Printable View
Thoughts?
I mean I thought it was pretty bad back then. But wow at the minute there are very very few threads I am interested in reading.
Bring back the forums we all love XD
**PS I apologise mods if this should be in forum talk, wasn't sure as it's both about the forums and the game.
Things haven't really changed. Ever since the infamous December update, forums have been flooded with mostly angry people. I can't remember how forums were before that date, as I only made an account to complain too haha
I've always known it like this. Angry people and noobs, that's what these forums seem to be filled with. Only issue I have, which didn't seem to be there in the past. When you posted something, like question about strategies or other decent discussions. Nobody seems to bother to read or reply. Or mods move the topic to one of the dark corners of the forums where it starts gathering dust as nobody reads those...
Think it is more to do with these "fresh spawns". People make emails just to come here and put up threads with no relevance.
I think whoever joins forum should be asked to first link their clash account with their forum account and any misbehavior here should invite a ban on the game account as well.
I think it's worse now because there are many more members on the forums than there was all those months ago. And most of those new forumers have come here because they aren't satisfied with where the game is heading atm. All my opinion of course
Quote:
Originally Posted by evertonjeff
I do think that there is "another subject", that people seem to find more .. segregating .. than the Builder Hall update ..
no, that's not the correct use of the word "segregating" .. :-)
The forum has been a place for people to express their unreasonable complaints for a long, long time now .. and you seriously can't say that SuperCell hasn't brought back sniping with the Builder Hall :-) .. The number of attacks I've won from simply sniping more buildings than my enemy is staggering..
yes, add "sniping" to the long list of things that the Builder Hall brings to Clash of Clans :-)
/Affront
Interesting timing Everton because I have been reflecting the last few days on how the forums feel at the moment but I'm not convinced it's the Builder Hall that has caused it. I think a more relevant issue is that the game is now rolling along into it's 5th year and there are a lot of players that have been clicking on elixir bubbles for almost all of it.
I admit I'm disappointed with the reception the BH has gotten but at the same time there does seem to be an inherent desire to attack via the forums rather than constructively discuss with almost every change.
We also have a huge player base that really don't need to discuss many of the issues with the playing of the main game because they have been playing for years and a forum environment where players often jump on new posters here with comments about wrong forums or forum rules rather than embracing new blood that inject fresh perspective.
Ultimately the forum users create the atmosphere so while I'm happy to throw fruit at you guys I do think that Supercell need to now concentrate on providing those long term players which what they have been begging for, for years. Let the BH slowly develop (because I enjoy it) but stop simply adding a defence or troop level expecting Top Players to keep drinking from the well.
Take a long term view and bite the bullet with a radically overhauled trophy mechanic. Free up the top levels and reinvigorate the war community with fixes for the engineering issue plus look at improving the social side of the clans.
We also we need to radically overhaul the forum set up because it is absurd often well thought out and excellent posts disappear into obscurity on sub forums you guys simply do not visit. Darian has shown a real commitment to engaging here recently which has been great as I wonder at times how Supercell don't grow weary of reading so much negativity and give thought to simply kicking this place into the long grass.
This thread will be an interesting read. Do people add constructive points or does it turn into an excuse to kick the BH and attack the developers? I know which one my money is on..:smirk:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Affront
Interesting perspective on it I had never really thought of the BH as sniping , but I suppose it is sniping.
I think what I have noticed as of late that, this 'update' has upset a lot of the shall we say regular more upstanding forumers as well.
It isn't just the fresh spawns that are showing dislike to it. And I have also noticed a few who loved this 'update' now sharing their issues as well.
I just hope that SuperCell do something. I love these forums. I love the community. But at this moment in time it really is either
A) Very slow not a lot happening
or
B) As someone mentioned earlier decent threads getting buried :(
#MakeTheForumsAndGameGreatAgain
Holps, my man, I feel you are spot on.Quote:
Originally Posted by Holps
I was weary of posting the thread because and I probably entitled it wrong because I don't want this to be a BH bash, I want it to be a discussion on the state of the forums.
But I like the thought and think you are right that there would have been very little anger towards this update if SuperCell had indeed addressed the trophy issues etc.
Also with the forums I think you are right far too many a really inventive, inciteful excellent post just slip by the wayside, because of the incessant need to vent.
The nature of any forum for games is pretty universal, the majority of people will create an account so they can voice their opinion, usually to complain about an update they don't like or a nerf to one thing or another. Some of those people will stick around after the dust has settled and some won't be seen or heard of again.
I do remember the 'infamous update' you mention (check my join date:p) and I think it was generally worse for a few months then, it wasn't just people complaining about one thing, it was TH sniping, the EA being OP, the change to the PBT, the sudden lack of loot, the complete silence from SC (OK somethings never change) any one who had a legitimate gripe was told to 'adapt or quit' followed by 'collectors and stores outside', and anyone who said 'adapt or quit' was labelled a 'Fan Boi'. Generally the two sides became quite toxic towards the other, it was not a good time on the forum.
This time at least it's mainly only complaining about the Builder Hall Base that is special, the other complaints (engineering, clouds, global etc.) are always just beneath the surface. IMHO most of the complaints are not met with the same level of toxic responses and their are far less people running about calling people 'Fan Boi' just because they don't agree.
So, yes I do get frustrated with the constant complaints about the same thing but I understand why people feel they have to say something, they have an emotional investment in the game they have played for a long time. However I think the forum is generally a better place after the BHB update than after the introduction of TH11, TH sniping removal and all that came with it.
I enjoyed reading this particular part of your post Holps. It sums up nicely the thoughts of probably most around here and I agree on all the points you have raised.Quote:
Originally Posted by Holps
I particular agree with letting the BH village slowly develop into its own niche game within the game whilst SC concentrate their efforts on reinvigorating the main game. I think that is what has raged most players - if SC had invested a little bit of time in the problems on the main village whilst simultaneously releasing the BH village, there would have been a lot less uproar. As it stands I personally feel the main village and thus its players, were neglected a little. And so the forum complaints come in thick and fast.
It is also a shame that excellent posts get moved down the list or are moved so fast that most miss them. Will be interesting to see how that can be re-worked.
No. I seem to remember the forums were much worse December 2015! Remember all the problems with pbt?Quote:
Originally Posted by evertonjeff
i think the biggest beef currently is that some good things were implemented into BH (like pvp) but weren't introduced in to the main game. Furthermore, the lack of fresh content on the main game has made it stale.
The reaction to the builders hut is because of the builders hut, if the update had brought legends pvp to solve clouds and the matchmaker was adjusted so that no clan had a more than 60% chance to win a war based on upgrade path, the reaction and the forums would be totally different. I don't think it's reasonable to point to an inherent desire to attack via the forums, while this may be true for some people, is clearly not true for all, as many of the people who hate the update, have spend many months discussing and developing well thought out constructive solutions to the current war inequity caused by the matchmaker.Quote:
Originally Posted by Holps
Some of us, who are reasonable normal people, hate the update for reasons carefully explained. It's not a inherent desire to attack, its a simple distaste for the builders base, knowing the small dev team spend six valuable months developing it. The genie is as they say out of the bottle now, and I thing most people will start moving on, which is really the only option now.
supercell creates a lot of the negativity with their actions, if they decide they can't face the consequences and feedback of their own actions, that will be a sad day for them, for us, but it doesn't mean it was some grumpy forum curmudgeons fault, that will be firmly on supercell. They created an awesome game, but through a series of relatively short term and arguably selfish actions slowly turned people who love the game, against the creators of the game, which is a pretty hard thing to do.
We added constructive suggestions for many months, and we got the builders base, can you really blame forumers for wondering what the point of being constructive is, when it seams supercell worry about the quarterly bonus, far more than customer gaming experience, and therefore long term profitability and sustainability.
