War MM & Cannon Cart changes - the FEEDBACK thread!

c&p from my post in another thread...

Two wars matched under the new system so far, and both have been garbage. I won't pretend to go into the nitty-gritty of weighting but there's obviously something wrong the the algorithm - namely that it still doesn't account enough for "engineers". Here's our current matchup, which doesn't pass any eye or smell test of being "even" on either offense or defense, let alone both...

Our Clan is #2L92J090 if anyone wants to check it out for themselves. Just mention the forums.

* = TH out of "place"...


Us: Them:
TH10 TH10
TH10 *TH10.5
TH10 TH10
TH10 TH10
TH9.5 TH10
TH9.5 *TH9.75
TH9 TH9.5
TH9 TH9.5
TH9 TH9
TH9 TH8.5
TH8.5 *TH8.9 (TH11)
*TH8.75 TH8
TH8.5 *TH8.5
TH8 *TH8.9 (TH11)
TH8 TH8
TH7 *TH8.5
TH7 TH8
TH7 TH8
TH7 TH4
TH3 *TH6

In summary, at the high-end, we have 4 bases with Infernos, and zero TH11 bases/troops. They have 5 bases with Infernos and 4 TH11s/troops/Wardens. How is this even, exactly?

If I had to guess, I don't think the new algorithm accurately takes into consideration how much of a game-changer "new" offense is, the way it does (or at least used to, under the old weighting) on defense. As soon as someone unlocks the Grand Warden, they have a HUGE advantage over someone who doesn't have him, even if their troops are weaker. (Similar to how a base with infernos has a huge advantage over a base without, regardless of how upgraded the latter's archer towers and teslas are.)

Well...

Huge mismatch in our first war after the new matchmaking...

Our clan: Emphatic Fury #9Q0RCPGC
Opponent: Golden Goblins #JUUJQUU

BREAKDOWN: 5 TH11 10 TH10 and 15 TH9 for Emphatic Fury; 14 TH11 and 16 TH9 for Golden Goblins!

After a weight check the amount of THs on each side must be considered! In the top 2 TH levels shouldn't be more than a base in difference!

Please fix it!

Cheers.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by eeCiff

Our first spin Saturday evening around 5:30 pm EST landed Golden Goblins. War breakdown is 14/0/16 Goblins vs 5/10/15 Emphatic Fury at the th11/th10/th9 levels. Close enough I guess.

---

How in the world is 14 th11s matching 5 th11s and 10 th10s close enough? Maybe I missed the sarcasm font and you were joking?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 2222

I agree with this. Can someone from SC give us a small bit of information to tell us what the changes were supposed to do? Not just a vague "more fair match" statement but actually just a hint at the mechanics without details?

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Obamalix

This thread is moving along as predicted :)
It’s almost like asking the public if they feel the odds of winning on a scratcher ticket has improved after a “fix”. Some will say: “Yes I finally won so the problem is fixed”. Others will say the opposite and nobody is any wiser than they were before.
It would help a lot if we could get some sort of information expressed on the quality of the matching. There is no point in “complaining” about a poor match if the engine also acknowledge that the match for various reasons was far from perfect. The true challenge is to align the matchmaking algorithm to what is perceived to be a fair match. And that is best done if the public get an idea about how far from a perfect match the algorithm consider a given match is.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tomville

I think it would be helpful to know what SC think a fair match is, personally. I don't think they should share any detail on how the matchmaker works (that is just a clue for trying to exploit it), but rather provide some indication of how they see fairness, or what the goal is. So e.g. That war is competitive... ok understood but in terms of projected star outcome, or on reasonable target options for most members in the lineup, or what?

---

This whole thread is pointless. We are being asked to judge something with no idea of what it was supposed to do. After one war, I can confidently say that 50% of the clans are happy (the mismatch went in their favor) and 50% are unhappy. As SC refuses to even say what their goal was, we have no other metric to judge by than if the war was winnable or not.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rephren

From the replies it seems engineered clans are struggling to get matches....Make it so that getting a matched the more engineered you are takes extremely long, if at all. I truly hope this is their plan.
Either that or they're being incompetent again and their matchmaking algorythm is screwy and not finding people matches. I wonder which it is? ;P

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Funktastic

SC wants to please everyone and at the end it pleases nobody. Will all the upgrade possibilities and war roster possibilities there are infinite clan types and it's impossible to find a total fair match for everyone.
I say it again SC will never be able to solve the MM issue without taking radical decisions, like minimum weight per TH, or impossibility to opt-in for war if all building are not dropped for the TH, or whatever...

