My Investigation into the Newspaper Issue

As many players have already reported, supported in part by screen shots posted in another thread, there has been a significant pattern of rehashed or stale ads in the Daily Dirt. When a level 7 player is selling 10 nails for 1 coin, has over 2000 followers, and daily visit record of 50,000 or more, this is not to say that such things are impossible, but they are HIGHLY improbable, therefore suggestive of a major bug in the "fetch" sequence of Hay Day's code, or evidence of some compatibility issues between Hay Day's code and that of jailbroken devices.


Before I record my own results of investigation, I am calling on the newly arrived Community Manager to address this issue as our "advocate" by maintaining proper communication on the following:
1) Is the Hay Day team aware of this bug/problem?
2) Is this currently under investigation (especially since it was reported as far back as May of this year)
3) What would be the reasonable timeline in expecting this to be resolved?


As we know, this bug presents a considerable problem for some players who rely on the Daily Dirt as part of their game-play, and given SuperCell's stated interest in ensuring proper "game flow," it can be argued that this bug/problem impedes said flow, therefore making it of some interest to them to resolve.


THE INVESTIGATION
As a test, I decided to follow a player whose ad for one grey sweater had recurred at least three times in one hour. It was posted at 44 coins. Of course, when I visited, the item was gone. That is fairly common with either high value items, or common items sold at discount. Upon the third posting of the ad (identical to the previous two), I saw the ad repeated twice in the same issue. It was then that I decided to use one of my remaining follower spots.


The farm was untended; the animals had not been "harvested," and there was no evidence of any activity at this farm. That is not enough in itself to prove anything since some players leave well enough alone and focus solely on selling items.


I parked myself at this particular level 9 farm (with its improbable statistics of well over 90,000 daily player visits record and 335 followers), periodically returning to the Daily Dirt to see if this farm was posting an ad. After a few hours, and having parked myself at the farm where there was no activity in placing a sale item, I saw the same ad in the Daily Dirt. I quickly tapped on the farm to return to where I had parked, no grey sweater available for 44 coin.


In order to ensure that this wasn't simply the player releasing another grey sweater at the identical price on multiple occasions, and I simply just missed seeing it, I repeated the experiment for two days with no difference from the above results.


CONCLUSION
At best, I can only speculate as to the cause of this bug/problem. The high number of daily visits would most likely be on account of the repetition of the same ad in a short time period, most likely refreshing with every issue, and in different batches concurrently (as different players are exposed to different sets or batches of ads). The vast majority of farms that come under this particular anomaly have evidence of inactivity. Anecdotally, I saw one such farm whose name was "Happy New Year 2013!" (which is not enough to prove anything definitive, but does give us pause to consider that there are "ghost ads" in the Hay Day server being reprised). Without access to the proprietary code of the game and its internal server algorithm, I cannot fully verify the anomaly. In going forward, and as a fan of the empirical method, I would encourage other players who have experienced the same problem to repeat this experiment.

Thanks for your post. I'm trying to figure out the reason of those ads too.

I would like to add my observations from playing the game, hoping this can help understand the issue.

I have friends from both game Center and Facebook. My friends from Facebook usually disappear for a few days and reappear with their shop full of stuff. They are usually at low level, given they don't play much. Today, when one of them was there, flagging the boat for help and I was looking around to buy stuff and help her, her avatar changes into gingerbread in the Need Help tab. When I visit the farm, the exclamation mark is on the gingerbread but no sign of withered tree, boat is not interactive. Seconds later, she is gone from my friend bar.

If someone like my friend advertise and for some reason, Hay Day and facebook connexion is lost. This may be why the ads keep posted in the newspaper. Until the next time that person use the roadside shop, there is no need to login to facebook again.

UPDATE: player can access newspaper and roadside shop with no GC nor FB connexion.

Hi Meonhoc, thanks for weighing in!