I know you speak for supercell, but I think to blame forumers for lack of constructive imput, giving how fast supercell buffs and nerf troops, creates a mini game we don't want to play and strongly incentive/coerce us to play it, fix miner bugs, and many more, is let's say a little one sided.
the builders base is here to stay, many of us have said we hate it, but most of us have come to accept it or are mid way in the process of doing so and as apposed to having an intrisix toxic character flaw and continue the critic indefinitely, I can confidently say will show acceptance as we move passed to try to focus on things we can indeed change, with optimism and engagement. Which given how supercell tends to treat us, I think is admirable.
I don't think so.
The Dec 2015 forums was a mess, it oscillated between:
- Clash economics 101
- "A real chief....."
- Adapt or quit
- SC has abandoned us (no communications for a month or so if I recall correctly)
- And then the update to fix to it all which turned out to be clash royale. :facepalm::facepalm:
I would say the mood and tone of the complaints we have seen this round seems tame in comparison, could be that Darian has been on board to provide some answers.
I don't think anything is nearly as bad as the sniping issue. I really wish they kept that because the game was at the height of popularity it seemed and that change really seemed to make a lot of people quit- Especially a lot of farmers who were often times the most social people in the game- and I know my clan and our friends clans got a lot less chat active after that update for a long time. We re kind of back closer to normal though now with the faster building armies- but I wish that was introduced around the sniping update so so many social people didn't quit.
Either way the main thing that happened here is it was kind of a bad idea in my opinion anyways to nerf that clock tower after releasing a new game into coc that people are not totally happy with. If people are already accusing you of just wanting heaps of money and not caring about other long termissues (i.e. War clouds etc), it's not a great idea to essentially tell people they're getting too much for free at the same time. It's just super bad PR- which is kind of a shame considering they did hire an employee to come to the forums which was a step in the right direction so I'd think they were learning. Sure I'm new to posting here but I've been reading this place forever so to me I was pretty glad they hired such a person.
They totally helped make things more social again though for many of us with the global change though. So that's a sign they might be listening and might work on other issues too.
Anyways this isn't as bad as it has been before at all imo lol. I just think all this new builder hut game stuff when all they can do for the main game is add even more annoying defenses to th11 isn't good timing if their goal is to make customers happy. Plus don't ever change people's GUI years into a game (it was a terrible idea to change the chat scrolling too a while back). That can only make people hate you.
But forums wise this seems pretty normal after an update that made people upset- and after every one of those similar things happened- radio silence from the company for a while, people complaining about new forum members, people mad making accounts to be mad. I don't think this is as bad as things got at all. I also think supercell could do some things to counter negativity as well so maybe they will - who knows.
This post is spot on. Maybe you should forward it to their developers ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Holps
In my opinion, after a year of absence, I think the game has never been better. At low levels there seem to be plenty of collector raids, loot is plentiful everywhere and during my absence they implemented pretty much everything I asked for during the 3 previous years.
What worries me a lot though is that SC seems to be out of touch with their longtime players. And what is worse, to me it seems like they don't even care about it. It looks like they are more interested in squeezing more money out of new players instead of keeping the current players motivated. They also seem to lack a long term vision for the game. Where do they want to go with the game?
I retired in June last year and content wise, pretty much nothing changed since then apart from that bomber tower (that only seems useful at lower TH levels). Updates have become pretty predictable: new cannon level, new AT level, some new troop levels. Shortly after that, a nerf for the new troop levels because they are too OP or a buff because they still suck. In the end everything stays the same. You paid 9,5 mil again for an AT, but it ends up doing the same amount of damage... It's no wonder people at the top aren't gemming upgrades anymore either. Such a lack of creativity.
The clouding issues have always been around, and still nothing has been done about it. This is stunning. Almost 5 years and barely any communication about it.... Solution seems simple to me. Above 5000 pvp with the same game mechanics as the builder base matchmaking
Engineering is bothering so many people, still they don't seem to work on that either. Confusing. Seems like they are letting their most diehard players down to me. Solution? No idea, but engineered clans should match each other imo.
RE the builder base. It's a fun addition but nothing new. It's basically just a revamped version of COC :) Not really creative there either imho. It is fun for a while but gets frustrating very fast because the game actually encourages rushing and dipping down on lower players (even more than it does in the home base). Forcing people to build all stuff before upgrading was a good first step. But I think you should have made maxing compulsory too :) That would bring everyone to the same level with fairer matches.
I'm feeling the same way as a number of you posting here, in that there seems a large volume of complaint as compared to constructive discussion. There's also in some cases an epidemic of people just posting without actually reading a thread, until the thread gets an unreadable length and it's the same mistakes already explained earlier being repeated then reuntangled. I also don't like the toxicity and personal abuse that I see here quite often - I took a few days off the forum last week just to not have that excess negativity in my life. I'd like this to be a place where discussions were more constructive and we showed respect for each other. Sure there will always be some complaints, and people posting things in wrong places, etc, but that's a natural part of it being a forum.
I like the idea of a radical reorganisation of the forum, to get traffic more evenly in relevant subforums people actually visit. I look forward to seeing what the future brings there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vikingchief
I know it's a small point and I dont mean to be pedantic but it's important you know I do not speak for Supercell. If I blame anyone for anything I'm doing it all on my own while backing slowly towards the door.
4 categories and general, with the mods being really strict about not letting general become everything as it is nowQuote:
Originally Posted by Tomville
1 war
2 trophy pushing
3 farming
4 builders hut
5 general
6 invisible engineering subforum unless you have password password (Spanser gets you in)
I have seen an increased toxicity towards gasps, personal attacks are never acceptable but there is an underlying factor which should be considered. When the gasps discuss the new updates, and I fully admit this may be a faulty perception, it seams like they are a thin blue line defending the updates in various levels from mild to full on to the death. Again this is probably a perception, and personal attacks are never ok, but I would, if I were managing pr, tell the gasps and mods to gather feedback and acknowledge it first for a few weeks, before counter punching.
first seak to understand, then to be understood.
I don't think they are feeding you marching orders, but iether I have lost touch with reality, or it seams you guys feel pressure to stand on super cells side. This isn't bad or even surprising, and it would be worrying if you didn't, but you definitely don't come accross as perfectly impartial observers. I'm not calling you out here at all, just explaining how it feels or is perceived on the other side of the fence.Quote:
Originally Posted by Holps
I think the problem with that perception for us is that we are constantly trying to fight fires and not add fuel. As a result /we often have to shut down a discussion or take action which is perceived as siding with Supercell. I really don't look at the forums in that way though (Us v Supercell) but I know some forumers do seem to have that in their DNA.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vikingchief
I have been here years and I can honestly say that neither in person over in Helsinki, or via private messages, or here has any Supercell rep ever even hinted at trying to influence our posting or thoughts on the game. What is probably true is I might, on occasion, simply keep silent on a complaint thread because I have nothing constructive to add and may need to wade in to control it at some stage so maybe that gives a perception of fan boy status.
@OP I think one other reason there's less threads people want to read is that we now have 2 separate games lumped in together. I'm sure SC will deny they are separate until they are blue in the face, but it's just not true. There is no interaction between them, no clan interaction in BH. And the players actually playing them are increasingly different. Lach says he's stopped playing the main base; many players have given up on BH. And that's not going to change since the psychology of the games is so different. They will simply appeal to different people.
Now there's nothing the forum can do about SC deciding to lump 2 structurally different games with a very different appeal into 1 app. But they could be organised on the forum so that people playing each can discuss them separately.
