I'm guessing SC has no interest in fair matches? making to much $ off engineered ?

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Originally Posted by ayih

So 1 in every 6 games it's unfair? That means you get fair (or in your favor) matches almost 85% of the time. You're complaining because you get an unfair match 14.28% of the time?

The forums shouldn't be used to vent your frustrations because your clan wasn't up to the task in a single war. Adapting > complaining

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There is no such thing as partial fair/freedom/justice: its either is or not.

The engineering clan wars debate will never be fixed, they are not doing anything wrong, if they match up against you a lot, then get better bases or move up a TH and youll avoid them, increase your weight

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Originally Posted by Johnnyfsullivan

Nerf’s suggestions for engineered bases / clans
http://forum.supercell.net/showthrea...17#post7861017

http://forum.supercell.net/showthrea...01#post7979801

http://forum.supercell.net/showthrea...82#post8067582

http://forum.supercell.net/showthrea...58#post8371458

http://forum.supercell.net/showthrea...24#post8371624

Billius discussion on the impact of Engineered clans and bases to the game
http://forum.supercell.net/showthrea...-and-Farm-Wars

Onyx view on Engineering
https://forum.supercell.com/showthre...84#post9272584

Seachicken view on Engineering
https://forum.supercell.com/showthre...53#post9304253

Sumosloth on Engineering
https://forum.supercell.com/showthre...ut-Engineering

Noctaire's blog on Engineering
http://nocsclashjournal.blogspot.com...-how-best.html

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Haha, Johnny to the rescue :) It seems he can find my threads before I can :)

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Originally Posted by JKL2207

Let's pose a question: If matchmaking favoured maxing, how many maxers would be in favour to adjusting the matchmaking to give rushed/premmies/engineers more fair and equitable matches?

Answer would be none.

How would one draw this conclusion?

Ever since wars came out rushed bases were seen as a liability, when you look at a lot of recruitment messages in global and even in recruitment sub-forum back then and even now you will note most of them had "no rushers/no rushed bases".

Even before wars came out, people who had rushed bases were social pariahs amongst the clash community simply because they played differently.

When was the last time or even the first time you saw someone posting a thread saying "SC please help these poor rushers/premmies we seem to be getting wars that are way too easy because these guys rushed badly?"

This notion of fairness only applies when they are disadvantaged for pursuing the path they went down and never the other way round.

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Not entirely true. From August:

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Originally Posted by nerfedname

Thanks. My idea is not about "punishing" engineered clans or "giving maxers the advantage instead," it's about crafting ways to provide fair and equitable matchups to ALL clans, regardless of their clan composition, TH levels, offense/defense progression, maxer/rusher, etc., etc.

I want a system where EVERY clan, even one full of premmie bases, can perform a war search and have some reasonable expectation of getting a match where, if their attacking skill is good enough, they have a mathematical chance of winning. Clan wars are one of the most enjoyable aspects of the game, and I think allowing the entire war system to transition to one of "everyone needs engineered bases strategically sprinkled throughout their clan" (which is the direction war is going currently) is HORRIBLE for the long term health of the game and player interest. No new players are gonna sign up for that ♥♥♥♥, and will quit by TH8 when they're tired of getting roflstomped by Grand Warden sporting defenseless accounts.

In my opinion, it is in supercell's longterm interest to reign in heavily engineered accounts to prevent war from becoming an exercise in spreadsheet operation rather than who attacks and DEFENDS the best. That or craft a system where they can match each other ONLY and trade perfect wars back and forth with their defenseless and no xbow TH11 accounts (they can all have 1000 tie streaks for all I care).

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I truly DO want a system where all bases are welcomed in war, lopsided, rushed, premmie, maxed, and everything in between. Since it's virtually impossible to find an exact clan match for every clan searching for war (with the same # of TH levels, hero levels, troops, etc.) there will NEVER be perfect matching, and I understand that, but it could still stand to be improved so that it doesn't overtly favor one progression path over another.

Note, the landscape has changed substantially since October (the thread I'm quoting was from August) and matchmaking has already been improved to rein in some of the advantage of heavy lopsiding. But I think further improvements can, and should, be made. :thumbsup:

War is matched to total clan weights its never gonna be perfect to its a fine line between an unintentional rushed clasher and an engineer so the fix has to not hurt people while fixing war algorithm. One possible solution would be to offer an advanced war search (increased search time) that you could search for a specific th breakdown with. Ex: a clan searching 6/4/30 would be able to search for clans with a similar breakdown and keep it close to even.

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Originally Posted by nerfedname

Not entirely true. From August:


I truly DO want a system where all bases are welcomed in war, lopsided, rushed, premmie, maxed, and everything in between. Since it's virtually impossible to find an exact clan match for every clan searching for war (with the same # of TH levels, hero levels, troops, etc.) there will NEVER be perfect matching, and I understand that, but it could still stand to be improved so that it doesn't overtly favor one progression path over another.

Note, the landscape has changed substantially since October (the thread I'm quoting was from August) and matchmaking has already been improved to rein in some of the advantage of heavy lopsiding. But I think further improvements can, and should, be made. :thumbsup:

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Excellent post NN! Your relative objectivity to the issue is ray of hope in this morass...

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Originally Posted by Billius

I don't envy SuperCell, there are no easy answers or choices.

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Don't agree. Weight tax is a simple solution. Every TH has a minimum def weight relative to the offense. Combine this with the previous top roster emphasis the problem is likely solved.

Other simple solutions are communications and statistics ( from supercell ) so you can avoid this via your roster.

SC has already set a precedent on "playing the game a certain way" .. TH Sniping for example.

While engineering can be viewed as both a legitimate base progression or a career focused on bullying.. does not matter. The fix is in the MM algorithm. As OP said, you can find fair wars with a little bit of elbow grease, and it is totally worth doing.

The engineered clan complaining about an engineered clan. ♥♥♥♥

most likely, the mismatch lies in:

Clan A
engineered, high skill, experienced, attacks are well planned, effective and uncommon base designs

VS

Clan B
not engineered, average skill, lacks experience against engineered, uses common strats (mirror, +1, -1, etc..), internet bases


However when they post here in forums. the only thing they report is engineered vs non-engineered.

Hope that clarifies things

Man, I've yet to hear a valid argument from engineers about why nothing needs to change. I cant be the only one, right? Am I crazy?