The true debate.. Is it fair to Engineers to change the MM?

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July 26th, 2017
J1mh1d

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warios

Do you have any documented proof of this statement of who spends more gems? Or is it just a guess?

Nope, i have no proof to be given for you. You can ask SC for the proof so the proof is unquestionable legit. If i produce the proof for you, you will doubt wether it is legit or not anyway.
July 26th, 2017
Onetoomany

Quote:

Originally Posted by Holps

I will chime in on both topics because I can do what I like while my wife is not looking. Despite the well trodden issue with a few bad apples, CWL is still undeniably a seriously impressive standard of warring. I have watched them plot, plan and execute totally clean 3 stars and also seen them fail - as you all have online. They consistently prove that they are willing to put themselves in that spotlight and many of them perform very well under pressure with close wars and a huge amount of tactical nous on display.

Secondly, whatever happens with MM every single Engineer knew that when they turned to the dark side that they would achieve unimaginable power in the universe but at the risk of having to wear a black cloak and breathe through a wet flannel. Whatever changes Supercell decide to make not one Engineer could claim that they thought defenceless bases were how Supercell intended them to play. They 100% know they are 'gaming' the MM and while I eschew their methodology I do at least see why they seek that mystical power. From their end they surely all know that If Supercell suddenly brings out the heavy roller and levels the playing field it was fun while it lasted and they should simply adapt again....and they will....If they have to...lets wait and see.

Well, that proves this point:

Quote:

What I'm saying is that CWL clans are idolized, while engineering clans are demonized. Both have the same win at any cost mentality, but engineers are the ones playing within the rules of the game. Seems a little backwards.

The modding is real, account sharing to let the better players have more hits is rampant, but it's the engineers who have "turned to the dark side."
July 26th, 2017
littledoctor

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChiefTuk

Was it fair to maxers to change the MM in March of 2016? Clans running tons of max or close to max TH9s were getting favorable matchups. SC realized they needed to do something to push players to progress beyond perma-maxing TH9.

Actually, the March 2016 change was to protect perma Th9. Prior to that they were matching rushed Th10s and losing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ClasherClash443

Also look at Clan War League rules. Engineering is outright banned.

They say it is, but it's not. People engineer their 10s for the tier system. Permabasing is engineering for CWL.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Postal

Matchmaking must take into account offence too! For heaven's sake!

What I think people fail to realize is that this is Clash of Clans, not Hay Day, not Brawl Stars, not Clash Royale. There, I think that settles the debate once and for all.

Quote:

Originally Posted by strandwolfza

come on, the rules of this forum prevent a lot of us from speaking what we really think about engineers and they force us to be "politically correct" but the truth is that it's hard to respect those who chose to ruin wars for others just to compensate for their lack of attacking/defending skills

Similarly, it's hard to respect people who complain that other people playing a strategy game are using a successful strategy. But life is full of hard things, and we do them anyway. If we only wanted to do easy things we'd play a different game.

WRT gems, I expect folks with lots of accounts to buy more gems than folks with only one account, especially when they are actively farming those accounts up. Usually when I start a new engineered account I buy builders right away. I have one account I have never bought gems for, and it is hard to resist sometimes.

WRT fairness in general, I think it depends on how severe the change is. I don't think supercell is going to implement a major change; they're not going to permaban every lopsided account, or make it so that engineered accounts are completely worthless, or make it so that everybody drops the heavy defenses on day 1 of a new TH like we all used to do. They might make it so that defenseless accounts are worth much less, and I would not object to that.
July 26th, 2017
ClasherClash443

I was making the point that CWL outright bans engineering in all forms, because they can, because they know it is garbage. Same with modding, it is banned in CWL as well as against the terms of service because it is easily defined and enforcable without much or any doubt. Engineering is muddled.

If the admins of the CWL choose to turn a blind eye, or simply don't know how to detect modding, that is a whole other conversation.

Also, I cannot draw 100% equality between engineering and steroid use because it isn't against the terms of use, BUT, I still contest that the gains from engineering are about as admirable as the gains from steroid use. For the reasons that they both give you a big advantage in their respective games with little to no effort.

I suspect those that engineer and defend it's use don't really care about being admirable. Just like the steroid users walk around with their chests puffed out like "look at me I am so strong", they don't care how they got there, they just want the end result.

I hope someday soon it is forbidden, in the form that it no longer creates a significant unfair advantage. I suspect based on Darian's recent comments, that day is not far off. So while it may never be acceptable to call it cheating, we can already say it is heavily frowned upon and looking to be erradicated.
July 26th, 2017
Stevejnr

Quote:

Originally Posted by Postal

Matchmaking must take into account offence too! For heaven's sake!

Quote:

Originally Posted by littledoctor

What I think people fail to realize is that this is Clash of Clans, not Hay Day, not Brawl Stars, not Clash Royale. There, I think that settles the debate once and for all.

I must be missing something here, because I don't see what it has to do with Hay Day, Brawl Stars or Clash Royale.
I have no idea how you think that settles anything, it just seems like a load of random games listed to say that offence shouldn't matter? I have obviously missed your point could you elaborate a little please.
July 26th, 2017
littledoctor

Quote:

Originally Posted by ClasherClash443

I was making the point that CWL outright bans engineering in all forms, because they can,

This point is wrong, because they don't ban engineering in all its forms.
July 26th, 2017
J1mh1d

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alexheney

Do you have the slightest shred of evidence that engineers spend more money on average?

I don't have any evidence to suggest that might be the case.

Well, you are the moderator, you have a better connection with SC. You are the one who should ask them the proof. Legally i am innocent until proven guilty. Like wise i am honest until you can proven otherwise. I think you can ask for the proof. Will you ask them that? I guess the answer is a no. In anycase you ask that to them, i guess (again) you will not get anything beside sweet talk from them. Since (i apologize first) you and i mean nothing for SC. Losing you will give no impact at all for them.
July 26th, 2017
littledoctor

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stevejnr

Quote:

Quote:

Matchmaking must take into account offence too! For heaven's sake!

What I think people fail to realize is that this is Clash of Clans, not Hay Day, not Brawl Stars, not Clash Royale. There, I think that settles the debate once and for all.

I must be missing something here... could you elaborate a little please.

I thought we were engaging in a non sequitur contest?
July 26th, 2017
Funktastic

Quote:

Originally Posted by littledoctor

Similarly, it's hard to respect people who complain that other people playing a strategy game are using a successful strategy. But life is full of hard things, and we do them anyway. If we only wanted to do easy things we'd play a different game.

It's awkward that you choosed to play a hard game and you choose the easy way to win, are you proud of beating TH9 with TH10 offense?

And IMO it's totally justified to complain against engineer, you can win even if you are a bad attacker, the game is not fun playing against you, the game is not fun playing with you also.
Furtermore we can't remove building so even if we want to join you, we can't.
July 26th, 2017
Stevejnr

Quote:

Originally Posted by littledoctor

I thought we were engaging in a non sequitur contest?

Most likely you are correct judging by some of the posts, I will stay out of the way:smirk:

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