If you want to stop the "wrong sub forum" police and similar it'll need a lead from the mods.Quote:
Originally Posted by Holps
True, but... when dealing with multi-thousand users it's pointless to blame or ask anything from the masses. It's the leadership that set the tone one way or another (with rules, structure, whatever). So if the tone on the forum is wrong, it can only be changed by SC. That could be by changing the forum, or by giving players what they want in the game. There is a really noticeable link between how popular updates are and the forum tone. When we get things like the FC update, usually the forum is a happy place. The clumsy removal of sniping, or the BH, less so.Quote:
Ultimately the forum users create the atmosphere so while I'm happy to throw fruit at you guys
I remember when the TH11 update came out Daddy complaining about how toxic the forum was and appearing to blame the users for it. As much as I respect him and agree with him on most things, I think he was wrong there. SC, and only SC, created the hostile atmosphere at that time: by rolling out an unpopular update which impacted user's enjoyment, and doing it in a clumsy way and without engagement (not saying snipe-removal was wrong per se, but the actual implementation was very problematic at the time)
Unfortunately SC don't seem interested :(Quote:
I do think that Supercell need to now concentrate on providing those long term players which what they have been begging for, for years. Let the BH slowly develop (because I enjoy it) but stop simply adding a defence or troop level expecting Top Players to keep drinking from the well.
Take a long term view and bite the bullet with a radically overhauled trophy mechanic. Free up the top levels and reinvigorate the war community with fixes for the engineering issue plus look at improving the social side of the clans.
If you look at Darian's latest reply in the clan wars section, it effectively says SC are happy to sit tweaking the war MM in the way they have been so far. There's no engagement between the devs that do it and users who think they can see obvious problems.
And that's the other reason for lots of complaints. SC aren't terribly responsive. I think Darian is doing a great job; but he's unable to steer what the rest of the team do, which means his job is often to tell the players as diplomatically as he can that the team don't care and will be ignoring the players' request. And if players don't get what they want they will tend to keep complaining...
Those subforum divisions sound workable - I think you'd also need an IFR and bugs/problems areas.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vikingchief
With the other, as Holps said, when we speak here we do that for ourselves, not as representing Supercell or in relation to having a GASP badge, or anything else. So I'm not sure why I would gather feedback from here first to form my view to express, or why anything I say could be viewed as a counterpunch (I'm just another player, who happens to have been given a forum badge, not a line of defence). I do hope I do the acknowledging part though, as I think that's important in terms of being clear on both that it's ok with me that not everyone thinks as I do and that I've listened to what they put forward and recognised their concern.
I like the builder base, so I come out and say so. I'm under no pressure to say that to please anyone or whatever. I know that, say Fette by contrast, dislikes it and she comes out and says so too. No problem with that, provided when we speak on it with each other we make that a constructive and respectful encounter of viewpoints.
thats not, for me at least, where the perceptions comes from. A good example in a debate with a gasp a few days ago, who was trying to argue supercell doesn't force us to play the builders base, was in all seriousness, arguing that when you are mugged under the thread of physical violence, you are not forced to give you money, they are trying to force you, but you chose to or not. For me that's just one example which is very clear that the person is not freely and with intellectual honesty trying to discuss the issue at hand, but on team based defence. I believe you 100% that supercell doesn't try to influence you, but a I also think people instinctively know not to bite the hand that feeds them, without being told.Quote:
Originally Posted by Holps
That was quite a clear example, but I see a lot of that, and it makes me feel like there is this invisible line that creates a somewhat disingenuous relationship, which feeds the us versus them atmosphere that has emerged. It's not at all a big deal, and like I said would be strange if mods and gasps threw constant salt at supercell, would make for a pretty bizarre forum.
just explains from my perspective why it can be a little frustrating interacting with the man sometimes on the forums, but without the man it would be global and no one would want to be here so on balance its not something to complain about, just highlight in case you guys don't know why some people get upset with the interactions.
its very difficult for me to discuss this, because it's very easy for me to put a toe over the line and break the forum rule relating to interacting with mods and gasps, suffice to say iether my perception of reality is concerningly inaccurate, or the general mod or gasps responds to strong complaints with ongoing pushback. For me I would have some sort of forums strategy, and I would use the mods and gasps to gather feedback and channel it towards supercell (or pretend to if one was being cynical). I understand that there is no direction, but I think there should be. If people feel heard, there tends to be less toxicity, I think.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tomville
anyway I like my forum account, and it's way to easy to put a toe over the line, even if not intended, so unless I have something of significant value to add I'm going to jump out the window (figuratively).
Agree with a lot of what many of you are saying I've lurked and postd on these forums for yrs, and I remember feeling so sad when Holps quit the forum at one stage, there was a thread and everything! But you came back as many others could, if, as you say, SC turn their heads back to improving and fixing their original game instead of focussing on their new child (BH) and neglecting their original child the 5 year old main base. I know the new child brings much joy (revenue) but the original needs attention, serious attention.
Regarding the forums - yes I'm here every day and the last couple months has been the same old complaints and outright toxic behaviour (much of it by those defending sc's (action/inaction) it's become as boring as BH gameplay attacking the same old bases ��.
I feel like while we are forum users are responsible for the "vibe" of the forum, SC is responsible for how we react on here by the way they update their game, or "ignore"the many issues. I know when another person comes on here complaining about problem x which has been complained about a hundred times with no fix by SC I tend to either not bother replying in the thread (so I am not being helpful or contributing because if SC doesn't care, I don't care) .
Bottom line- the game creator SC having a "I don't care " attitude towards their games issues makes their forum members peeved off and not give a stuff either. Now they change/revert things in their latest update without telling us,they change GUI for Android tablets, Nerf Clocktower making us THINK they're money hungry. Even if that is false the fact they'd do something that even creates this perception means they do not have a PR division. For a multimillion dollar company, that just sucks.
TLDR: SC themselves are responsible for how forum reacts, and for the most part what I see is a "I don't care anymore" attitude by many on the forums. I still care and many others but you can't ignore the feeling there is.
This is the most mature reasoned discussion I've seen on here in a long lurking time, so maybe there's hope for the forums still.
Great posts btw Holps.👏
Other GASPs have said the same and I believe you, but there IS a very different impression given when reading the posts on the forum. I don't think there's been a huge amount of real vitriol directed at the BH, but there's plenty of grumbling. And when there's one post in a thread going against the flow and saying how wonderful the BH is with almost tigger-ish enthusiasm - it's often a GASP. The same happened at the time of the TH11 update: the posts on the forum gave a very strong impression of the badges defending the update. In fact one GASP in particular at the time was so visible everywhere stating the opposite of what 99% of players were stating that I think he was causing huge problems and really stirring things up the toxicity. There's not many times I would remember what a particular forumer was saying 18 months later, but his attitude made me angry enough that it stuckQuote:
Originally Posted by Tomville
GASPs do criticise SC: the ones who lurk in the clan wars section have been noticeably uncomplimentary about SC's efforts at war MM. But the ones in main section give a different impression.
Why the impression as an outsider reading it should be so different to what the GASPs think they are doing is an interesting question. There's certainly some self-selection of GASPs: at least a couple have resigned their badges because they felt it would be improper to say what they felt with an official badge.
I suspect there's also a tendency for people with badges to at least slow down on their criticism. You mention Fette: I have seen one post from her criticising BH, but only one. I've seen dozens from other GASPs saying they like it. So although GASPs may not be under any instructions, any sensible adult will be a bit more careful what they say if they have an official badge and that may introduce some bias.
Wwaaayy back in time, the forums were a heck of a lot different. sure people would come in to complain about things, but it was not as frequent nor as persistent as it is now. there were people who would write some really funny stuff, like the "letter home, written by the barbarian." of course there were disagreements, that is inevitable. but they didn't tend to overwhelm the place.
In my opinion, or estimation, or whatever (forgive me, it is 4:30 am and I am long overdue for sleep) you want to call it, the turning point coincided with SC letting the confounded youtubers deal with update news instead of directly dropping sneak peaks here. It made the whole update release process a lot less personal, took away from the small connection forumers feel we have with SC, and a seemed to make updates a whole lot more geared towards business and giving favours and viewers to their free publicity peeps.
I don't even remember when that practice started, in my recollection it was a sort of slow merge, but as soon as the youtubers started to take over the update leaks, people stopped excitedly checking in everyday to see what was coming, and instead started anxiously, nervously, impatiently wringing their hands waiting for the ball to drop. Kind of like Plinko.
