how to change warden so he doesn't encourage spam!!!

right now, th11 is almost exclusively spam, which is for the most part low-skill. first witches (very cautious about gbs until nerfed to the ground), then valks, then bowlers and miners. none of these strategies are even that hard to execute, funnel+spells, very little planning for stuff like traps (maybe gbs with bowlers, but tome is a get out of jail free card for that, and they can survive a single gb, unlike witches.). This is barely noticeable at th10, with some bowler and miner attacks (valk attacks often carry hogs for defense sniping, which is still a lot better in terms of skill in execution.)

Warden currently buffs a standard amount of hp to all troops in radius, with full resistance on tome.

my idea would be to make it so he offers a larger hp buff to smaller groups. his current stats would apply to 163 space in his range (heroes count as 25, himself excluded), would be his current health buff amount (as per level).

His health buff per troop and would fall as the inflection point of a logistical curve (aka the center of it where it is steepest)

His health increase per troop would follow something more similar the function 1/x.

For calculations, I am considering the hp PER HOUSING SPACE of all units averaged together.

162.5 (163 since housing spaces are integral) housing space, 50% health buff to all units (lvl 20 warden), it is, theoretically, 8150% of 1 housing space's hp.

sparing myself from plugging in values, these are the equations:

total hp increase% (relative to avg hp per housing space of all units in aura): (couldn't insert, so same as one below, but not divided by x!!!)


hp increase for all units under the aura:Attachment 181426

(First equation divided by x). Y is % hp increase, x is housing space in aura at time.

Also, tome blocks 67% dmg (2/3) from all sources, and completely blocks eagle artillery.

Warden gets a second ability, Recall (insert less horrible name here)
after using tome (and after being dropped for more than 15 seconds), warden can be picked up and returned to your hand. double tapping his pic in hand while undropped toggles him from air to ground mode. he can be re-dropped, with a new tome ability, and current health, on the edge of the map (not in red area).

Important!!! any units inside the tome one time are not buffed (or in any other way affected) by any subsequent uses of the tome, excluding the warden himself (he always gets affected by his own tome) (so tome can't be used multiple times on a horde)
This allows him to be used with a small-ish KS, then picked up and re-dropped with a backend. the 15 second delay is to ensure his tome cannot be spammed for his own defense at the very end of a raid or something.

hope you guys like this idea!!!

note!!! having trouble inserting photos of graphs cause of post size limit, can only insert equations.

Too much. Didn't read

Based on title, all I think is needed is limit how much housing space he affects so he can't make 90% of your army invincible

Edit: I'm just a th9 so I'm not saying a warden change is needed as I wouldn't know, but if mass attacks are a problem, this is the solution I think should be implemented

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Originally Posted by NotTheRealPaul

Too much. Didn't read

Based on title, all I think is needed is limit how much housing space he affects so he can't make 90% of your army invincible

Edit: I'm just a th9 so I'm not saying a warden change is needed as I wouldn't know, but if mass attacks are a problem, this is the solution I think should be implemented

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It says warden gives more hp overall to less troops, less to more, tome defends 2/3 dmg. Warren can return himself to hand and be redeployed with a 2nd stage. Has another time that only affects troops not hit with the 1st tome. Will be way less useful with mass but far stronger with hybrid phase attacks

I got an opinion from one of the few th11s in my clan family. He liked my change ideas, but felt maybe the warden should buff a bit more overall to the larger groups (a general increase in the amount of hp buffed in aura) at lower levels, or it doesn't matter at all really. I agree with him on this. (I am not here to suggest tweaking the strengths of different warden levels, but to suggest a mechanic change to the warden all together so he supports phased attacks rather than spammed ones).

Quote:

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Originally Posted by NotTheRealPaul

Too much. Didn't read

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Same here:rolleyes:

OP, spam is mass troop attacks. And I don't mind mass troop attacks.

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Originally Posted by IcewolfBlizzard

Same here:rolleyes:

OP, spam is mass troop attacks. And I don't mind mass troop attacks.

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so having what is supposed to be the most interesting (and to some degree, challenging) town hall in the game be mostly attacks that take next to zero army planning (besides which troop to take 200 freaking space of), and just about the only stuff to do for it is plan where to enter (fairly easy), funnel (painfully easy for someone who has worked their way to that level), and spell timing/placement (can improvise half the time if needed and have a great chance, only can't screw up tome vs dgbs). to get an almost guaranteed high 2 or 3 (or have a chance at 3 that only luck of pathing will probably decide in the end).

would you rather see govahos, golaloons, vhghs, gohobo, or mass bowler, mass miner, mass valk, and maybe the occasional combo of 2 of them?

Your u idea is decent yet I doubt supercell would add something so complex. Something definitely needs to be done though.

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Originally Posted by JCas127

Your u idea is decent yet I doubt supercell would add something so complex. Something definitely needs to be done though.

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yeah, the problem is, the warden can't be simple, otehrwise he goes hand in hand with spam (like he does now). if nothing else I hope they add ramp up and fall off to aura on size of army inside. the recall was just an idea so he could be placed in Ks once and backend later. I feel like my idea may end up being too much, but then aura just needs to be decreased until it is fair with 2-3 phase attacks.

Just lower the radius :smirk:

Wardens ability only affects five of one troop at a time

making the radius any smaller wouldn't matter. spam armies are so tight together that the wardens radius could be 5 and he could very well still get most of em.

to ragingkoala (hi from my clan family, glad to see someone else I know on the forums) 5 is too severe. IMO 100 troop space should be the border, but the problem with this would still be a mass army, just maybe with 2 troops not 1. (maybe bova not mass bowler, maybe homi instead of mass miner...)

limiting its space altogether also wouldn't work because then warden can't decide which troops to leave out. (also in this case, which ones does he protect?)