It may be possible that this is a GC/Facebook connection issue. Players might be connecting via GC or Facebook, log off, but there's some kind of bug that doesn't disconnect them properly from Hay Day, which might create a perpetual loop. So, if a player advertises an item, logs off for a week, Hay Day's servers might still record the player as still connected somehow and responds by just rehashing the same ad. Not sure if the problem is with GC, Facebook, or Hay Day's servers, but it is certainly worth looking into!

This is a very sophisticated game and one I enjoy very much - for the most part. I cant believe that the developers of this game, cant fix it so that when someone buys an item, it disappears. I am so fed up of constantly turning the pages of the newspaper until the "new edition" only to find that everything that I need seems to be there......and appear to be available....until I click and then suddenly I get the message "someone already bought this item".

Now I am starting to think this is a key part of how the game has been set up. Sudden shortages of key items.....never available. "Buyers" who sometimes buy everything in your farm shop.......but they never have anything to sell.

Make it difficult and challenging.....but play fair too.

Please game developers - I will get frustrated for a few times, but then the game will be deleted. One player lost isn't a great loss I know, BUT....I think I am fairly normal and average and I know of at least two more players who are towards the end of their tether, and I am also quite sure that that translates to a large number of players.

I certainly empathize! I know that there are some quick fingers out there, or that other players get access to the paper edition microseconds before others do, but I also wish that the item would not be visible for me to click on just to receive the message "this item has already been sold."

I actually experienced a very strange bug with that recently: I wanted to buy 10 popcorn, got the "item already sold" message, clicked away to the farm, came back only to see the exact same popcorn in the same place! Clicked again only to see "item already sold." I repeated that seven times! I think that is a refresh issue (either on my end, or HD's servers).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Diane89031

...for the most part. I cant believe that the developers of this game, cant fix it so that when someone buys an item, it disappears. I am so fed up of constantly turning the pages of the newspaper until the "new edition" only to find that everything that I need seems to be there......and appear to be available....until I click and then suddenly I get the message "someone already bought this item".

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This is exactly how it works and you can't get around that no matter how annoying it is. The newspaper loads with selected ads. That edition then stays up for 3 minutes. Despite being purchased during that 3 minute interval, the ad for an item will stay visible in the paper for the remainder of the 3 minutes UNTIL a "new edition" appears. THEN that ad will be removed from circulation because the item is no longer valid.

There is no way to program so that the newspaper drops an ad instantaneously at the precise second an item is bought. In order to do so, the paper would have to refresh several times per second and that's just not feasible.


@meonhoc: Excellent observation and theory that makes a LOT of sense in regards to servers and internet connectivity. I hope they are able to look into this and see if there is a fix to be made.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FarmerBob

Before I record my own results of investigation, I am calling on the newly arrived Community Manager to address this issue as our "advocate" by maintaining proper communication on the following:
1) Is the Hay Day team aware of this bug/problem?
2) Is this currently under investigation (especially since it was reported as far back as May of this year)
3) What would be the reasonable timeline in expecting this to be resolved?

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I would like to know this too, especially the 1) and 2).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FarmerBob

It may be possible that this is a GC/Facebook connection issue. Players might be connecting via GC or Facebook, log off, but there's some kind of bug that doesn't disconnect them properly from Hay Day, which might create a perpetual loop. So, if a player advertises an item, logs off for a week, Hay Day's servers might still record the player as still connected somehow and responds by just rehashing the same ad. Not sure if the problem is with GC, Facebook, or Hay Day's servers, but it is certainly worth looking into!

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I logged off of FB and GC. Now I can only access farm of people I follow, my helpers and my followers. i'm still able to use the newspaper and the roadside shop. Still, the problem when a friend disappear when they are not connected through facebook may be the source of those ads.

The problem might come from the processus of how an ad is pulled out of the newspaper, can be a bad synchronisation too. Possible sources of problem:
- not enough memory on end device -> Hay Day crashes
- unstable internet connexion
- ...


One of my follower got an exclamation marks sticked for hours. She's at low level with quite clear land and very few apple tree. There is no chance I cannot spot the withered tree. The exclamation mark only disappeared when she logged in again (I know because there are new stuff in the shop).