The latest update releases were even less personal, with SC just dropping unheralded content around all willy-nilly (after letting a priveledged few have the keys to the new Prius first, of course- this faux-elitism does not help much either). I appreciate the attempt to suprise us as novel and fun, but it just doesn't seem to be working.
Tl;dr:
daily sneak peaks let people do their moaning and groaning in advance, made us furomers feel special and possibly helped keep a lid on the overwhelming complaints.
Stop feeding the youtubers who don't even play the original CoC anymore, and bring back the sneak peaks please.
Edit: I don't consider silly cartoons of a hog rider and a wizard on a boat to be sneak peaks. Those did nothing more than build the hype hope we all had.
Is it a coincidence most of the replies here are by long term forum dinosaurs? ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by henryqg
Waiting for Saleh to chip in now
Some excellent points here Viking, though a couple of points are probably needed :-Quote:
Originally Posted by Vikingchief
1) Holps has already commented on his position as a forum moderator.
2) The shipwreck/boat was first found in the AP files in late August 2016 (if my memory serves me right). Thus, we can assume that design and development of what we now know as the Builder Base, probably began much much earlier. I'd suggest at least 6-12 months earlier, hence your "6 months of developer time" is probably more like 18months to 2 years.(imo)
Some of the evident frustrations seem to come from the timeframe mentioned above.
We realise that a huge amount of time, effort and planning has gone into the Builder base, and rightly or wrongly, players are hypothetically asking......"If only......?"
A broken trophy system and clouds.
War matchmaking, and the evolution of engineering that even the casual masses are engaging.
Cheating , in all it's various forms.
"If only....."
Personally I don't think the forums are anything near the post December 2015 toxic mud wrestling bath that many of us had to endure.
I think Darian's input has been most welcome, and where possible we do try and quote his input. This has been a great help for the forum. However, as Onyx has rightly stated Darian or any other CM's , are not employed to help steer the ship.
The forum is a vessel allowing opinions and discussion to freely float, but ultimately the levels of reaction stem from the Development team alone at SC.
Real life attests to consumers and customers satisfaction being a direct result of the actions of those at the top of the tree.
I still have hope!:thumbsup:
This... not a forum veteran myself but been seeing a lot of toxic threads myself. I thought it was always this wayQuote:
Originally Posted by Tomville
Sometimes I wonder if the "Infamous Dec Update" was the "Beginning of the End"
Absolute fantastic post, and I agree with this invisible merge with tubers releasing sneak peeks. Could it be SC got in on that train because it possibly generates revenue for them? But yes they are using tubers much more and the forum even less, need more proof? SCs new game Brawl stars-(they call their players "Brawlers" *cringe*) doesnt even have a forum section. Could SC be trying to seperate themselves more and more from the forums.? They already appointed people from the forums (our current mods and gasps) to oversee the rest of us...its as if the form has become increasingly isolated from SC.Quote:
Originally Posted by stinkypete
I also have noticed faaar less "for fun" threads being started lately on the forums. Even a year ago there were lots of these, these days it has changed to mostly complaint threads. This is entirely SCs fault unfortunately as I explained in my previous post.
unfortunately the long time players have long lost all hopes of SC ever fixing anything: clouds, wars matchmaking and how is it possible that the "timer bug" is still alive after all these years? that's border line criminal since your pay (with real cash/money) for time in this game and the game cheats you on time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Holps
In no way, shape, or form are the forums as negative as they were in Dec 2015. That was a level of rage that will probably never be seen again. There was so many raging, angry, cursing threads that the mods were completely overwhelmed and couldn't keep up. Kinda like watching a structure fire. Exciting to watch, but sad to see it happen.
The threads on the BB are generally negative but it's more apathy than anger that we see expressed.
What is wrong with the forums now is they are boring and just plain not interesting. After 5 years it's just hard to discuss or get excited about something we have done so long.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Holps
While I agree with most of what you say, I do have a question.Quote:
Originally Posted by Holps
Is "jumping" these new posters a bad thing? I must admit I have been one of those "Please use this sub-forum" guys while providing them with a link on where to find what they're looking for.
If every new poster knows where and when to find the right sub-forum, won't that eventually - if done by a large enough population - improve the forum and result in more active sub-forums?
I wouldn't mind not commenting like I do now, in fact I would only do so and only did such because I thought it would be appreciated and supportive of the sub-forums.
Please do tell if you think it's for the better to leave those posts alone and instead keeping the thread in General having a good discussion on it.
Word. Only thing I can add is the CT nerf really sealed the deal for me and a lot of others. I'm barely hanging on here. I don't want to quit, but it has become the only realistic option now for true f2p.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vikingchief
Quote:
Originally Posted by Krastor
Agree with most. But I don't think today's issue is apathy. It's more disappointment and frustration that SC didn't address issues in the TH base. People are still very passionate about the game and there is no lack of emotion.
But for the most part the forum is no where near as toxic as Dec 2015.
the great fiasco update of December 15.... that's when I got 2 of my 3 infractions in the forums 😅
I play the builder clash on one of my accounts, its similar in the sense you just find the easy path in the code and exploit it. Baby drags rule for instance...just got mine to 10 and with some skill it's almost not fair.
Anyway. To answer directly its a seperate game almost needs a seperate section like wars, ideas, whatnot
I joined just as that Dec update dropped, solely for the purpose to express my distaste for not the removal of sniping but like many could see "what would happen to the economy".
Then with the radio silence people became angry (I did then and I will do to this day blame Supercell for how the forums exploded).The toxicity to some point was inflamed by this and passionate people (as it was passion for the game) became so frustrated that they had no direct link to any answers ,even the Mods after a few days went from being talkative to just closing threads .
The whole forum lost direction and I don't believe it simmered out until around march of 16.
Now to the BH base
I think it's a different feeling, it's not the silence that has affected people I personally believe it's the take it or leave it attitude from Supercell that is upsetting/angering people.
I can't remember an update thread be unstuck so quick as that did.
Also when you have such BIG updates, one's that not only included removal of sniping(a way a very large amount of players played this game), the addition of a side game/ETC, I think threads are merged to quickly .Take this update, we had a feedback thread for the June balancing update the day of release, now how can you give feedback when at minimum it needed 7-10-14 days to give feedback, but any other thread started about the update just got lumped in there EXCEPT anything to do with builder hall base (that seems to be allowed to be spoken in as many different threads as possible), maybe something the mods need to look at.
The BH base needs is own sub forum, to me that's a no brainer(this would hopefully stop the annymossity that rages between the "I like/I don't like" , same as Clan Wars has its own sub forum.
We are told this is our forum to discuss how the game is for us, how we see the game, but even if we do this in a polite and correct manner express dislike on something then it no longer becomes our forum but Supercells (I do know they own it in not that fickle)
Comparing the 2 updates for me personally the Dec update will always hold a nasty taste for me as it was when I started to understand that we mattered very little and as shown by the take it or leave it attitude of late enhanced even more that sentiment.
Whom can bring these forms back to a pleasant enjoyable experience? I'd stick my neck out here and say the moderators !
They need to cut some slack when big updates drop, don't be so quick to merge threads, close threads because one person is trying to flame/troll/derail the thread (yes abide by the TOS but at certain times they themselves need to sit back and just think as a former and not a moderator, then do what is needed or not).
Lastly of late a couple of GASP's seem to think that their badges are more than that (I always and still do believe that their badges should be game specific coloured or titled to said game) I'm not saying this with any malice towards them, just like the moderators they to could do with forgetting their badge and remember being just another forum member that is hand selected by moderators, (Unless they are game specifically titled it sends mixed messages to newer members).Onyx covered the Dec part of this and I can see it happening here. And just reread his post a couple of posts up and he's wording towards it (though of the same thought) come across a bit more to the point of what I was trying to say.
tl;;dr
Never will the forums be as angry as Dec 15, moderators just step back and wait just a bit when these big updates drop, GASP's do the same and food for thought about making them game specifically titled.
