Bowlers/bo-witch still too strong

Alright I’ll behave.

There’s hardly anything you can do, design-wise, that can virtually guarantee that bo-witch won’t 3* you.

That cannot be said about virtually any other troop comp.

Build anti-lalo base, try and 3 it with lalo, success rate will be very very low.

Same for an anti-hog base.

Build what attempts to be an ‘anti-bowitch’ base, and I guarantee you could succeed in 3 starring it with the troops it’s meant to stop, more regularly than the examples above.

There. Wasn’t sarcastic, I spelled it out.
Just strange that the other person involved in league wars understood exactly what I was complaining about.

First off, some of these examples of fails aren't the spam bowitch that I assume is being talked about here. The spam bowitch I believe we are talking about is the 10 giant, 10 witch, 15 bowler variation which is just dropping lines of troops and raging.

I will admit that I use the 10/10/15 bowitch attack sometimes in war. I have definitely gotten my share of 3* attacks with it in the past but those are more against symmetrical bases than anti 3* bases. When we face a clan with well designed ant-3 bases the percentage of 3 star attacks dips drastically using the spam bowitch.

My base this past war defended against a couple of these 10/10/15 attacks before they finally 2 starred me with the same attack. My war base has only been 3 starred maybe once since I designed it post-th12, and that wasn't by a bowitch spam attack.

There are some design concepts that do actually help defend against them but I won't go into my base "secrets" at this point.

I do think bowitch is strong against bases that don't defend properly against it but that meta should shift once people start figuring things out.

The past 2 wars I've had two 2* attacks with bowitch spam and two 3* attacks with other armies.

What we're experiencing is that bowitch CAN get the 3* but it's unreliable and there are other options that can get more reliable results.

I think it's way too early to be talking about nerfing anything. I have yet to see a TH12 base in war with maxed out defences, but I have seen a lot of people with maxed 12 troops ie; bowitch. So of course you are going to see 11.25 bases getting run over to a certain degree.

I do hope SC takes this into consideration rather than have a typical knee jerk reaction and we end up in the dismal pit of the non 3* abyss again!!

Again, all the bases seem to be using single infernos now in war and the bowitch or gibowitch attacks are helped by that a lot. I see very few people using multi infernos. When I see single, I use bowitch, multi I use my E drags.

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Originally Posted by ThePeskyDingo

First off, some of these examples of fails aren't the spam bowitch that I assume is being talked about here. The spam bowitch I believe we are talking about is the 10 giant, 10 witch, 15 bowler variation which is just dropping lines of troops and raging.

I will admit that I use the 10/10/15 bowitch attack sometimes in war. I have definitely gotten my share of 3* attacks with it in the past but those are more against symmetrical bases than anti 3* bases. When we face a clan with well designed ant-3 bases the percentage of 3 star attacks dips drastically using the spam bowitch.

My base this past war defended against a couple of these 10/10/15 attacks before they finally 2 starred me with the same attack. My war base has only been 3 starred maybe once since I designed it post-th12, and that wasn't by a bowitch spam attack.

There are some design concepts that do actually help defend against them but I won't go into my base "secrets" at this point.

I do think bowitch is strong against bases that don't defend properly against it but that meta should shift once people start figuring things out.

The past 2 wars I've had two 2* attacks with bowitch spam and two 3* attacks with other armies.

What we're experiencing is that bowitch CAN get the 3* but it's unreliable and there are other options that can get more reliable results.

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I'll touch on 2 design elements I use in anti bo-witch bases at TH12:

1. Centralize your TH. Surround it touching on the edges with 4 lower HP buildings, and defensive buildings on the corners. 1 tile gap, surround it with walls. Bowlers will hit the garbage building, the bounce will hit the TH. Tesla triggered, once the garbage building is destroyed bowlers move on while staying in range of the Giga Tesla, while not being able to target it and walking around the walls.

2. Tesla farm and all skelly traps set to ground around your AQ, on the side most attacks come in from. Double giant bombs nearby help too. Check the radii to make sure they trigger in the order you want them too. Attacking troops step up, trigger skellies and teslas, within AQ range. While support troops dispatch the skellies, teslas and AQ remain untargeted, dealing massive damage.
Do this near the edge of your base and you'll stop many AQ walks in its tracks, or have them burn an ability and 1-2 rages in the process.

As other's have said...let's wait until defenses catch up. Way too early to start yelling the sky is falling with any strat yet. I'm happy that we're well beyond the 26 bowlers 6 healer days at least.

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Originally Posted by nelard

I'll touch on 2 design elements I use in anti bo-witch bases at TH12:

1. Centralize your TH. Surround it touching on the edges with 4 lower HP buildings, and defensive buildings on the corners. 1 tile gap, surround it with walls. Bowlers will hit the garbage building, the bounce will hit the TH. Tesla triggered, once the garbage building is destroyed bowlers move on while staying in range of the Giga Tesla, while not being able to target it and walking around the walls.

2. Tesla farm and all skelly traps set to ground around your AQ, on the side most attacks come in from. Double giant bombs nearby help too. Check the radii to make sure they trigger in the order you want them too. Attacking troops step up, trigger skellies and teslas, within AQ range. While support troops dispatch the skellies, teslas and AQ remain untargeted, dealing massive damage.
Do this near the edge of your base and you'll stop many AQ walks in its tracks, or have them burn an ability and 1-2 rages in the process.

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Good ideas, also try get attackers to attack from a certain part of your base where you can try set up a very difficult funnell. If the group splits and you have IT's and point defences in range where bowlers struggle to target em.also I've never used bowitch spam. Unreliablefor me,I use multistage QW,into bowlers with back end hogs. Works much better than bowitch spam. Weve warred back to back for years. I'm seeing bowitch fails left right and centre, but yes the lucky attack gets 3 stars.

Edit: most infernos is being on single mode is the most important buff they got. Imo multi damage still needs a significant increase. The best Nerf to bowlers IF they are OP against max 12 defences is to Inc multi damage again, even more. They're sill so weak on multi.

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Originally Posted by Rephren

most infernos is being on single mode is the most important buff they got. Imo multi damage still needs a significant increase. The best Nerf to bowlers IF they are OP against max 12 defences is to Inc multi damage again, even more. They're sill so weak on multi.

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The multi infernos are ok now, but single infernos are used to stop AQ walks, so it's risky to use multi, even if they are very good for everything else. Just get rid of healers and all this would be solved lol.

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Originally Posted by Superfinch30

Won’t do my usual text wall thing, I’ll keep it relatively brief.

The good: We could almost be embarking on a new golden age of war balance.
Siege machine has made all kinds of 2 phase attacks possible, given them enough wiggle room to be realistically feasible.
Bravo for that one SC.

The bad: bowler heavy spam attacks are still so strong (again helped heavily by the siege machine) that well designed bases (the ones that make KS entry points as difficult as possible, such as you commonly see in league play) are probably more likely to get flattened by a simple spam; where narrow entry isn’t a problem as half of the army is funnelling.

Mass, target any troops MUST be relatively weaker than def targeting troops, because of the comparative risks.
Hogs and loons look in great shape atm, very powerful 10v10, 11v11, and quite likely strong enough to make max 12 3* difficult but possible.
But the lower risk attacks are still carrying that bit too much reward for me.

Again, MUCH more positive than my moans of the last year. I think it’s very close to a near perfect war scene.
Just not quite.

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Maybe when bases max out that ‘near perfect’ scenario may play out

lets nerf every troop and buff every defense until everyone gets 60% 2 star every time! yay! fun!!