Note that when we are not connected to GC or FB, our avatar is only a ginger bread.

The plot thickens! I would love a response from SuperCell to explain this one:

I have seen the same ad for the past three days by the same player (5 creams for 95 coins). The player is at level 7 with 234 followers, and somewhere near 67k daily visitors. Of course, when I get there, the cream is gone (at that price, who wouldn't go for it?). But here is the odd part that I just can't figure out: if the same ad by the same player has displayed for the past three days, how can that player's statistic for daily roadside stand revenue be 0?

Anyone able to explain this one?

Roadside shop unlocks at level 7, player should have put whatever they got in the shop, cream at their level for example.

The question is WHEN the revenue per day is modified ? Is is AFTER the player collect coins or AFTER buyer buys cream ? Seller must be away after put things up for sale and never return to collect the coins (people download application, try it for a while and delete it from their iDevice).


EDIT: it is AFTER the player collects coins from the shop.

Meonhoc, I think you have given us the piece of the puzzle we were looking for!

Now, generally the daily visit record and roadside sales record changes every 24 hours (depending on the player's time zone).

If the player never comes back to retrieve the coins, deletes the app, then this might be interpreted by Hay Day's servers in a different way, so it goes into an infinite loop of posting the ad EVERY cycle!

This would explain how these "dead farms" at such low levels can have astronomical visit records of 50k-100k+ since the ad is simply being recycled because of an internal loop error. We, as "live players" are exposed to the attractive ad over and over again, and rush to get it (only to be disappointed). A certain number of players will add those farms to follow (thus explaining why a level 9 can have 1000 followers).

So, apart from awaiting confirmation from the Hay Day team that this is the cause of the compromised Daily Dirt, this issue just requires a tweak on their end to stop the looping, and possibly clear their server of now inactive farms.

I believe the problem come from abandoned farm with ads going on too. Later, if the player return and level up, they keep those stats with them. That's how we got level 15 or later with strange statistics :)

I'm more interested in the number of ads and the number of players reading newspaper at the same time. We all know we don't have the same version of newspaper and not the same number of ads on iPad and iPhone. What happens when there are not enough ads for everyone ?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FarmerBob

Now, generally the daily visit record and roadside sales record changes every 24 hours (depending on the player's time zone).

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I'm not quite sure player time zone has effects on the stats. I know for sure the Wheel of Fortune comes everyday at 0:00 GMT (2AM if GMT+2, 20PM the day before at GMT-4 and so on). This forum is GMT time zone too (4 last lines at the bottom of the page). Farm in Hay Day may follow GMT Time zone, time set on their server :).

I do see stats change few minutes apart, we as passer-by staying a little longer in their shop can see the change in:
- Most player visit
- Follower count
- Likes count

EDIT: I got proof of how the visit is counted. To be short, 1 player visits a farm 3 times in one day can be count as 3 visits.

FarmerBob,

My apologies for posting just to make a simple comment, but my am I impressed by how formally and well worded you wrote your initial post of this thread. I had caught wind of this ghost ad business in recent weeks as I began to speculate why I kept missing items put up for newspaper ads. But I was never as close, or definitive as you were with your deduction. Bravo. I hope it is investigated (haven't read the rest of the posts yet) and solved.

I should also probably note that the first month or two when I first started playing Hay Day, I had either a GC friend or followed farm, maybe one or two back then, whose farms were flagged as needing help but when I repeatedly returned to that farm there was no flagged boat crates or trees needing revived. I haven't really seen it since but can't tell if it happens without my being aware.

Also, FarmerBob, I have been having difficulty adding forum moderator AussieBob to my Game Center friends list -- where I have all of my Hay Day friends through. When I got AussieBob added separately on Facebook, logged onto Hay Day, added him via the Facebook connection, I lose him from my friends list if I Disconnect from Facebook while still in the game. I play it exclusively from my iPod Touch 5G. Perhaps the Facebook connection issue should be considered with the notion of having, or trying to have all friends through the Game Center. It is my understanding that no matter what, the GC and Hay Day are always connected. But then that leaves Facebook out of the loop, so my observation is obviously flawed. Perhaps there is also an unrelated issue or two with Game Center. Who knows. :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Diane89031

This is a very sophisticated game and one I enjoy very much - for the most part. I cant believe that the developers of this game, cant fix it so that when someone buys an item, it disappears. I am so fed up of constantly turning the pages of the newspaper until the "new edition" only to find that everything that I need seems to be there......and appear to be available....until I click and then suddenly I get the message "someone already bought this item".

