Boooo!!! Come on, Orange! I threw you a fat pitch over the plate! :)Quote:
Originally Posted by orangemojo
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Boooo!!! Come on, Orange! I threw you a fat pitch over the plate! :)Quote:
Originally Posted by orangemojo
giraffe what clan r u in? im from the clan F.D.S.K if you wanna arrange a war against my non-engineered clan.
Maybe I didn't explain it well enough then. This really is an example of how x.5 engineering can bust up the matchmaking algorithm. It’s not engineering in general that’s the problem; it’s the x.5 strategy and how it ranks out.Quote:
Originally Posted by VeeBirds
LG’s example has a #3 with a relatively new TH10 - The walls are mostly legos, maybe a fourth are skulls. The cannons, x-bows, ADs, wizard towers, archer towers…everything is TH9 max levels. The only thing about this game that is really TH10 - the owner has dropped his infernos and one is currently upgrading to level 2 (the other is level 1). His offensive structures have been partially upgraded, giving him access to all of the Th10 troops, but his troops are still TH9 levels and new troops (bowler, miner) are just level 1. His BK and AQ are 11/15.
Keep in mind - this player is ranked #3 on the clan roster. He’s really just a new, rushed TH10 (low walls) who dropped the new defenses. Now, let’s take a look at their #4 player; what is commonly referred to as a TH9.5.
This player has ALL level 10 walls. He has three x-bows at level 3. His heroes are 25/24. His cannons and archer towers are maxed for TH10 as are all of his offensive structures. The only upgrades he has left are ADs, AS, and wizard towers (which he’s working on now). He has NOT dropped his infernos. His troops are maxed for war - level 7 giants, level 6 on barbarians and archers, but level 6 max hogs, level 5 max valkyries, level 5 max golems, level 2 witches (TH10 max), level 3 hounds (TH10 max), and level 2 bowlers (TH10 max). His potions are also mostly maxed as well.
Their #5 player is not far off. He has two level 4 x-bows but has not dropped the third nor does he have the inferno towers, and he’s missing one cannon and one archer tower for his TH level. His cannons have been upgraded with the exception of one which is currently upgrading. He has mostly level 10 walls with some level 9 walls still there (maybe a 60/40 split). His BK/AQ are 24/22 and his troops are a mix of TH9 and TH10 levels as are his potions.
Their #6 player has almost more than half his walls at level 10, the rest at level 9. Most of his defenses are TH9 maxed, although he has 3/5 archer towers upgraded and 1/4 wizard towers upgraded and 3/5 cannons upgraded. (So…not all archer towers and cannons dropped either.) Offense is again a TH9/TH10 level mix with maxed level 6 hogs and maxed level 5 valkyries clearly being part of his attack strategy. Heroes are 25/23.
Just looking at these 4 games alone, you can see how they rank unfairly and present an untenable top for an opposing clan. The way they’re engineered, omitting infernos, x-bows, and even archer towers and cannons is very deliberate and very carefully planned.
Now - here’s the real kicker. I don’t think SC’s update is going to take these into account. SC says they’re going after “lopsided” games and none of these are extreme cases of being lopsided. They are typical x.5 games; a long time upgrade strategy that has been used to reduce war weight since the beginning of clan wars. A strategy that was actually strengthened in the last update.
I see this same problem in the wars I fight. It’s why I’ve started massaging the rosters I take now as well, in the hopes of getting something that even approximates a fair battle. I don’t do the x.5 thing, so I take some low level games (TH5/TH6) and have a defenseless TH8 and mini-max TH8 (only main defenses are teslas and cannons).
I think part of the issue is how close the boundaries are between a maxed game and a new TH level; close enough that the x.5 strategy will allow a game to rank lower than a maxed game of the next lower level even with a bunch of maxed structures.
This match-up is one of the very few I’ve looked into where the complaint was legitimate and you can really see the problem in the matchmaking algorithm. It is often still possible to win the matchup, in spite of underdog status, but you’ve got to be really good and, often, the opposing clan has to make a lot of mistakes. Having one or two x.5 games, or one or two defenseless/engineered games, isn't the real problem; it's an issue when a clan engineers its roster to include several, comprising half or more of the roster, as has been done here. LG's clan is definitely the underdog in this matchup and significantly so; I'd still put money on them to win, though, because I bet they're stronger attackers.
Engineering clans aren't taking a 50/50 gamble. Let's be honest, current matchmaking rewards engineers & punishes people who ignore troop/hero upgrades. The more lopsided you are in either direction, the greater the reward/penalty.Quote:
Originally Posted by KhalWarAngels
I assumed the 9.5s didn't have extra defenses. 3 xbows is definitely not what I'd call a 9.5 but that's a loose term.Quote:
Originally Posted by Noctaire
Then again, from #5/#6 downwards they are worse than max 9s defense power-wise
Plus: all their TH10 offense powers have nowhere to be effective because OP's clan has no TH10s
The worst thing you can have, is a max defensive base in war. It's weight is so close to a new TH level above it, that it will often be quote paired up with a TH above or a .5. There is ZERO reason to stay at a TH, once your defense is maxed and it shouldn't be before your offense is. You need to pace your defensive upgrades, if you want to max offense/defense at the same time. It takes planning, strategy and patience to create a good base, that is a benefit, not detriment in war.
Some people feel that maxing defense should give you and advantage. Well it does, in the farming side of the game. You will lose less loot/trophies if you have a maxed out base. BUT in war, it's the absolute worst thing you can do. I see clans all the time with a bunch of maxed out TH8/9/10s, that get matched up with a clan that has lots of .5s or newer THs a level above most of theirs. It's the way the game works. If you can't adjust and accept it and do something about it, then I don't know what to say, besides find another game that rewards maxing things out.
Should war be simply about attacking, or is the strategy of base building, knowledge of war weight, obtaining players with the right weight bases etc, also play a part??
Quote:
Originally Posted by Noctaire
Your analysis is forgetting a huge factor. The opposing clan has very weak offense in there middle according to your accnt.
A few th10s with th7 to weak th9 offense with low level heros.
The OP should stomp them because the opposing clans top will have to clean up what those rushed th10s cant 3 star.
The opposing clan is strong up top but very squishy in the middle.
Lol I see what you did thereQuote:
Originally Posted by orangemojo
i dont. its my clan. maybe hes afraid of our triple digit streak ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by URaTOWELL
You just don't get it do you?Quote:
Originally Posted by VeeBirds
Let's for one minute assume their #3 is rubbish. They have 1,2,4,5,6,7 which translates into 12 high powered sure kill attacks. So all our Th9 except the last one would be flatten.
Now, we have to triple 5,6,7 as well. Those are not some half baked 9.5s.
Can you honestly tell me this is alright with you?