Rushing your TH9, I'm bored

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Originally Posted by resnullius

seriously. if you think TH8 is boring, will access to a few new defenses and more troops suddenly change the game for you?

i don't understand this at all.

rather than rush ahead, where you're relatively weaker than other people of the same TH, why not enjoy the fruits of your "labor" by staying in a lower TH for as long as possible? You'll be relatively stronger compared to everyone else.

Maxing your TH seems like a no brainer. Rather than upgrading your mortars as TH9, when there are other things to upgrade and loot penalties/more difficult competition, you could upgrade now, when you're close to cruising through the end of TH8 and your base is likely strong enough to absorb attacks even with one mortar being upgraded.

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In terms of defensive power this is not correct. You will mostly get raided by TH 9s if you are a TH 8 anyway.

Your mortars are a lot less important for your total defense when you have built all the other defensive structures you get at level 9 than it is when you don't have 2 crossbows covering the loss. The important part is getting them to level 5 when they one-shot level 5 archers, but the max level is 6 at TH 8 iirc, and that can just as well wait imo.

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Originally Posted by PumpJacka

There it is, the xbow. Bro, just upgrade, it's cool. Xbow makes no difference when it's surrounded by low level walls and non-maxed defenses. You'll def. have a harder time defending yourself while you save up for those pretty Xbows, especially from competent players who aren't in such a hurry.

You think you're bored now, wait until you get that maximum loot penalty where you're forced to hit only TH7 or TH8 players. Not sure if you know this but, this game is built on impatience. Like a previous posted already noted, you've made up your mind so play how you want to play. Just don't start a thread complaining or asking what a good TH9 loot range is after the fact, because it will certainly fall on deaf ears.

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Of course it makes a difference. Do you think Any TH 9 would hesitate attacking him because he is TH8? Two crossbows make a difference. Trust me. The extra cannon and the extra tesla makes a difference (smaller, granted, but still...) as well (if I remember the new buildings correctly?).

Your defensive power increases. It's your attack-power you should worry about. Some players obviously struggle at TH9, but that's not because they get raided more - it's because they are having troubles with raiding TH8's. The players successfylly raiding TH 8's are not the ones that complain about TH 9.

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Originally Posted by Horus40k

It's one reason I'm not rushing to upgrade the barb king, he sleeps longer and it takes a builder to upgrade him

Not for me. I have more important upgrades to be doing....

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Agreed, but I am gaining DE steadily, so I need to use it on something, so I figured that a few more minutes ain't the whole world.

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Originally Posted by ActionMonkey

I'm making perfect sense. You just missed the point. I know that you will make money at aproximatly the same speed at level 9 as you did at level 8 if you entertain a certain playstyle (using all, or almost all of your troops every battle) and if your ability in attacking can keep up with the increased demands on your level of skill. With a decent level 9 base you will also lose a lot less cash when you get raided.

20 more troops tips the scale when you attack most level 8 TH's if you know what you are doing. It also tips the scale for some level 9 town halls for me, and I am far from the best CoC player I should think.

I also see a lot more TH 8's with 180k + of both resources than I see TH 7's at 90k +, but thats probably depending on rating.

I also have more fun. I like attacking with big armies and I like to see a TH 8, and a few TH 9's here and there, in flames from my archer/barb army supported with just a few giants and wb's. I also like to see my crossbows in action. And I like the 25 extra walls and the other extra defensive structures as well.

That was my point.

and yes, I upgrade my walls while I wait for my upgrades sometimes (when i have a builder free and an almost full treasury). That's another luxury I can allow myself at TH 9, no one have gotten more than half of my gold or elixir in weeks, most of the attacks against me take less than 10k resources from me, the really successful (happens once every 2-3 days maybe) get maybe 80k or so, so I am mostly a 180/180 target these days.

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So your point is if you play inefficiently at TH8, then TH9 will net you the same amount of resources in the same time. Ok then. I'm not sure that's a great argument, but it is probably accurate.

With a decent level 9 base you will also lose a lot less cash when you get raided.

You can remove "level 9" from that statement and it would be just as applicable.

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Originally Posted by ActionMonkey

Of course it makes a difference. Do you think Any TH 9 would hesitate attacking him because he is TH8? Two crossbows make a difference. Trust me. The extra cannon and the extra tesla makes a difference (smaller, granted, but still...) as well (if I remember the new buildings correctly?).

Your defensive power increases. It's your attack-power you should worry about. Some players obviously struggle at TH9, but that's not because they get raided more - it's because they are having troubles with raiding TH8's. The players successfylly raiding TH 8's are not the ones that complain about TH 9.

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You're thinking like a typical premature TH9'er and missed my point entirely, which is: people rush to upgrade for the xbow(s) and typically neglect their other defenses and don't take into account how much more difficult it is to obtain gold/elixir thereafter.

I don't really care if people do it, after all it's just a game. The OP posted his logic and asked for advice. The majority of posters recommended he max his base first, he seems to want to do otherwise. But don't think for one second that a rushed TH9 is going to hold up or have any advantage over a strong TH8.

Rushed upgraders THINK that having 1 or 2 xbows makes their bases impenetrable and/or will cause 99% of the attackers out there to hit the "Next" button. Half of them aren't even thinking of the extra tesla or archer tower. What you're not considering is the big picture, and that is the overall defensive posture of a base and the loot penalty as previously stated.

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Originally Posted by ActionMonkey

In terms of defensive power this is not correct. You will mostly get raided by TH 9s if you are a TH 8 anyway.

Your mortars are a lot less important for your total defense when you have built all the other defensive structures you get at level 9 than it is when you don't have 2 crossbows covering the loss. The important part is getting them to level 5 when they one-shot level 5 archers, but the max level is 6 at TH 8 iirc, and that can just as well wait imo.