Now I am starting to think this is a key part of how the game has been set up. Sudden shortages of key items.....never available. "Buyers" who sometimes buy everything in your farm shop.......but they never have anything to sell.

Make it difficult and challenging.....but play fair too.

Please game developers - I will get frustrated for a few times, but then the game will be deleted. One player lost isn't a great loss I know, BUT....I think I am fairly normal and average and I know of at least two more players who are towards the end of their tether, and I am also quite sure that that translates to a large number of players.

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(see the bolded text above) My thoughts exactly. I've made due for quite a while over my tenure of about 5 months, but it seems that ever since the addition of the fishing grounds it has been more difficult to generate or procure Land Deeds. My patience with this will come from diligence in hoping to find someone else I have friended who is selling them, or they are randomly generated on my farm, because I only have three more plots (fishing grounds only) to unlock then I won't need deeds.

It's the question that's been asked on numerous times, people have taken the time to upload screen shots, but there's not been any response to it. That adds up even less in my book.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FarmerBob

The plot thickens! I would love a response from SuperCell to explain this one:

I have seen the same ad for the past three days by the same player (5 creams for 95 coins). The player is at level 7 with 234 followers, and somewhere near 67k daily visitors. Of course, when I get there, the cream is gone (at that price, who wouldn't go for it?). But here is the odd part that I just can't figure out: if the same ad by the same player has displayed for the past three days, how can that player's statistic for daily roadside stand revenue be 0?

Anyone able to explain this one?

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by VolfsBayne

FarmerBob,
I have been having difficulty adding forum moderator AussieBob to my Game Center friends list -- where I have all of my Hay Day friends through. When I got AussieBob added separately on Facebook, logged onto Hay Day, added him via the Facebook connection, I lose him from my friends list if I Disconnect from Facebook while still in the game. :)

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That's normal. Facebook friends are not GameCenter friends. They appear in the same friend bar but the game need to be connected to facebook to retrieve your facebook friendlist

Well, there is one thing fishy though. I noticed the pattern changed at first, after the first topic people were complaining, to get better and now I realized: first one is king but it doesn't only go for goods, it seems that there are 1 or 2 ads that get displayed just for you and to which, when time passes, more people are exposed to.

Always when I open the paper, first nails, sirup, god knows what, I can get. But only always 1 time. Then the rest of the paper is empty.

Explain to me how that is possible, especially if you'd get a truly fresh paper when you login, which you don't. It only seems this way. Think of it, is there every second a new paper being generated somewhere that you join? Doesn't seem likely that this is a stream, or a queue that you would immediately get through. Imho, these are messages passed around (zeromq or something) and they can, and will, inject ads in between other ones that other people get.

This very much looks like tampering to me, a lot does. They're pretty good at it as well, its hard to spot but eventually you see the pattern of 'trying to screw me over' reoccur everywhere in the game. I'm also fairly sure it knows what you need/don't need (almost always vegetables/bacon/eggs...unless you need them). Anyway that's a whole different subject, but the whole generation of items is *not* just a bug caused by dead players, I assure you that.

I agree this gets very annoying!!!!! I looked for cacao beans for hours today and none were there. I got Tom and he found me some and then of course some showed up in the DD. But of course they were gone already. The funny thing is I have noticed that the ads in my DD almost always have the wheel of fortune in it but yet it is a "NEW" ad. How does that happen? Ya, time zones differ but I am skeptical about this. Also many of the farms have Christmas decorations out. Now I LOVE Christmas and believe me I will redo my farm at Christmas but I don't think I will leave it all up until September.