And give BH base is own sub forum.
Here's the biggest issue. These forums may be toxic at times, but they also have a large number of great ideas. All companies should be so lucky as SC as to have such an engaged community. The problem is that SC completely, 100%, shuns their community and its ideas. The original CoC designers/developers created a great game, and got lucky with some design choices (i.e. TH sniping), which made the game into the massive success that it is. The designers/developers responsible for Dec 2015 and everything thereafter have not demonstrated the same talent as their predecessors.
But this could be OK. Why? They have a great forum here, and many people have provided solutions to this game's ills. Mastermind's quests for example. Many great ideas for clouds, war MM, and so on. In EVERY case SC has completely ignored the ideas here. Even the impacts of the Dec 2015 update were thoroughly anticipated before it dropped. Are SC employees that much smarter than the thousands of people on the forum? Or is it the reason that I have posited: SC's master (Tencent) is directing SC to do everything possible to harvest as many gems from its customers before the game dies?
1000's of people are smarter than a few dozen. There are bad ideas here, natch, but the community is exceedingly good at muffling those, and floating the good ones to the top. If I was a game designer, I would have employees leveraging the ideas here to make the game better. It's the cheapest R&D you can imagine. Unfortunately, SC has proven for years now that nothing we say here will make a whit of difference. We can b*itch at each other all we want, if that makes us feel better, but expecting a change in SC's behavior as a result is an exercise in futility.
tl;dr: Has any company in the world more thoroughly ignored it's community more than SC? I say no.
Apathy is the love child of frustration and disappointment alot of times. Or it is to me and alot of my fellow th11's who I communicate withQuote:
Originally Posted by Jwp721
I am so happy that this thread has been a great discussion, with lots and lots of great points.
For me I personally think the forum is worse state now than Dec 15.
Although I think there was a lot more anger back then in my view it wasn't AS toxic as it is now. Just a lot of venting over getting rid of a game mechanic that arguably made the game so popular.
I really do feel that by not giving the Builder Base its own specific forum SuperCell have missed the boat. By admitting that it is infact a separate game within the main game and creating its own forum space, would solve a few of the issues.
But I think it's more a case of disappointment now, that after so long in the developing that they released an unfinished game with issues left right and centre. For the record I don't mind playing Builder Base, I just feel so let down that so much time has gone into something new that is broken, when so much could be done in main CoC.
I am further worried that because there are so many issues with Builder Base, they will continue to throw 'quick fixes' ie. extra level defences out there while they spend time trying to sort out Builder Base.
I think all this disappointment and the likes has stopped many a good forumer posting threads, firstly because they simply might not want to anymore, and secondly because they are afraid their time and effort to write said thread, will either be buried or merged.
TL;DR
IMHO - Seperate forum space for builder base. Concentrate on Main Village. No more Gear Ups (yet) get the main base right before releasing anymore BB content.
#MakeTheForumsAndGameGreatAgain
I sorta "knew" it was the beginning of the end, because December update was bad even on paper:Quote:
Originally Posted by MinasTirith
- By killing th snipe, a lot of casuals felt forced to quit the game becuase they relied on the passive economy and they needed the free shields (by removing casuals, the social side would suffer);
- The "sniping/free shields" meta was unintended, but it wasn't something broken in dire need of a fix. Fixing broken stuff should be a priority over "vision";
- The guard system is more often seen breaking something (clouds, anyone) than being useful;
- patch notes almost spread misinformation when they started telling people that climbing was good. The idea was making climbing a good thing, but it failed at it - miserably. The partial bonus system made barching on lower leagues even better (less people barching because they believed on SC and thought they were "adapting"; way less people on lower leagues crushing our bases looking for wins). Being on a high league is nothing but a way to ensure you will be 2 starred as soon as your shield goes down and you need to attack with expensive armies that take longer to cook - that is the "league bonus";
Most of those things were predictable on the first sneak peeks and a lot of people tried to stop it with arguments. People used the greatest logic rule of mankind: "defends trees, must be a tree". Except for one push for crystal for gems, I never th sniped, but I knew a ton of casuals relied on free shields and sniping generate more loot for the game. The change wouldn't give us nothing good and it would hurt millions of players/thousands of casual clans that made this game a small part of pop culture. You didn't need to "wait and see". People said, even on youtube videos: "wait and see, you have to adapt" (they adapted by quiting/playing clash royale - I'm still here, not playing clash royale).
Back then, I didn't take a break because of the update itself, I took a 2 month break when someone from SC said that wasn't a bug with dead bases and that felt a little bit evident, despite the small sample size, on day one. A couple months later, they fixed a bug affecting the appearence rate of dead bases and I returned.
I didn't need to adapt. I just had to sit on lower leagues, upgrading my th10 like no one's business and I seldom was 2-3 starred (I followed a spreadsheet that involved zero losses on the math. It never failed). I did collector raids, droppers put me back on gold/crystal. TH10 was the easiest th for me by far and I didn't miss my free shields because I never needed shields on th10. Having 2 infernos was enough to worth a skip on "collector raid land".
Summary:
- They removed free shields - I didn't need shields anymore
- They "promoted climbing" - collector raids on lower leagues were better than ever
- Game had a lot of problems before the dec/15 update - update didn't touch them, created new ones and made some worse.
- It made a lot of casuals quit, huring the social aspect of the game. Well, even some people telling us to "adapt" quit eventually.
Tl,DR: It might sound hyperbolic, but december/15 update was the worst update I ever seen on a videogame - and by a significant margin. It didn't solve problems and created a lot more. Also, it looks like dec/15 update took a lot of time to be made, which is a factor when you have a small team.
BH update, followed by CT nerf update pales compared to that.
This isn't even close to December update. The Mods pretty much gave up after a month. It was raw passion for the game, IMO, that drove the anger. At the time, too, people thought that they could change SC's mind over the decision- at least pre update & for about a month afterwards.
I will say tho, based on the numbers, the upset on the forums did reflect the numbers in game. You don't lose 1 billion dollars (half your previous year's revenue) in one year without upsetting the majority of your gamers.
I agree with so many long posts in this thread it's even too much to multi-quote. Lots of great points & respectful counterpoints.
I don't hate the BH update, but it certainly feels like there's much less focus on the main village by the SC team. As a result, I'm suffering from forum apathy too. I'd prefer forum posts about the BH be separate. My love is for my main village & it's disheartening to see these threads diluted or drowned out.
Not to blow smoke, but Holps' first post here really laid it out for me, especially the need for attention to the looming problems in the main game (war mm, clouds, clan bonding, etc.). I think it would reinvigorate long term players if SC made some grand gestures to address those, even if not initially perfect. Imo, posts in the CoC forum would improve greatly in tone. At this point, it's a morale thing for many here. Small tweaks we can't see aren't enough. I want to keep loving this game!
Good Lord Im so happy to see this from a moderator. Other than the incessant whining the whole mini-mod thing is what i hate the most about this forum.Quote:
Originally Posted by Holps
I think the hype surrounding this update was on par with the Dec update. Both seem to have been huge let downs for different reasons. I am indifferent towards the BH. I find it hard to truly strategically deploy considering I find the pathing of the troops to be all over the place. In my experience at least. The matching is just as screwy. I haven't gotten into it but am nearly a maxed non gemmed BH 4 (minus walls that's it). Personally, the criticism I have is it was good initiative on SC's part but bad judgement.
The March 2016 war update that gave birth to engineering probably didnt help the forums out either. I remember reading the release notes before that update dropped and thinking "Have they lost their ever loving minds????"
Here I come ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Godzilla86
What a great thread to see talking about 2 interesting topics: BH & Dec disaster!