I was thinking along the lines of:

An attacker uses 16 valks, 5 benefit from the warden (5 is a number that can be changed) the valks closest to the warden receive his buff.

An attacker hours hamm with 9 valks and eight bowlers, five valks and five bowlers receive warden benefits. Etc.

I like your idea though :)

How long you visiting your home clan?

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Originally Posted by Bman10

right now, th11 is almost exclusively spam, which is for the most part low-skill. first witches (very cautious about gbs until nerfed to the ground), then valks, then bowlers and miners. none of these strategies are even that hard to execute, funnel+spells, very little planning for stuff like traps (maybe gbs with bowlers, but tome is a get out of jail free card for that, and they can survive a single gb, unlike witches.). This is barely noticeable at th10, with some bowler and miner attacks (valk attacks often carry hogs for defense sniping, which is still a lot better in terms of skill in execution.)


Warden currently buffs a standard amount of hp to all troops in radius, with full resistance on tome.

my idea would be to make it so he offers a larger hp buff to smaller groups. his current stats would apply to 163 space in his range (heroes count as 25, himself excluded), would be his current health buff amount (as per level).

His health buff per troop and would fall as the inflection point of a logistical curve (aka the center of it where it is steepest)

His health increase per troop would follow something more similar the function 1/x.

For calculations, I am considering the hp PER HOUSING SPACE of all units averaged together.

162.5 (163 since housing spaces are integral) housing space, 50% health buff to all units (lvl 20 warden), it is, theoretically, 8150% of 1 housing space's hp.

sparing myself from plugging in values, these are the equations:

total hp increase% (relative to avg hp per housing space of all units in aura): (couldn't insert, so same as one below, but not divided by x!!!)


hp increase for all units under the aura:Attachment 181426

(First equation divided by x). Y is % hp increase, x is housing space in aura at time.

Also, tome blocks 67% dmg (2/3) from all sources, and completely blocks eagle artillery.

Warden gets a second ability, Recall (insert less horrible name here)
after using tome (and after being dropped for more than 15 seconds), warden can be picked up and returned to your hand. double tapping his pic in hand while undropped toggles him from air to ground mode. he can be re-dropped, with a new tome ability, and current health, on the edge of the map (not in red area).

Important!!! any units inside the tome one time are not buffed (or in any other way affected) by any subsequent uses of the tome, excluding the warden himself (he always gets affected by his own tome) (so tome can't be used multiple times on a horde)
This allows him to be used with a small-ish KS, then picked up and re-dropped with a backend. the 15 second delay is to ensure his tome cannot be spammed for his own defense at the very end of a raid or something.

hope you guys like this idea!!!

note!!! having trouble inserting photos of graphs cause of post size limit, can only insert equations.

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Omg you understand math better than Einstein and I totally agree with you...

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Originally Posted by RagingKoala

I was thinking along the lines of:

An attacker uses 16 valks, 5 benefit from the warden (5 is a number that can be changed) the valks closest to the warden receive his buff.

An attacker hours hamm with 9 valks and eight bowlers, five valks and five bowlers receive warden benefits. Etc.

I like your idea though :)

How long you visiting your home clan?

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not quite sure what "hours hamm" means :P

aside from this, this doesn't really solve the problem of a 1 point entry with a large troop count being able to destroy a base with the tome for anything tough, and really (the bigger problem) the aura increasing the hp of all units by a large % (50% at max)

either way, any integer as a setting (especially over how many troops can get tome) can always be argued as arbitrary, giving the community one more thing no one cares to read but still will see potentially all too often. people will whine "Oh if those other 5 troops got it instead it would have been 3 not a 95% 2!"

I feel a weaker tome (with lower resist, not less units in it) with an aura that buffs less troops more, and more troops less (with recall and new tome, strong encouraging warden to be used 2-3 times with different phases) it will make multi phased attacks much stronger, making while it will do very little to help spam attacks

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Originally Posted by LightningQuick

Omg you understand math better than Einstein and I totally agree with you...

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I did the math so SC didn't have to. the less they do, the easier it is for them to listen to my ideas :D

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Originally Posted by RagingKoala

Wardens ability only affects five of one troop at a time

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Yes I agree that the GW Life Aura only affects (buffs) 5 or so of the same troop type.

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Originally Posted by MasterCal

Yes I agree that the GW Life Aura only affects (buffs) 5 or so of the same troop type.

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this idea just won't work. the problem isn't even it being 1 troop, although there are 2 to name that are definitely broken with warden or just in general *cough*BOWLER*cough*MINER* it could still work too well to have quite a few different troop types still in one entry point, and a single number is arbitrary, and there will always be whiners crying for it to be 4 or 6. if it is more complicated, they either won't know the specifics to argue, won't try to learn them, or won't care, which will make everyone more happy in general.

the idea of him gradually giving a larger overall buff to shrinking troop area would work well for them.

ALSO AN IMPORTANT NEW IDEA!!! will add this to the original post after I'm done with this one.

as troops in the aura die to defenses, the aura will not slowly grow stronger on remaining units. if they wander out of the aura, it grows, but if they die to defenses while inside the aura, they still count towards the troops inside, so this way, the remaining troops inside of it won't slowly get a MASSIVE health increase because they are the only ones left.