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by dummyshell

Yes! Agree that both clan should have the same highest TH level.
We just cannot accept when the opponent clan has TH10 troops while our max is TH9. Our top 1 and 2 can be easily 3-star by them. And this is frustrating and make clan war meaningless.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Skinnyfat

The main cause of this debacle is that SC are unwilling to lose the engineers as customers. IMHO SC should just take the hit to profits and 'reset' the game to the way it was intended to be played. After all, SC caused this problem in the first place with their original algo.
It would be great to end this entire fiasco once and for all so the devs can crack on and create new cool content.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bristingr

I don't know what you guys did, but man did the matchmaking gey even worse. Our clan never went up against so many engineered based in our entire life. How can you guys screw up something so badly?

---

By trying to walk a tight-rope and not offend anyone, SC has managed to anger EVERYONE. They created this mess by waiting so long to take action (it is doubtful that they actually did take any action) and only aggressive action will be able to fix this. Many of us have been in games where the casual player base suddenly drops out. The game becomes unplayable and crashes.

Our two matches after update have been paired, not perfect but far better than before. We were matching highly engineered clans, and we only have a pair of .5 players, so my feedback at the moment is positive.

SC is trying to put a bandaid on a broken system. Until they totally rebuild the MM from the ground up and put a minimum weight on every TH, the abuse of trying to trick the MM will continue. I've been asking for it for a year or more and will continue to do so as long as I'm still playing. The minimum weight of a TH should be the maximum of the previous one. NO system put in place will please everyone, that's just facts. I'm a maxer, I compete in the MLCW. To ME that's how wars are supposed to be, evenly matched. IMO war is an aspect of the game that is entirely different than the other play types. You should have a balanced base, and max it for each TH level, or you should have a harder time in wars. The MM should account for weights, but the first priority is matching TH levels. If someone is defenseless or engineered, THEY chose to do that. To me the solution is so simple it's black and white, but that's due to how I play and what I want out of the game. I can tell you we rarely do random spins anymore because of the horrendous MM, and there are more and more league clans (regardless of league) that are getting away from random spins, which means there's less "balanced" clans to find. A clan that knows what they are doing (attack wise) and has 2 or multiple TH 11 attacks that you don't in a 20-30 man war is a very tough war to win (if skill is very close). Whether the majority of players feel this way, or if SC feels this way, who knows. But until massive changes happen with war MM, or until enough people quit warring (random spins), or quit the game entirely, IMO nothing will ever get solved. ONE day this game will fade away, will war MM be the cause of it to spiral............. Only time will tell.

[ATTACH]Top 5 bases[/ATTACH]

you be the judge...

Our side: 3 th10s (first is maxed the others mid way with infernos lvl2) rest are th9s and few th8s at the bottom
Most of our th9s are close to be maxed.

Enemy side: 2 th11s, 3 th10s, rest exactly us our bases.
Their first base is maxed th11 - eagle lvl2, infernos lvl5
2 normal th10s,
1 engineered th10 - (no infernos)
1 engineered th11 (th9 defenses)

Wait a minute, the changes have been made already?

Current war 15vs15, opponent has numbers 1, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 with grand warden. We have 1 & 2 with grand warden.

Not giving up on it yet but our first match was a huge disappointment. We deliberately take no engineered bases to war, we presented a TH10-TH8 lineup and were still matched with a clan with 5 engineered bases (no roster engineering, lowest was a TH9).

Hugely disappointed here!

Our first matchup was very lopsided and we faced a level 10 engineered clan. Our lineup was:
1 Th10(9.5)
2 th9 (1 8.5)
3 th8 (1 7.5)
2 th7 (1 fully engineered)
5 th5
2 th4

Our opponent had:
1 th11 (engineered)
2 th9 (1 engineered)
3 th8
5 th7 (4 engineered)
2 th6 ( 1 engineered)
2 th5

Is this a fair matchup, because I don't think it is, our bottom didn't stand a chance against their engineered bases because they had cannons plus air defenses. This is the first engineered clan we've faced and I'm wondering if it was just a bad match or if the new update did it because of our one engineered and our .5s can anyone shed some light here? We have a decent war log and I would like to keep it that way, and that means staying away from engineered clans.