Going back to Dec 2015, it wasn't just the update content & changes but also how was community treated & how issues were addressed. There was so much wrong with how the update was planned, executed & reaction from SC. For example, they could decrease shields per snipe then later on remove it gradually or decrease league bonus for snipe by 50%. Instead they decided to go with full destruction mode. Triple hit in one update! No shield, no bonus & less actual league bonus for attacks that used to hit 50% & stop!
With BH update, SC did a better job in terms of communication by having Darian interacting. Although answers weren't as we want or not detailed enough but that was still way better than Dec update. Personally, I enjoy BH now more than when it landed. Still would love if they fixed issues or added another way to play the game. The issues are well in known in both villages:
- TH:
- Clouds: over 1 year since I got into legends because of one time facing 8 hours clouds
- Engineering: I opt out of wars as much as I can due to those wars with 2 or 3 extra th11s with max heroes....
- End Game Content: I felt left out for months after maxing out since 2 other things I can do as a max th11 were &
still bugged
- BH:
- Strict Loot Cap: After 3 attacks there is no reason to attack once you get to 3K. There should be something to go
after getting the 3 attacks above 3K
- Too little clan interaction: What to do with your clan when in BH? Currently nothing but chat. There is a lot that
can be done & a the social aspect has been suffering being ignored for a long time now
- Mono-Mode pushing: We really can't do anything but push in BH. We should be able to do something else.
Something that is relaxed & still rewards. Something like a challenge(events) with no trophies in return but just
resources
I'm waiting to hear from Darian & SC about is happening next. What are they going to focus on next? Fixing or adding? BH or TH? Clan or Individual?
Quote:
Originally Posted by bhavyamamgain
I think the general forum would significantly improve if fresh spawns weren't allowed to create threads.
Heh.Quote:
Originally Posted by BaronScarpia
I take it you've never purchased an EA game before? :D
Seriously, though. Dec 15th is definitely not the worst update to any videogame ever.
There are updates for videogames where the community is near 90% in favor of it being terrible.
The best you'll ever get with the Dec 15th update is about 50/50.
For every person hating the update, there was another loving it.
No matter how deeply you personally hate it (and you're certainly allowed to hate it as much as you'd like) it doesn't change the fact that there are people who personally liked the changes and thought they added to the game's gameplay.
Same seems to go with BH.
No matter how much anyone dislikes the BH upgrade (and they're certainly allowed to hate it as much as they prefer) it doesn't change the fact that there are people who personally like the BH and think it adds good strategy and gameplay to CoC.
With these facts in mind, it's quite possible for the Dec update or the BH update to be your personal worst update in any videogame ever. But it simply isn't possible for 'everyone as a whole' as the facts simply disagree.
Definitely seemed way worse than 50:50 to me. There were quite a few forumers ok with the new system too, like alex (cant remember anyone else). But we dont have the numbers so I'm not sure how you got your 50-50 in the first place. Although the changes SC made after that update to 'alleviate' the loot problems (increasing PBT, getting loot cart) seem to suggest they screwed up. Compared to the current clock tower nonsense, Dec was way worse.Quote:
Originally Posted by ColdRaven
What EA games were there that screwed up?
The problem with BH was no one expected it, no one was clamoring for it, and none of the other "issues" were addressed.
If BH had been slipped in as a "non major update", people would have mostly loved it. ( maybe along side a revamp of trophy system, war MM, or other general bugfix, or additional end game content )
Depends what video games he has played to be honest. The poster you replied to used the statement, 'the worst update I have ever seen on a videogame. There is absolutely no way you can say his opinion is wrong because in his mind , it is the worst.Quote:
Originally Posted by ColdRaven
Just look at the global threads. I don't go on global, mostly because of the American children there when I started the game. But the global threads were never ending, it was a huge problem. I don't remember when SC said there would be no change, 6 months ago? But they finally made the change & there have been fresh spawn accounts made just to thank SC.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rephren
As you say, the never ending threads are there because it's a problem. Once a certain kind of thread gets repeated over & over, it should be a red flag for SC, rather than the recent meme of, "Forumers represent a very small % of the gamers" which recently has been repeated over & over.
let's promote bh in clan.. so new mode call "team battle " come to us.....
Totally agree with thisQuote:
Originally Posted by 2222
You're right, we don't have the numbers.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kurotsuchi
You remember it one way. I remember it another.
50/50 seemed fair.
Plus, we know that the number of people playing CoC didn't get cut in half. Of course, those who disliked it didn't have to actually quit over it... but the numbers barely declining any more than should be expected from a 3-or-so year old mobile game (at the time) seems to indicate nothing more than a general 'meh' in regards to people really hating the update.
Can you name one that didn't? They all seemed to require patches for game-breaking (non-playable) issues.Quote:
What EA games were there that screwed up?
Mostly their non-sports-games, actually.
SIMS (any version, any expansion...)
Dragon Age (mostly with the expansions)
Games like that.
The point isn't that EA is bad specifically (although I personally find them to be a terrible gaming company.)
The point is that updates for games exist where the game becomes unplayable for the entire community. In these cases... it's generally 90%+ of the community that hates the update.
With CoC, it's no where near 90% hating the update. Much closer to 50% and it would be difficult to argue higher. I'd even say lower... but, as you say, we don't have access to the actual numbers.
Game completey unplayable vs. a significant number just 'not liking the changes' is clear that "completely unplayable" would be higher in the "worst update to any video game ever" category.
This is subjective though as a lot of players might have deemed the game completely unplayable to them by taking that snipeQuote:
Originally Posted by ColdRaven
away. :D
Yeah I've noticed that as well.
From one old man to another old man let me tell you this. I've always said sc has horrible communication with its player's. No one else in my clan comes here for the reason you posted.Quote:
Originally Posted by Holps
The new community manager has shown he is interested in us. Hopefully he doesn't become like the other 2.
I Will be the loudest supporter of sc if they get their act together. The new communication with every player on main village is a step in right direction. The forum is a very small % of players.
I don't believe that sc reads all the negative post. Would like to see the proof they do. I'm sure you will tell me it's not my place to see it. I will probably come off as the bad guy. I figured it's above my pay grade.
Hopefully they will not kick you into the tall grass. You will be lost forever remember to leave a trail of beer cans.
You can talk to the important people at sc let them know if not for us they wouldn't be the monster they are. Later much hate towards the war problems
the general forum is not worse than ever
after every update we see many threads with complains from people who don't like this or that
you call them complains, i call it feedback
the so-called "infamous december update"? i was far far from TH11 at the time, i was not really a TH sniper, so i adapted
today i see more BH threads than i would like, i would like more improvements to the Main village, to the social aspect and something to revive the clans...
but do i hate people posting about BH? NO
BH here to stay, so again, i adapt
don't agree with some posters who say that new spawns should not create new threads
we all have been new spawns...do we need them make 100 posts now to be able to ask a question?
Personally, I don't think anything will top Dec 2015. This update was widely hated but it didn't seem as bad as then.
There were 2 other times I remember when there was lots of hate... july 2015 (i think) with the big hero nerf, and december 2014 (i think) wit the big loot system change. Loot system ended up being for the better i guess, i dont see any loot complaint threads anymore...that was a biggy back in the day.
but yeah, dec 2015 was just horrible...i didnt mind it cuz i was one of the haters lol
The problem with wanting constructive discussion on the forum is that we have been down that path and ended up with literally none of the problems the community has deemed important fixed or even attempted to be fixed.
As someone who has visited the forum consistently for the past year, I've seen a decent number of threads with constructive discussion regarding engineering (oh SO many threads...), clouds, farming, troop balancing, etc.
Instead of it leading to any attempt or successful solution for these problems, we got the BV and more levels for cannons. So why try anymore? It really feels like the game isn't going to change anymore based on what the SC forum community care about so might as well give up on trying.
