Printable View
It doesn't seem odd to me at all that people take a mobile ap game seriously and want to win. There are much more egregious examples of winning at all costs, cheating, and sacrificing personal integrity in the process. It's life.Quote:
Originally Posted by Camja11
I disagree with you that it takes no skill to engineer, nor does it take zero skill to win--and they don't always get an advantage. But I do think it's unfair and should be stopped because it's not good for the game in the long run.
I have to admit, I've not got a ton of experience in engineering (in the game sense anyway), but how does it take skill? Since the earliest months of the game, offence has always been far more important than defence. Whether you have no defence or max defence, getting leveled and losing resources is a reality every player faces. Of course, a quick raid and whatever you lost is back in your storages and you can march along working on your base. There is no skill required in just not building defences. I bet I could find a guide on the process in 5 minutes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnnyfsullivan
Then that leaves the actual attack. What skill is there when a player 2 townhalls more advanced attacks another player? I just don't see the skill required. It sounds like for of an excuse and justification for the fact you engineered a war. I mean, I'm all for play however you want, it doesn't impact me at all. I just don't understand it. Could be my age. I'm old enough now to see the value of the struggle not just the result.
Try the war forum - post your clan tag, ask for help as to why you keep running up against engineered clans. There are some very knowledgeable posters there, both pro and anti engineering, who can probably help you out.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick0246
Short answer is, since October, you can generally avoid engineers by running a tight th range (say, th8 to th10) and not bringing any abnormal accounts yourself (mature .5s, defenseless, severe preemies etc).
Mindless lopsided engineering (skip defenses, go perma .5) is quite easy, and was rewarding from march to october last year. Since october (&prior to march) engineering EFFECTIVELY is not necessarily easy or intuitive, and almost every guide you'll find is bad. Engineering effectively involves a lot of effort for a small advantage. Small advantage per base anyway, put together a whole clan that's effectively hyper-engineered and you've got #6M. If it were easy to do, there'd be more than one #6M.Quote:
Originally Posted by Camja11
I am coming from this from a point of view of trying to understand this. And as I said, when you war with the majority of max/high level th11's you just don't see engineered bases at all.Quote:
Originally Posted by TankSinatra
The attacking aspect I think we all agree is a cake walk. Being a few town halls higher in offence is easy to see the advantage and it clearly takes no skill.
As for the base build up, I'd need to understand the justification on what takes skill there. Any solid war player has a decent to excellent knowledge of defensive war weights and how to minimize it. To take it to the level of near defenceless is so simple and skilless as all you do is just not build defences.
The part that I could see as being more challenging is making it all fit together as a clan. I have my guesses based on my clash experience, but have not done it in practice. On the surface it seems just as easy as the other aspects. I guess I'm hoping someone can help me see what I'm missing.
p.s. What is #6M?
i think there is a big assumption that people low on the map are attacking their mirrors.Quote:
Originally Posted by Camja11
do some folks do this? im sure there are.
my defenseless'ish 11 sure doesn't.
i'm within the bottom 3-4 on the map, and attack the top 1-4
either an 11 or 10 as required to win the war.
so in one part you are correct. if you are out there as an 11 attacking 8's... yeah kinda lame but i also laugh at the disservice they are doing to their clan.
on the other hand.. not everyone does that. therein lies the skill you were looking for.
But how is it skills when you have more attacks at the top than the enemy? Shouldn't the judgement of skills be based on who can accomplish the better attack/stars using the least amount of attacks? Yes, imo it should be. If you have 4 attacks on my top two and I only have 2 attacks on your top two shouldn't I be considered as having more skill because I took out your top using half the amount of attacks? It makes sense imo and when things tend to make sense they tend to be true.Quote:
Originally Posted by jobob145
If you're attacking down two townhalls you're probably doing it wrong, and fooling yourself that (based on mirrors) that your base is helping while complaining about how the overall match seems to always go against you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Camja11
As to the ease and effectiveness of defenseless, I encourage you to try it. You'll spend months building up a base that might fool you into thinking its an advantage (based on mirrors) but generally gets you overmatched at the top. This is the challenge of engineering, that it takes months, while the MM changes, and feedback is weak (as to whether its a net benefit or not). Consensus on the war forum is, defenseless and .5 (the easy methods) lead to ugly matches since October, now there are a ton of ex-engineers dropping xbows and infernos on their .5s. You don't have to take my word for it, just consider for a moment that you have no experience with these strategies but the people who do are saying they don't work.
#6M is the notorious #6ayMartians, clan with the longest win streak.
i'd say thats a totally different question.Quote:
Originally Posted by xXXCHRISXXx
when attacking a th 11 or 10 as i do, my position on the map is irrelevant.
my "attacking skill" is exactly that. my attacking skill. my star results for my clan.
you seem to be looking at it from a fairness/moral standpoint, in regards to the additional attacks at the top, which honestly i care nothing for.
i play how i want within the framework of the game. no amount of criticism or name calling (which some others do around here) will ever change that.
i play for my enjoyment, my clans enjoyment, my clans success.
other's opinions on how i should play are best directed at supercell, because they fall on deaf ears here.
i might have more attacks at the top because they allow it, and i chose long ago to recognize and accept it (my defenseless'ish account is approaching 2 years now).
i would quote the old saying "your mileage may vary"Quote:
Originally Posted by TankSinatra
we very much still are engineered, have been for quite some time, and are enjoying success as usual. nowhere near the level of the martians, but several .5s, defenseless, minimax, etc..
current war log has 3 losses in it.
https://cocp.it/tops/rhl
we are in the top 1000.
it still works if done properly.