hogs are brutal.
One thing I want to add is there is no absolute one way to farm. This strategy works, BARCH works, BAM works, Giant/healer works, miniballs works, even mass dragons can farm a ton of DE. The key is to get good at a strategy and go do it!
The only thing I would say here is that a TH 8 could not do this at the same efficiency as Tuvya is saying, only because some time would be needed to trophy push every now and then to stay in crystal. In gold, TH 8 can farm and push almost at the same time. but in crystal, if you only go for DE, you'll lose cups.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuvya
So at the end of the day, it would not be possible to be as efficient as a TH 10 doing it.
to sum it up,
i personally as well can get decent amount of DE by only using barbs, archers, giants, and wallbreakers. like 3k DE that i got from inactive base, 1-2K average from every raid wit spells and im at Gold II League, th 9.
BAM is pretty fast to collect gold, but for those who have a lot of time (like me) to play coc and do 15+ raids per day is still fine, raiding without dark troops.
thank you guys for the input, im looking forward for more comments that can make me reconsider of using dark troops.
hail heroes!
Using DE troops can be really fun. So why restrict yourself to have more fun in a game?
Also, BAM is superior to Barch in terms of efficiency and effectiveness. You can raid 50% more, you can exploit bases with weak or imbalance air coverage.
Just spend it. It would probably be stolen anyway.
hehe, ive think that way too before this thread was made. but i'd rather to preserve it for heroes though. high levels heroes are somewhat intimidate ppl attacking my base.Quote:
Originally Posted by kozalaqung
to lure BK and to kill him requires 10 L6 Archers and 1 Barbarian (to kill lv 1 BK) . Level 10 BK is definitely need more troops to kill.
Yeah I can understand that. When I was th7 and saving for BK lv5 upgrade, I try not to use any minions to save DE, then when I logged out, I got raided by a TH8 and lost about 800 de. Then I thought to myself, damn thats like more than 100 minions. So I started to spam minion since then and even more when I got to th8 and a lv3 drill.Quote:
Originally Posted by Citruslash
Oh and also, IMO, upgrading heroes has diminishing return. They start to cost more per dps and hp increase while increasing the regeneration time. Not to mention the opportunity cost of not being able to use them while they are being upgraded. I think thats why some higher level players stop upgrading them beyond a certain level.
Anyway, there are more than 1 way to play the game.
you will actually get more DE if you use minions then if you don't. The minions will pay for themselves and allow you to raid more DE then you would have been able to raid without them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Citruslash
I really think if you use minions, you'll acquire DE faster and be able to upgrade Heroes quicker, which is what you are aiming.
alright, this is interesting.Quote:
Originally Posted by Conan
can you tell me the troop composition of BAM strategy? like how many minions needed in BAM, then a good raid replay using BAM? i couldnt find any on youtube
Sure. As TH 8, I use 80 barbs, 80 archers and 20 minions.Quote:
Originally Posted by Citruslash
the best youtube for BAM is Daddy, here is one of his videos:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1VzevfrBlHk
you are best to watch it starting at 9 minutes, that is when the BAM strategy starts.
He does have other videos, but he uses the jump spell.
You see, the beauty of BAM is that you don't really need to use the Minions every time. You can Barch, but when you see good DE, you have the minions to be able to take it. So you win - win, you don't spend DE on minions if you don't need them and you spend DE only once you've used minions to collect more DE then you would have been able to raid.
Hope this helps.
Think of it this way. Lets say im using 60 minions. Although I lose 600 dark elixir every raid, I believe that my loot benefits by more than 600 DE when I use them. If I didnt use minions, I would make considerably less DE per raid. Even though it is a fixed cost, I find it beneficial.
I use minions, BAM, too when farming DE as its simple and reliable. But I guess saying its more profitable than elixir-only troops is debatable. As I believe there are people who are very skilled in using giant-healer strategy that can get similar, if not better, result. Cmiiw.Quote:
Originally Posted by Conan
it should depend on one's preferred strategy and trophy range and I think if he's farming at around 4 or 5k an hour, he should be fine.
the question is, why they never input wallbreakers into the BAM composition? without wb, you need to clean several buildings that lining up outside the wall, so the barb wont rush in if theres remaining buildings outside. but, using wb makes barb path easier to the center of the base. cmiiw
im just excited to try out BAM after seeing replies in this thread, thank you guys!