It certainly is as I'm here now and wasn't there then :smirk:
It seem a bit stale and a lot less funny, entertaining posts .maybe people are just burnt out ,i know I'm not playing as much since the latest update
I have no plans to gem BH base to 6 and there's not much since in gemming village anymore either . our last war was alot of just Hohum attacks and resulted in a loss draw by a narrow percentage with no chat what so ever , usually its alot fun just chatting at the end of close war , idk but something seem amiss through out the game imo.
Sc don't listen to players. They just do what they beloved utubers and forum moderators want.
Bhb is coc2. You can deny it but it's same as coc1. You farm you push and still no war.
Honestly 80%+ of coc players play this game for war. You (utubers, forum moderators) don't accept it. I know but Im sure about it.
Focus on war and everyone would be happy!
They do what we want? I'm sorry but I have been begging them for a beer spell for years. They asked me what it would do and when I explained it just gave us free beer they weren't convinced. I will keep trying....maybe a Kebab spell if they won't budge?Quote:
Originally Posted by Sandbuzz
Not sure its worse as a lot of people are united with not liking the builder hall in my opinion vs Decemdate. That was the civil war of the forums. So many people united with excitement just to see the biggest line drawn in the sand I've ever seen.
Brother killing brother, mother sunning child, Decemdate was the bloodiest of them all. Ok, I'm going overboard with the details here. More like threads being wiped left and right. People being banned everywhere. And we are still talking about it today like it was legend. What an update, WOW!
Builder hall update feels like a bunch of drunk sports fans that just won the championship and is looting everything vs Decemdate. That was a war. See this scar on my chest, got that during Dec 15 baby. Got hit blindsided by a 13th sneak peek. They just wouldn't stop with them. Instead of attacking at once, it was wave after wave of sneak peeks. Some were so weak it wasn't worth calling it a sneak peek, but that was their plan. Make us wait and it worked well, at least til the bloodlust starting kicking in. O, the carnage. Every night I try to sleep, I heard the cries of the casuals. "Nooooooooo, we won't progressssssss."
Ok, I'm gonna stop now because this is turning into a great novel and I'm getting carried away with the Legend of Decemdate here.
No Way, the forums are down right calm compared to Dec 2015.
There was so much passion about the game back then
Just look at how controlled the whole game is now, you cant even loot in the BH game, lol
its the new generation of bicycle helmets, padded play grounds and everyone getting a trophy for effort, haha
Out of that, I think Sc has better control over the forums now and puts more effort in communication.
The current players seem to like this new way of play and the forums reflect that
Time has shown us that the game changes made 2015 has forever changed this game and the thrills and excitement of that time are gone.
in with the new out with the old, time shows all things
Bilius left the forum because he realised he is bashing his head against the wall. Bilius was a content creator with a purple badge for a while and was one of my top 3 admired people on this forum. Once he realised that this forum has zero chance to change SCs mind about something they have decide to do, he quit the forums. What a loss that was. I was very active on the Boom Beach forums in its heyday and I was one of those telling SC they are neglecting their game. They didn't listen and look how far that game has fallen. Their forums is a ghost town compared to what it was. Slowly but surely the clash forums seem to be following suit. I hope not.Quote:
Originally Posted by sinfiery
You got banned for your rule breaking. No one ganged up on you, lots of individuals gave their personal opinions that just happened to coincide. If you cannot behave like a civilised person, civilised people will say you're not welcome.Quote:
Originally Posted by FisherLipstein
This account will be banned too. Not because of anyone else but because you broke your word, the one that you gave when you said that you"d abide by the rules.
What is not subjective is their revenue went down by half. With CR, their revenue was just slightly more than the year before & CR had a billion in revenue, so COC's revenue was down by about a billion. Watching the daily numbers, it was on pace to go down again by at least another 1/2, why they needed the revenue push. So far it's worked. Idk about this new trophy system, but I suspect that once enough ppl are there to hold it intact, the whales can stay at the top winning & losing against each other, gemming non stop to keep battling. In a discussion today, just about everyone in my adult clan is done with BH, even our whale who gemmed to B5 at the start. It will be interesting to watch the #'s at summer end. Although if adults are done with it, I'd think the kids are too. As long as the whales stay busy idk how much it matters.Quote:
Originally Posted by evertonjeff
Quote:
Originally Posted by FisherLipstein
My criticism of the bb is that it's "hot garbage" and a "dumpster fire" and that's just my opinion and not really the point. I'm still here and have not been banned. If you've had a forum account banned it's because you repeatedly broke the rules
I'm all in for a kebab spell! It should come with free soft drink :smirk:Quote:
Originally Posted by Holps
Not, you moaned because you were banned from the game, not for the first time, for being incapable of playing nicely with others.Quote:
Originally Posted by FisherLipstein
You admitted as such but were being precious, demanding SC tell you precisely which of the many offensive things that you'd said was the one that got you banned.
I remember the forums before December 2015 and it was most definitely a better place. Even after December 2015 up until about a year ago or so much of the conversations were far more civil and informative. Informative I think is the key word there now it's more about ranting and arguing. You can still find informative threads but you've really gotta sift through the negative ones to find anything worth while. There have always been some trashy threads but nowhere near as much as you see now and in the past 8-12 months unfortunately.Quote:
Originally Posted by Godzilla86
Yea I know someone is gonna counter this post with something like "it's supercells fault for making the game so bad" but that's just not a reasonable argument in my opinion. The game has gone on much the way it has for almost 5 years now... constant additions of new content free to play. Coc is arguably the best it has ever been right now. Sure it's not perfect, it hasn't been nor will it ever be perfect but there is more content and depth in coc than there ever was right now and it'll continue getting bigger and better.
The forums used to be a haven for useful info and rational debate but it's just not the same anymore. If you want to start a thread or even ask a simple question then be prepared to be attacked. Just a day or so ago I opened a thread that a new forumer had started to ask a very simple and pretty valid question and he or she was immediately attacked and insulted by forumers that have all been around for awhile. The op replied with something like "well this will be my first and final post on these forums". But that's just one of many trashy incidents I've noticed lately... a real shame.
Great thread so far. Agree with many of the thoughts already posted. IMO the forums are nowhere near as bad as the Dec '15 update, and another thing to keep in mind was SC got hit hard on not just the forums, but on Facebook / reviews and even some news articles as well back then.
IMO a couple of mods being active in the feedback thread helped a lot this update. Back in Dec. it did seem like mods tried for a couple of days and then gave up and just stopped posting and handed out infractions and shut down threads with very little provocation and no communication, which made things much worse. Speaking of no communication, why did SC bother with a community manger if he is going to disappear after updates? The thing that made the Dec '15 update so bad was SC leaving for a month afterward and just letting everything fester. It's disappointing to see they haven't learned from that.
My disgust with the BH base is what it represents. SC spent so much time investing in an update very few wanted that instead could have been spent on the major issues that nearly everyone can agree on like clouds, matchmaking, cheating, etc... To me this seems to just be SC telling us no, we don't care about those things, if you don't like those things play BH. I've invested so much into my main base over the last 2-3 years, and seeing SC seemingly just write the main base off feels like a punch to the gut.
generally, someone creates a forum account to complain about an update that made them unhappy and a lot of times, when in this situation, it's hard to be 'construtive', so being a 'negative place' is in the very nature of this forumQuote:
Originally Posted by Holps
that said, the forums reflect the state of the game so it's supercell's fault that this place is like this. you shouldn't, therefore, expect the forums to be all happy and stuff when the game is broken and has many unsolved issues
hold on, it's you guys who incentivize this kind of behaviour when you move a thread when someone creates it in the wrong sub, so you shouldn't say people who do that are wrong, I mean, a lot of times they're only trying to be kind with you by doing your job for you....I mean, you should thank them, shouldn't you?Quote:
Originally Posted by Holps
I can't see how anyone including Supercell is surprised by the vitriol posted on the forums. The company took a serious left turn out of the blue and created a Candy Crush mini game nobody wanted: https://forum.supercell.com/showthre...ame-developers The unspoken fear by many is that the temptation will be too great for them to just cut and paste features from BH to war and gate it all behind a massive Builder Hall grind. Tossing TH11s a bone by adding more levels just adds fuel to the fire. Many gaming companies get off kilter with their loyal long term player base. Time will tell if they can make corrective changes and get Wars back on track or if Builder Hall marks the point in time where CoC jumped the shark.....
about the 'radio silence', I just want to share this image with youQuote:
Originally Posted by Goonerwinone
http://i.imgur.com/eL6XnDj.png
I used to come on the forums everyday just to read. I did this for years. Now I might come on a few times a month, not to post just read. The game has gotten VERY dull. I used to think something awesome was going to come after all the grinding and finally maxing. I'm maxed, and it's boring. Just plain boring. Wars are boring, pushing is boring. It is what it is.