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if you're focused on defenses alone, your point is well taken. i'm sure x-bows make a difference. i still don't see any reason to wait until TH9 for an upgrade you can do at TH8. you have plenty of new things to do at TH9, why add more upgrades?

in any case, on the offensive end, i think you're very wrong. personally, i play this game to attack bases, and score gold, elixir, dark elixir, or even trophies. having the viable option of attacking TH7 without a loot penalty seems huge. i don't know what range the OP is in, but finding 1 in 10 TH7s to attack seems wrong if he is farming for resources. and TH7 bases are especially attractive because a TH8 can use level 5 troops AND there can only be two storage containers for gold and elixir.

at the end of the day, though, if he's bored as a TH8, he'll likely be bored as TH9. so if he wants to rush through on his way out, more power to him.

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Originally Posted by dahimi

So your point is if you play inefficiently at TH8, then TH9 will net you the same amount of resources in the same time. Ok then. I'm not sure that's a great argument, but it is probably accurate.

With a decent level 9 base you will also lose a lot less cash when you get raided.

You can remove "level 9" from that statement and it would be just as applicable.

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No. Sorry. You missed it again. Deliberately this time I suspect. But I don't mind.

I had no problems getting resources at level 8. I have no problems getting them at level 9. I could not upgrade my defense faster than I am currently doing (unless I gem my builders, which I don't do on a regular basis. Or severely hamper my total defense, ie upgrading 5 defensive buildings at the same time).

And again no. You can not remove level 9 from that statement. Unless a TH 8 is close to maxing his base I can generally get his cash. At a point where a TH 8 is close to max defense the upgrade to TH 9 and the new buildings will make the base to strong for anything but a very expensive attack.

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Originally Posted by PumpJacka

You're thinking like a typical premature TH9'er and missed my point entirely, which is: people rush to upgrade for the xbow(s) and typically neglect their other defenses and don't take into account how much more difficult it is to obtain gold/elixir thereafter.

I don't really care if people do it, after all it's just a game. The OP posted his logic and asked for advice. The majority of posters recommended he max his base first, he seems to want to do otherwise. But don't think for one second that a rushed TH9 is going to hold up or have any advantage over a strong TH8.

Rushed upgraders THINK that having 1 or 2 xbows makes their bases impenetrable and/or will cause 99% of the attackers out there to hit the "Next" button. Half of them aren't even thinking of the extra tesla or archer tower. What you're not considering is the big picture, and that is the overall defensive posture of a base and the loot penalty as previously stated.

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Funny that you presume to know me well enough to know how I think. Also funny that you call me a premature upgrader. In which way were I premature in your opinion?

I lose very litte resources when I get attacked. I win almost every attack. And I usually score somewhere above 260k in total resources on my attacks. Sometimes a little less, but sometimes more as well. I use a fairly cheap army consisting of archers, barbarians, 5-8 giants and 5-8 wall breakers. Set-up depending on mood. Now, please explain how I am a "premature TH 9er"?

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Originally Posted by resnullius

if you're focused on defenses alone, your point is well taken. i'm sure x-bows make a difference. i still don't see any reason to wait until TH9 for an upgrade you can do at TH8. you have plenty of new things to do at TH9, why add more upgrades?

in any case, on the offensive end, i think you're very wrong. personally, i play this game to attack bases, and score gold, elixir, dark elixir, or even trophies. having the viable option of attacking TH7 without a loot penalty seems huge. i don't know what range the OP is in, but finding 1 in 10 TH7s to attack seems wrong if he is farming for resources. and TH7 bases are especially attractive because a TH8 can use level 5 troops AND there can only be two storage containers for gold and elixir.

at the end of the day, though, if he's bored as a TH8, he'll likely be bored as TH9. so if he wants to rush through on his way out, more power to him.

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I'm sorry for sounding like a broken record, but I have no problems keeping afloat. At all. I guess I could keep burning my gold on walls forever, but aside from that, if I actually upgrade buildings, I can't spend gold any faster unless I gem building times.

Thank you for a polite post btw.

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Originally Posted by ActionMonkey

No. Sorry. You missed it again. Deliberately this time I suspect. But I don't mind.

I had no problems getting resources at level 8. I have no problems getting them at level 9. I could not upgrade my defense faster than I am currently doing (unless I gem my builders, which I don't do on a regular basis. Or severely hamper my total defense, ie upgrading 5 defensive buildings at the same time).

And again no. You can not remove level 9 from that statement. Unless a TH 8 is close to maxing his base I can generally get his cash. At a point where a TH 8 is close to max defense the upgrade to TH 9 and the new buildings will make the base to strong for anything but a very expensive attack.

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Just because I don't agree with your point doesn't mean I'm missing it.

Sure you could upgrade faster. Do you have 200 skull walls yet? Your walls are only limited by your capacity to make gold.

Base defense is also not about making it impossible to get the cash. It's about making it not worth going for the cash. You do not have to be a maxed out TH8 to make your base unattractive to someone looking to farm it. I just stick my TH outside my walls and I'm making a bet weighted very very heavily in my favor that someone will take it out before someone else comes along that will want to make a very spirited attack on my base.

I hit next on TH7 bases all the time because attacking them isn't worth it to me. Why drop all of my troops on some TH7 with purple walls and three level 5 mortars protecting their storage, when there are plenty of targets out there that are so poorly defended that it only takes a fraction of my total army to loot them?

Even if you do manage to clear them out, they are going to get a shield. They will then make back the 200k you took from them in a single raid. They can also do more raids per hour than you because they can attack easier targets for more resources using less troops.