I don't have any replays but this is how I do it and I farm 4-6k DE (that's profit) per hour with no boosts at all. The very first thing you need to do is go to the wiki and figure out the levels of DE drills and how much they hold. It is very easy to tell a full DE drill on the map. Then here's the game strategy:Quote:
Originally Posted by Citruslash
1. Load up 2 Dark barracks with minions, 2 with barbs, 2 with archers. The composition doesn't matter but you will generally end up with somewhere between 20-30 minions (and if your lucky with inactives you may eventually end up with 70 or 80 minions and then you get to have a mass minion raid to stem the boredom of BAM).
2. Spell factory 3 rage and 1 lightning going at all times (rarely will you ever have to use more than 1 spell per attack and most of the time you won't use any).
3. Searching for a base: look for either inactives with pumps outside or DE storages behind 1 or two walls. Do not be tempted to attack a well developed base with a lot DE as BAM isn't meant to go to the middle of a TH9 with xbows fully loaded. Although I will say I've tried and been successful with a few TH10s who get too careless with their DE thinking the disco inferno tower will scare ppl away. In general, I raid between 800-1200 per attack.
4. The attack itself: Lure and destroy heroes/CC if neccessary. Then, if the DE is in the drills just take it with your barbs/archers and save those minions. If the DE is in a storage where you can't get to it with barbs/archers then it's time to break out the minions. You do this by putting a line of barbs on the side that you are attacking, followed by a line of archers. Clear out all of the outside buildings and try to damage exposed wiz towers and ADs as much as possible. Once it's fairly cleaned out send in 1 or 2 minions to search for air bombs. Then, once the coast is clear send in a group of minions to take out the DE. If you hit CC troops (many times you won't because most of these bases are poorly designed and neglected) use a lightning spell and if you need to drop one rage on the minions to decimate the DE storage. And there you go, you've just pilfered 1200 DE.
Once you get used to the strategy you will figure out exactly how many troops to use and how many to save so you can raid faster. I do this at 1600 trophys (I've tried going up to crystal but I find it's too well protected up there). And just make sure you aren't afraid of the next button. Just remember even though you are wasting time looking for a good base to raid your troops are still cooking back at your base so it's not an issue.
The few drawbacks are that you may have to take a bit of a break to snipe some ths to keep up your trophy count. The DE starts to go away very quickly under 1500 trophys. And the worst thing that can happen to a BAM army is a dragon in an ulurable CC. The dragon eats BAM for lunch. But again, most of these bases are pretty bad and don't have dragons so that is rare.
such a great guide. thank you!Quote:
Originally Posted by Smalls
im going to try out BAM asap, and is it okay to use BAM with L1 minions? my barb and archer are L6 though.
oh i think you missed my question.
why wb is unecessary in BAM strategy? dont you think wb easily leads barbs to the center / target?
I think you're right; Minions just have the edge over Barbarians and Archers.Quote:
Originally Posted by Conan
why no one using wb with BAM strategy?
Well, i know you asked many times, so I'll give my reason: they take too long. It might sound stupid, but 2 minutes is long compared to 25 seconds for archer and 20 seconds for barbs. It all adds up.
the secret to bam is also it's efficiency, in the fact that you can cook it in 18 minutes, and some of that 18 minutes you are out raiding, so in any amount of time, you can raid more often.
secondly, you do not need to break walls: the archers will shoot over them, and minions fly over them. It's why smalls mentionned attacking bases with DE storage behind one or two walls. BAM is best for collector raids and collectors are usually outside of the walls.
I dont use my heroes when i raid for DE. I stick on crystal (between 2050-2200) well with giant archer barbar and goblins. When i see the enemy base i understand that i can get 1 star without spells, sometimes i know i have to use 1 spell to win 1 or 2 star or sometimes i lose (thats what i call kamikaze) on purpose to get the DE of opponent. But every hit i definitely get my DE. This strategy may not be as efficient for th8s but it could work. If i didnt boost barracks that number will be 4 times less which is around 20k DE daily. Still good! If you pop in to my clan someday i share my replays for you to see. You are always welcome if you want to come.Quote:
Originally Posted by Smalls
I get 450 darkelixer everyday from my drills that's itQuote:
Originally Posted by Tuvya
Hey thanks for the invite. I will take you up on that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuvya
Cheers