As far as the builder hall, the nicest thing I can say would be I don't like it. I'll leave it at that.
Also, as a positive note, I will add that I have enjoyed the game but part of that enjoyment was how engaging the game was.
Finally, maybe Darian could answer this one, why on earth haven't they embraced something like a quest system where you can do something with your clan? Royale 2v2 is AMAZING.
Dante's inferno discusses his descent and what he seen as he went thru the nine levels of hell. If he would have went down one more level he would have encountered the builder base I'm sure of it. Lol just a little light humor. �� Or maybe not
The forum after the December update was a lot worse.
At that time the moderators were subject to some appalling abuse both on the forum and by private message.
There was also 2 distinct groups on each side of the update who seemed to hunt in packs and all dive into every thread where even the slightest variation in opinion from their own was pounced upon. This is not happening now, instead there is a quiet air of resignation and acceptance over the parts of the updates that people don't like.
To me though this is worse, at least back then there was passion for the game we have all grown to love. Right now I agree there seems to be an air of resignation, I dislike that a lot because once people stop caring eventually they will fade away. Along with the game.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rst
I really hope it doesn't I have met some great people through this game.
But yes although people were more angry back then, right now for some reason this just feels worse to me.
We need a Builder Base subforum.Quote:
Originally Posted by evertonjeff
We really do.
Agreed! I'm tired of seeing all these posts about the bb in generalQuote:
Originally Posted by PhilISuppose
I think you can attribute this to the Dec 2015 update and the lack of communication that followed coupled with the fact that despite all the anger that came from it SC still stayed their hand.Quote:
Originally Posted by evertonjeff
I think that was the moment forums thought they could affect change if they showed enough anger, once you have been shown that it's futile, the powerlessness will lead to an air of resignation if a new update you strongly oppose comes along.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PhilISuppose
If the purpose is cleaning up the forums then a "constant whining about latest update" sub-forum would be more appropriateQuote:
Originally Posted by strandwolfza
but they can't simply make a sub for complaints, I mean, if they did that, they'd also have to make a sub for "praises" or else they'd only demonstrate biasQuote:
Originally Posted by Holbomb
Interesting choice of words, resignation, that is exactly what I feel. Not just from the candy clash add on nor the bad mm in war and everywhere else, but from SCs complete lack of customer service and how they ignore what we send in emails to support and send back babble that usually does not even apply to what was said. I am so resigned, and saddened that I said goodbye to my clan tonight and deleted CoC off my phone. I got tired of hearing just hold on from support, tired of hearing people smash me and others for pointing out the glaring errors of this game. I guess I need a break and have decided to take it. This post, helped me see what I was missing from the game - the human social element - and respect - especially from SC. Thanks for all the years of lurking, I learned alot - hopefully SC will come to its senses and I can come back soon!Quote:
Originally Posted by evertonjeff
It is probably just a feeling I have at the moment, which hopefully will pass, but it seems every year at this time we enter a Zone, similar to a TwilightZone. It was the same last year with the EU being on their extended holidays. No response except that we could expect updates. Which we thought were to happen in Sept. but really ended up being in Oct.
It was Sept. that the dev team began their work on the "boat" but nobody knew what they were working on. There was a lot of speculation concerning the direction the game should take. The forums were active between then and just here recently. Active membership during that time averaged around 16k with a peak of just over 22k before the "massive" content drop in late May of this year. Currently we are struggling to maintain 15k.
Yes, yes active membership fluctuates. Myself, like many others are finding the main game tedious and are not "turned on" by the new content that was suppose to take the game to new heights. I just daily check with my accounts, collect and then jump over to Reddit to get the latest skinny. Then come to the SC forum which is getting tiresome also.
I agree that a architectual change is necessary to these forums. Navigation is somewhat convoluted and in some instances circular. The overall feel/look and skin are much preferred over Reddit.
It nice to here that forum change is on the way, so Lach says.
https://forum.supercell.com/showthre...6#post10560576
I don't know that I've ever agreed with a mod more than I do with this. I feel the reason the forum posters constantly lash out instead of constructively discussing the game is because we all feel the developers have ignored us every step of the way so people just have a "idgaf" anymore attitude now. IMO all of the negativity started with how the initial clashcon was handled and the December update threw gas on the fire. It's just slowly gotten worse and worse since.Quote:
Originally Posted by Holps
As for how things are now, I think the BH has a lot to do with it. It was the last straw for a lot of players. My clan has lost 6-7 of our most active players since the BH release. CoC really stopped being a heavy social game in December 2015 but now it's saddening how little activity I see. The forum is about the same.
The most fun ive had in the past year besides the training glitch was when baby drags and miners were introduced. New troops is what this game desperately needs to get people excited and playing again. Not just a new troop or 2 every 1-2 years but 2 new troops every 6 months. It would keep things fresh and constantly keep the meta evolving. That will mean more work for devs but IMO they've had it too easy for way too long anyway. There's your dev bash Holps haha.
Completely agreed, in Dec 15 people still had the passion, now its just us diehards still here debating what the heck is going on and why very few people care anymore. Once apathy sets in, the game is toast.Quote:
Originally Posted by evertonjeff
Krastor nice one, hehe that abominable builder base..
And I doubt you'll see the Builder Base get its own sub forum guys..wanna know why just imagine the place, tumbleweeds and broken Windows, dying battle machine on the ground, a few crushers falling over and crushing the archers happily waiting for the block on their head. Itd pretty much a ghost town, SC don't want that reality.
Nowhere near as bad.
I think Dec 2015 was just when I started so can't really comment on its state.
I don't really see the forums as a terrible place, there are discussions, ideas and criticism like any other forum.
First priority should be how to fix clouding, I've never bothered pushing knowing I might be waiting hours for a match.
I was never really disappointed with BH, although I do think it lacks social content (multi-player?) and needs to have a better link to main base.
The update was far from bad although the only thing I hated was the captains logs and no sneak peaks, all the hype was most likely the cause of discontent.
It is pretty simple, really. There are a few glaring problems that needed fixing, but instead, they created something completely different that probably adds on to more problems. When you are not happy with the game and the direction it is taking, you either quit or you seek to improve. Add a little anger to it and this forum turns into a cesspool of complaints.
I suppose it is a matter of preference. BH got me back interested in clash, and I enjoy reading BH threads personally.Quote:
Originally Posted by evertonjeff
Bh, feom what i have observed, while new and exciting brought with it a lot of frustration to an already largely frustrated end game community.
I find my self as a fairly end game player a little disenchanted at the changes given what many of the players like myself are possibly wanting is seeming further and further away.
From what i see, a lot of complaining or negative comments stem from end/late game play issues.
Many here see that the issues have been discussed to death and yielded no result, that's upsetting for many im sure.
So when a new person to the forums come it's a easy mistake for us long time people to just shut them down with "wont ever happen" or "been discussed before" or "wrong subforum".
as issues continue to be discussed and not resolved i think it makes us more on edge as a community, and makes us a bit more hostile than we usually would be.
thats just my thoughts though. Could be way off haha